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Most Marines against lifting DADT

Navy Pride

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This info from the Commandent of the Marine Corps:


President Obama considers fast appeal of judge's order allowing gays to serve openly in the military | masslive.com



The incoming Marine commandant, Gen. James Amos, and his predecessor, Gen. James Conway, both have told Congress that they think most Marines would be uncomfortable with the change and that the current policy works.



http://gate.net/article/top?guid=20101013/7bf2f249-5046-42e6-894a-da185472b63d

Defense Secretary Robert Gates warned of "enormous consequences" for troops if the court order is allowed to stand, saying the decision on repeal of the law known as "don't ask, don't tell" should be decided by Congress and not the courts.


As much as you Liberals want it to be this issue is far from a done deal..............I pray rational minds will finally prevail............
 
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Navy Pride

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You seem to have omitted a couple of words from your thread title. An honest mistake I'm sure...

I don't have a link but I heard the Commadant of the MC said the 90 to 95 percent of all Marines are against lifting the ban.........
 

disneydude

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I pray rational minds will finally prevail............

Another day....another anti-gay thread from our resident right-winger.

Rational minds will eventually prevail Navy....even in your lifetime....get ready old man....the times....they are a changin"
 

Aunt Spiker

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They would be, naturally.

But that's not the meat of the issue.
 

disneydude

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BTW Navy....neither article says anything close to what you claim they do according to the title of your thread. Nice try....but looks like once again, Navy is making stuff up.
 

Redress

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I don't have a link but I heard the Commadant of the MC said the 90 to 95 percent of all Marines are against lifting the ban.........

Except your sources make clear he is guessing....
 

cpwill

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fortunately for us, the Military Times does a poll:

The Military Times, a liberal Gannett publication favoring inclusion of professed homosexuals in the military, has just released an astonishing poll of active-duty subscribers. Results of the 2008 annual survey indicate that success for that cause essentially would destroy the volunteer force.

As in previous years, the annual Military Times Poll (linked on Drudge today) reveals that approximately 58% of respondents are opposed to efforts to repeal what the survey described as the “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell policy.” The catchphrase incorrectly labels the 1993 law, Section 654, Title 10, which clearly states that homosexuals are not eligible to be in the military.

The 2008 Military Times Poll asked a new question that produced jaw-dropping results: “If the ‘don’t ask, don’t tell’ policy is overturned and gays are allowed to serve openly, how would you respond?” The article emphasized that 71% of respondents said they would continue to serve. But almost 10% said “I would not re-enlist or extend my service,” and 14% said “I would consider not re-enlisting or extending my service.” Only 6% expressed “No Opinion.” Before voting to repeal the law, Section 654, Title 10, members of Congress, and President-elect Barack Obama, ought to do the math...

—A rough estimate using Defense Department numbers for all service branches and components, totaling more than 2 million, indicates that a loss of one in ten (almost 10%) would cost the military approximately 228,600 people — more than the active-duty Marine Corps (200,000).

—If an additional 14% decided to leave, the voluntary exodus would translate into a loss of almost 527,000 — a figure approaching the size of today’s active-duty Army (more than 545,000).

—Estimates of losses in active-duty forces alone would range between 141,000 (10%) and 323,000 (23%)...

Corollary programs to make the new policy “work” would include professional “diversity training” to enforce acceptance, and “zero tolerance” of anyone who disagrees. Dissenters would face discipline and be denied promotions, which would end their military careers. Incidents of misconduct would increase threefold, to include male/male and female/female misconduct that undermines discipline and demoralizes the troops. These results would harm recruiting and retention, and effectively destroy the volunteer force.... There is no record of any poll seeking to gauge opinions on the actual consequences of repealing the law: forced cohabitation with homosexuals in all military communities, 24/7, with “zero tolerance” of dissent....

There is no “national security” argument for repealing a law designed to protect good order and discipline in military living conditions offering little or no privacy. Federal courts have upheld the constitutionality of the statute several times, and it continues to enjoy strong support among military men and women. Regardless of what it is called, the 1993 law, Section 654, Title 10, deserves continued support.
 

DrunkenAsparagus

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I think that if they can handle being shot at, they can handle some gay guy in their unit, but hey, that's just me.
 
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This is important news, since the military is in control of civilians, not the other way around.
 

Redress

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Cpwill, it's not a current poll, and as the linked article provided by CriticalThought shows, the claim that this will somehow ruin retention is faulty.
 

disneydude

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The 2008 Military Times Poll asked a new question that produced jaw-dropping results: “If the ‘don’t ask, don’t tell’ policy is overturned and gays are allowed to serve openly, how would you respond?” The article emphasized that 71% of respondents said they would continue to serve. But almost 10% said “I would not re-enlist or extend my service,” and 14% said “I would consider not re-enlisting or extending my service.” Only 6% expressed “No Opinion.” Before voting to repeal the law, Section 654, Title 10, members of Congress, and President-elect Barack Obama, ought to do the math...

I suspect that the numbers were probably about the same or higher at the time the military ended desegration in the services.

So the military loses the 10% of the forces that are bigots, racists and homophobes....thats a GOOD thing. The military will be better and stronger without the "costs" that those fools bring to it.
 

Aunt Spiker

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I think that if they can handle being shot at, they can handle some gay guy in their unit, but hey, that's just me.

Being shot at and engaging in warfare is alpha-male-esque. Being near one who is gay isn't.

Somehow numbers of men became convinced that gay is contagious and they'll catch it by breathing the air.

Sounds like the basis for psychological warfare to me - like the Ace or nailed boots. If our soldiers weren't so anti-homosexual then I'd see them being able to exploit it on the battle field - everyone wear a little bit of lipstick, freak out the infidels. . . maybe some eye-shadow.
 

TacticalEvilDan

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The incoming Marine commandant, Gen. James Amos, and his predecessor, Gen. James Conway, both have told Congress that they think most Marines would be uncomfortable with the change and that the current policy works.

I wonder why the incoming Marine commandant thinks that most of his subordinates are such bigots that their prejudices will overcome their professionalism and their training.
 

TacticalEvilDan

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This is important news, since the military is in control of civilians, not the other way around.

Don't forget, Obama needs the support of the military in order to do stuff.

Because, apparently, it's not about following orders, it's about appeasing the people who have the guns.
 

cpwill

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Cpwill, it's not a current poll, and as the linked article provided by CriticalThought shows, the claim that this will somehow ruin retention is faulty.

it won't ruin retention; it will hurt retention. just as lifting DADT won't ruin good order, discipline, and unit cohesion, it will merely hurt these things.
 
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cpwill

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This is important news, since the military is in control of civilians, not the other way around.

oh to be sure if ordered to stop enforcing DADT that's what we wil do; the commandant made that point in his inerview. however, it's a good point to make that the community most likely to have to deal with the issues this would raise - and the most knowledgeable about what those issues are - are the least likely to support doing so, while those least likely to know are most likely to support repeal.
 

Ned Racine

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I wonder why the incoming Marine commandant thinks that most of his subordinates are such bigots that their prejudices will overcome their professionalism and their training.


One doesn't have to be a Bigot to be uncomfortable and the use of the term "Bigot" by Gays in response to all those even mildly disagreeing with them is indicitive of fuiture problems no matter how this question is resolved.
 

TacticalEvilDan

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One doesn't have to be a Bigot to be uncomfortable

If you are uncomfortable working with someone simply because they are gay, and not because of how they conduct themselves in their work, you are a bigot.

and the use of the term "Bigot" by Gays in response to all those even mildly disagreeing with them is indicitive of fuiture problems no matter how this question is resolved.

I'm not gay, and I still use the term bigot. Because it's accurate.
 

cpwill

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that seems to be a left wing mantra: diversity in everything except thought.
 

Ned Racine

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Let's compose a Bar Graph in our heads.

First Line is those who Openly say they are Gay and who vehemently disagree with any and all criticism of the Gay agenda.

Second Line are those seemingly Progressive who are All for the Gay Agenda, but who are presumably Straight.

Third Line is those who are truthfully not Gay but are genuinly tolerant , but don't want radical change in the society

Fourth Line are those Openly hostile to all things even remotely Gay.

Which line is longer in Real Life(??)

Which Line contains the most Liars (??)
 

TacticalEvilDan

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that seems to be a left wing mantra: diversity in everything except thought.

Right, whereas blatant mis-characterization seems to be a practice long enjoyed by both sides.

I never said it should be illegal to be a bigot, just that it's wrong. I've got as much right to call a bigot a bigot as any fan of Leviticus has to wave signs saying "GOD HATES GAYS."
 

disneydude

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Let's compose a Bar Graph in our heads.

First Line is those who Openly say they are Gay and who vehemently disagree with any and all criticism of the Gay agenda.

Second Line are those seemingly Progressive who are All for the Gay Agenda, but who are presumably Straight.

Third Line is those who are truthfully not Gay but are genuinly tolerant , but don't want radical change in the society

Fourth Line are those Openly hostile to all things even remotely Gay.

Which line is longer in Real Life(??)

Which Line contains the most Liars (??)

WTF is the gay "agenda"? Puh-lease.....most gay people just want the same rights that every other citizen in this country has. So I guess if freedom and equality is the gay "Agenda" you are talking about.....count me in as one who will fight hard for it.
 
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