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Loss. Life's greatest lesson.



Say, say, say, why are you looking for the was,
I find you scheming on that plane, that I'm not thinking of
Say, say, say I bet you found another love or even
Found another something not to tell me
Now I feel sorry for the things that I've said...
Now I feel sorry for the ways I might have held you down...
Now I feel sorry for the rest of my life.
Cause what comes around, goes around...
( chorus )
Cause I like the way you change your look.
I like the ways you change your style
I like the way you talk about nothing
and make it worth your while
No, no, no, I will not miss you when you're gone
I think I'll have to find another word that turns that emotion on.
You, you make it so diffucult to try
If you're not dreaming when you lie
I guess you'll teach me
Now I feel sorry for the me's that are you's
Now I feel sorry for the times you tried to tell me why..
I'll kill you softly for the rest of my life
Unless you and I see eye to eye
( chorus ) x2
Why do I keep so much pressure underlined
It makes me feel for everything
that decides to pass me by.
Only you see something special in my eyes
She tells me its wrong for me to cry
about almost everything
I feel so sorry for the ones that don't care
I feel so sorry there are reasons some will never know
I guess I'll see you for the rest of my life
But that's what the sun shines for...
( chorus )
 
lizzie said:
That is true to a certain extent, and then there are cases of people who become lost in their grief, and cannot seem to deal with it effectively (that is referred to as "complicated grief"). I don't think it's necessarily that these people aren't strong, good, or decent, but that they just don't know how to cope with the emotional storm which they find themselves in the midst of. Based on interactions I have had with grievers, and it seems that often, people who have had a devastating loss are just so overwhelmed, that they can't function. It isn't a reflection of their decency or goodness, but it seems to indicate that they can't find solid ground and resolve the many conflicts which seem to be a part of losing someone who is essentially a part of their being. Losing someone who is an intricate part of your self-identity is like having an amputation without your consent. It is difficult to rebuild that scarred and bloody self-image.
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I'll steal Maggie's line here - it says it best - "You can never get your old life back. We have to learn to make new ones."
 
MaggieD said:
After my husband died, I think I would have married in a heartbeat if anywhere CLOSE to the right guy happened by. Of course, I wasn't dating, so the odds were . . . none. Ha! But I so desperately wanted my "old life" back that I would have been on a collision course to make the biggest mistake of my life.

You can never get your old life back. We have to learn to make new ones. ;)
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I would be inclined to agree with this statement. There was a period where I had nobody (most of the friends I have now are very recently acquired) and I was nothing but sad. When one's entire existence, self, past, present, future, and possibilities are all bathed in pain and loss, it sucks (since I had to deal with multiple tragedies at the same time this year, while pretty much alone)! While it is easy to keep moving, in that state, its nearly impossible to pick a suitable direction without a lot of trial and error.

The life that seems to be emerging appears to be better than what I may have ever had, for various reasons. Maybe the primary one is that I am no longer willing to compromise some things and another ones is I was able to find interests that seem to be well embedded in American culture, which allows me to always find a way to enjoy them no matter what else may be going on (a little bit of future insurance, hopefully). The future, I hope, is to be one of balance between myself and my interests, my duties, and my relationships.

Its the reason I am unhappy with my dwelling on stuff. But I think as new stuff becomes more solid in my life and my routine also solidifies, that feeling will fade on its own. Just need something to keep my attention. It gets better every day and hell, this entire month is booked with positive and healthy activities.

I have to say though, this has been the hardest year of my life so far. I am honestly shocked that I am recovering as quickly as I am and I have a good perspective given everything.
 
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NoC_T said:
Man, what a depressing thread. ****.
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OK here's a positive tragedy story. Twenty years ago or so I was in a bad motorcycle wreck that broke my back and other assorted bones. In the ER they were sticking pins in my legs with no results but when the swelling went down I was OK. WHEW! After nearly a year healing up I was declared permanently disabled, can't stand long periods or sit long periods or do heavy lifting the doc said. I decided to go into real estate because realtors don't do anything really or so I thought. Anyway I learned a lot that year and ended up buying houses to rent which have since been paid off by renters and sold for a very nice profit. If not for my accident I never would have done that and been semi retired at 60. Best part is I got way better than the docs thought I would and I was back to my normal occupation after one year in the office. One day when I had the floor my broker says to me, "Sawyer you are pacing back and forth in here like a caged animal," I knew it was time to go, she was right.
 
CanadaJohn said:
I'll steal Maggie's line here - it says it best - "You can never get your old life back. We have to learn to make new ones."
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My point being that having difficulty doing so does not indicate that the individual is not good or decent.
 
MaggieD said:
Few people "get it" until they have experienced a devastating loss. It could be the death of a loved one...divorce...poor health...business failure...an irrevocable decision...even loss of a job.

A monumental loss knocks the pins right out from under you. Everything you thought you knew about life - about yourself - about who you really are? Dissolves. Crumbles around you.

What you do after that devastating loss defines who you are as a person for the rest of your life.

Have you learned the lesson? What was your loss? How long did it take you to recover?
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When I was 16 I started dating my dream girl. I lost my virginity to her. At the time, she was everything I could ask for. It was the first real relationship I'd had where there was actually an emotional connection. We saw each other nearly ever other day. Her parents loved me. Her and I never had real fights. It was a great time in my life. 26 days from our 1 year anniversary she cheated on me with a good friend of mine at her prom. ( She was a senior, I was a sophomore and we went to different schools). I had been cheated on more other than not before this so I quickly broke things off, then shut her out. Of course after a little under a week I'm having second thoughts trying to get a hold of her with no success. Finally I call her father trying to reach her. He tells me she's gone. She took his Opana. He proceeded to scream at me saying he blames me. Then her family decides I'm not going to the funeral. This fu**ed me up really almost permanently, although it gets easier to ignore it as time goes by. I have to dodge it because I can't find a way to explain it in my head, and I have a lot guilt I simply chose not to deal with.
 
sbrettt said:
When I was 16 I started dating my dream girl. I lost my virginity to her. At the time, she was everything I could ask for. It was the first real relationship I'd had where there was actually an emotional connection. We saw each other nearly ever other day. Her parents loved me. Her and I never had real fights. It was a great time in my life. 26 days from our 1 year anniversary she cheated on me with a good friend of mine at her prom. ( She was a senior, I was a sophomore and we went to different schools). I had been cheated on more other than not before this so I quickly broke things off, then shut her out. Of course after a little under a week I'm having second thoughts trying to get a hold of her with no success. Finally I call her father trying to reach her. He tells me she's gone. She took his Opana. He proceeded to scream at me saying he blames me. Then her family decides I'm not going to the funeral. This fu**ed me up really almost permanently, although it gets easier to ignore it as time goes by. I have to dodge it because I can't find a way to explain it in my head, and I have a lot guilt I simply chose not to deal with.
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I'm sorry that happened to you. And even sorrier that you bought what her dad was selling. He had to be mad at someone. You were the closest and least-destructive (from his standpoint) to blame. I hope you've grown (matured) enough to realize that someone's suicide/car accident when angry/whatever is NEVER anyone else's fault -- unless they're chasing them with a gun.

Buck up, Bucky. Believe those who care about you that it was NOT your fault, was NEVER your fault, never WILL be your fault. **** happens.
 
sbrettt said:
When I was 16 I started dating my dream girl. I lost my virginity to her. At the time, she was everything I could ask for. It was the first real relationship I'd had where there was actually an emotional connection. We saw each other nearly ever other day. Her parents loved me. Her and I never had real fights. It was a great time in my life. 26 days from our 1 year anniversary she cheated on me with a good friend of mine at her prom. ( She was a senior, I was a sophomore and we went to different schools). I had been cheated on more other than not before this so I quickly broke things off, then shut her out. Of course after a little under a week I'm having second thoughts trying to get a hold of her with no success. Finally I call her father trying to reach her. He tells me she's gone. She took his Opana. He proceeded to scream at me saying he blames me. Then her family decides I'm not going to the funeral. This fu**ed me up really almost permanently, although it gets easier to ignore it as time goes by. I have to dodge it because I can't find a way to explain it in my head, and I have a lot guilt I simply chose not to deal with.
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Please please please don't blame yourself. It's natural to do that, for many of us, regardless of the method of death. I tried to blame myself for the deaths of both my son and my husband. The reason we do it is because we so desperately want to feel like we had some sort of control over the situation, and if we try to blame ourselves, it somehow satisfies that need, but it's not the truth. People make choices, and sometimes the result of that choice is irreversible. It is not your fault that she did that. It is hers, and hers alone. No matter what led up to it, and how her father tried to deal with it, she is the one who made that choice.
 


Came in from a rainy Thursday
On the avenue
Thought I heard you talking softly

I turned on the lights, the TV
And the radio
Still I can't escape the ghost of you

What has happened to it all?
Crazy, some'd say
Where is the life that I recognize?
Gone away

But I won't cry for yesterday
There's an ordinary world
Somehow I have to find
And as I try to make my way
To the ordinary world
I will learn to survive

Passion or coincidence
Once prompted you to say
"Pride will tear us both apart"
Well now pride's gone out the window
Cross the rooftops
Run away
Left me in the vacuum of my heart

What is happening to me?
Crazy, some'd say
Where is my friend when I need you most?
Gone away

But I won't cry for yesterday
There's an ordinary world
Somehow I have to find
And as I try to make my way
To the ordinary world
I will learn to survive

Papers in the roadside
Tell of suffering and greed
Here today, forgot tomorrow
Ooh, here besides the news
Of holy war and holy need
Ours is just a little sorrowed talk

And I don't cry for yesterday
There's an ordinary world
Somehow I have to find
And as I try to make my way
To the ordinary world
I will learn to survive

Every one
Is my world, I will learn to survive
Any one
Is my world, I will learn to survive
Any one
Is my world
Every one
Is my world
 
MaggieD said:
Few people "get it" until they have experienced a devastating loss. It could be the death of a loved one...divorce...poor health...business failure...an irrevocable decision...even loss of a job.

A monumental loss knocks the pins right out from under you. Everything you thought you knew about life - about yourself - about who you really are? Dissolves. Crumbles around you.

What you do after that devastating loss defines who you are as a person for the rest of your life.

Have you learned the lesson? What was your loss? How long did it take you to recover?
Click to expand...
Lost my parents in my early 20s. No other family to speak of. And none within a thousand miles. Get over it? Not yet.
 
CRUE CAB said:
Lost my parents in my early 20s. No other family to speak of. And none within a thousand miles. Get over it? Not yet.
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Lost em did you check the lost n found? :tongue4:
I think sbrettt holds the record so far in this thread keep them stories coming
 
My father died 3 years ago. I'm still not over it. He was a musician, and my adult daughter listens to his CDs for peace. If I tried to listen to any of his CDs, it'd be all over for me. I don't have his pictures up, either. I have one tiny one, but I can't look at it. I go for weeks now without crying, and then I see somebody that reminds me of him, and it's all over. I saw someone last year in the DMV that looked like him, stood like him, dressed like him. Had that little dunlap over his belt, just like my dad. I started crying, right in the middle of the DMV. Everybody there looked at me like I had a third eye.

I hadn't spoken to my Dad when he died for several months. He was angry with me, and I have to live with that.
 
CanadaJohn said:
Good, decent people become as strong as the challenges placed before them - to do otherwise is to do less than you're capable of.
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Not sure about that. I've had a few of these problems. Each one is so different. Right now, one of my closest friends was moved by her conservator to a different facility. I've contacted the office 3x but no one responds. Her cousin has called and unless he was told by the conservator to keep his mouth shut, does not seem to know either. This is not good because she is a vulnerable person who needs social contact. Her elderly aunt calls me, told the conservator office but seems they could not care less. A conservator's duty is the health and safety of the charge, but I don't see that here.

It's starting to appear that they don't want me to visit her but will not come out and say so. A couple months back she was in the hospital. Her friend and I called but were told she was not there but turned out she was there all along. The conservator's office is weird. They know I'm a good friend for her, am only person who visits regularly, alerted them to problems staff were unaware of and now this. Weird don't you think?
 
Glowpun said:
Not sure about that. I've had a few of these problems. Each one is so different. Right now, one of my closest friends was moved by her conservator to a different facility. I've contacted the office 3x but no one responds. Her cousin has called and unless he was told by the conservator to keep his mouth shut, does not seem to know either. This is not good because she is a vulnerable person who needs social contact. Her elderly aunt calls me, told the conservator office but seems they could not care less. A conservator's duty is the health and safety of the charge, but I don't see that here.

It's starting to appear that they don't want me to visit her but will not come out and say so. A couple months back she was in the hospital. Her friend and I called but were told she was not there but turned out she was there all along. The conservator's office is weird. They know I'm a good friend for her, am only person who visits regularly, alerted them to problems staff were unaware of and now this. Weird don't you think?
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Things we don't understand often seem weird until we get an explanation or find out why. I'd say from your comments that you are showing strength of character by persisting in your goal to help your friend, no matter how many obstacles are put in your way. To refer back to my comments, you seem like a "good and decent" friend trying to do what you feel is best for your friend, and you're not giving up - that's what I was referring to.
 
Superfly said:
My father died 3 years ago. I'm still not over it. He was a musician, and my adult daughter listens to his CDs for peace. If I tried to listen to any of his CDs, it'd be all over for me. I don't have his pictures up, either. I have one tiny one, but I can't look at it. I go for weeks now without crying, and then I see somebody that reminds me of him, and it's all over. I saw someone last year in the DMV that looked like him, stood like him, dressed like him. Had that little dunlap over his belt, just like my dad. I started crying, right in the middle of the DMV. Everybody there looked at me like I had a third eye.

I hadn't spoken to my Dad when he died for several months. He was angry with me, and I have to live with that.
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You remind me a lot of a friend I have that lost her dad about a year and a half ago. Even though she's tried to accept it and "move on", I know she's still sad. If we go to a movie, even a comedy, that shows a relationship between a dad and his daughter, it makes her cry. I'm thinking of maybe suggesting grief counseling to her. Have you ever tried that? (totally understand if you tell me that it's none of my business).
 
X Factor said:
You remind me a lot of a friend I have that lost her dad about a year and a half ago. Even though she's tried to accept it and "move on", I know she's still sad. If we go to a movie, even a comedy, that shows a relationship between a dad and his daughter, it makes her cry. I'm thinking of maybe suggesting grief counseling to her. Have you ever tried that? (totally understand if you tell me that it's none of my business).
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Thanks, X. I would never tell you it's none of your business. Kind of made it everybody's business when I put this out there. :) And yeah, I've thought about counseling but I don't know how it will help. So much has happened as a result of my father dying. The entire family has shut down. So much hurt. My sister told everyone it was my fault, and didn't even want me to be called when he had the heart attack. When I got to Mom's, she acted like nothing was wrong, so I found out about all this after we buried him and I came back home. She didn't even put my name on the Thank You cards that went out to family and friends who brought flowers to the funeral. She put her name, my Mom's and my brothers. I only found out because my ex Mother in law got a card, and my daughter saw it and said, "When did you stop being a part of the family?" She is telling everyone I killed him, my mother is telling everyone my husband killed him, because they had an argument about 7 months before Dad died. :roll: The whole family has gone tits up. I haven't seen my sister since we buried Dad, and don't care if I ever do again. I've seen my Mom once. It's just messed up. The whole situation.
 
Superfly said:
I saw someone last year in the DMV that looked like him, stood like him, dressed like him. Had that little dunlap over his belt, just like my dad. I started crying, right in the middle of the DMV. Everybody there looked at me like I had a third eye.

I hadn't spoken to my Dad when he died for several months. He was angry with me, and I have to live with that.
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Superfly!! Several months after my dad died, I saw someone who looked "just like" my dad in healthier days. Honestly, I couldn't stop staring at him. Although I knew they could not possibly be related, I could not help myself from going over and introducing myself to him. Told him who he reminded me of, asked his last name, where he was from. I'm sure the guy thought I was a nutcase. But this guy was the same height/weight, dressed the way my dad dressed; it was damned eerie. I feel ya'.

Re your last line, I think the grief process is hindered when we feel guilty. We sabotage our our little selves. I've forgiven myself for many things throughout my life. We do the best we can at the time. You're a good person. He was probably a good person too. People argue. People build resentments. But we do the best we can with what we have. And there should be no guilt in that. *hugs*
 
MaggieD said:
Superfly!! Several months after my dad died, I saw someone who looked "just like" my dad in healthier days. Honestly, I couldn't stop staring at him. Although I knew they could not possibly be related, I could not help myself from going over and introducing myself to him. Told him who he reminded me of, asked his last name, where he was from. I'm sure the guy thought I was a nutcase. But this guy was the same height/weight, dressed the way my dad dressed; it was damned eerie. I feel ya'.

Re your last line, I think the grief process is hindered when we feel guilty. We sabotage our our little selves. I've forgiven myself for many things throughout my life. We do the best we can at the time. You're a good person. He was probably a good person too. People argue. People build resentments. But we do the best we can with what we have. And there should be no guilt in that. *hugs*
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In the DMV, I kept looking at him, and actually (I know this sounds weird) I wanted to go up and just hug him. I just wanted to know if it felt the same. Of course, I'd never do that, but I couldn't get it out of my head.

And my Dad was a very good person, and he and my husband talked through the argument, and my husband apologized for some things he said, and they made up. My mother and sister wont' get past it though, and they just keep on and on and on. You hear the bad stuff long enough, you start to believe it. :shrug:
 
X Factor said:
You remind me a lot of a friend I have that lost her dad about a year and a half ago. Even though she's tried to accept it and "move on", I know she's still sad. If we go to a movie, even a comedy, that shows a relationship between a dad and his daughter, it makes her cry. I'm thinking of maybe suggesting grief counseling to her. Have you ever tried that? (totally understand if you tell me that it's none of my business).
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I lost my father 2 years ago, and I still cry from time to time, so what you are seeing may be completely normal. When my mom gave me a picture of my dad holding me when I was a baby, as a gift last Christmas, the tears flowed. I'd say that a good gauge for whether or not she needs counseling is if her grief is interfering in her day to day life, such as depression that is keeping her from living a satisfying life, or anxiety that is interfering in her ability to perform routine tasks. Also, if she's having physical symptoms of illness that have no physical basis, it could be that her grief is complicated. Occasional crying as a result of a touching scene in a movie is probably a normal response to grief, and it it's just occasional, I wouldn't tend to worry about it.
 
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