Which Ammedment Is The Most Important?

[obvious Child]

It is relevant. Small arms have pushed back and nearly defeated a larger more powerful force many times in history. Ours included.

That's not accurate. Cannons are hardly "small arms" neither are the French ships of the line that did battle with the British on our behalf. Remember that we lost most of the rifle based battles. What we did do was grind down the British to the point where the expenditures and loss of life wasn't worth their time anymore and they saw bigger threats coming up on the horizon. The amount of British forces we actually fought were a tiny portion of the total British military at the time. Ultimately, the revolutionary war was just a blimp of the conflicts the Crown was getting into and foresaw at the time. To say small arms defeated the British is very ignorant of the actual conflict and what was happening on the European continent.

Remember that Revolution we had? Beat back the British, twice.

We also lost battle after battle after battle. The introduction of the French navy hardly constitutes "small arms" nor were the massive war materials including cannons they sent us "small arms."

Even the South was not soundly defeated in the civil war.

That depends how you define "soundly." There were small pockets of rebellion, but the South's military infrastructure was destroyed. Sherman is still hated down there by some. The southern militias who refused to accept the end of the war posed no threat to the country nor were they ever able to restart the war.

And its more than just guns that can be brought to bear against the US military, its also thousands of vets that will bring years if not decades of experience with them on top of defectors that will not fire on their countrymen.

It's still funny how you grasp to insane beliefs that the US military will actually fire on its own civilians. What world do you live in?

Seriously, you've lost this argument soundly. Every point you bring up I show I have vastly superior knowledge.

The first amendment is still the most important. Information is power. The pen is mightier than the sword. Without communication, spreading ideas and overall freedom of speech, a militant is limited to acts of terrorism. To overthrow a regime, you need way more than acts of terrorism. Again, why do you think the Arab regimes quickly cut internet and telecom access during the Arab Spring? Because information is power. Why do you think North Korea limits information to its people so dramatically? Because information is power. Why do you think that Putin is actively trying to curtail free speech? Because information is power. The freedom of speech and thus ideas is absolutely fundamental to a free society. Without it, none of our other amendments actually matter.

 

[CRUE CAB]

That's not accurate. Cannons are hardly "small arms" neither are the French ships of the line that did battle with the British on our behalf. Remember that we lost most of the rifle based battles. What we did do was grind down the British to the point where the expenditures and loss of life wasn't worth their time anymore and they saw bigger threats coming up on the horizon. The amount of British forces we actually fought were a tiny portion of the total British military at the time. Ultimately, the revolutionary war was just a blimp of the conflicts the Crown was getting into and foresaw at the time. To say small arms defeated the British is very ignorant of the actual conflict and what was happening on the European continent.



We also lost battle after battle after battle. The introduction of the French navy hardly constitutes "small arms" nor were the massive war materials including cannons they sent us "small arms."



That depends how you define "soundly." There were small pockets of rebellion, but the South's military infrastructure was destroyed. Sherman is still hated down there by some. The southern militias who refused to accept the end of the war posed no threat to the country nor were they ever able to restart the war.



It's still funny how you grasp to insane beliefs that the US military will actually fire on its own civilians. What world do you live in?

Seriously, you've lost this argument soundly. Every point you bring up I show I have vastly superior knowledge.

The first amendment is still the most important. Information is power. The pen is mightier than the sword. Without communication, spreading ideas and overall freedom of speech, a militant is limited to acts of terrorism. To overthrow a regime, you need way more than acts of terrorism. Again, why do you think the Arab regimes quickly cut internet and telecom access during the Arab Spring? Because information is power. Why do you think North Korea limits information to its people so dramatically? Because information is power. Why do you think that Putin is actively trying to curtail free speech? Because information is power. The freedom of speech and thus ideas is absolutely fundamental to a free society. Without it, none of our other amendments actually matter.

You funny.
We may have lost battle after battle. We won the war. And who is to say there wont be help from a military force. But you fail to realize this is not 1776.
The US gun owner is vastly better armed then his 1776 counter part.
You dont think the US military has plans of attack in the advent of domestic discharge of duty?
Wake up.

 

[obvious Child]

You funny.

What's funny is you think you're actually winning this.

We may have lost battle after battle. We won the war

And we did so when non-small arms entered the battle, we got training from the French and more war material from the French. The César, a French 74 gun ship of the line that fought the British during the Revolutionary war is not "a small arm."

And who is to say there wont be help from a military force. But you fail to realize this is not 1776.
The US gun owner is vastly better armed then his 1776 counter part.

And the US military is vastly better armed than the British in 1776. The difference now is the differential is way bigger than before. The US military can launch a single plane armed with cluster bombs to decimate entire city blocks. That said, it's not going to happen.

You dont think the US military has plans of attack in the advent of domestic discharge of duty?
Wake up.

The US military has plans for everything. Doesn't mean that they will get enacted or that soldiers will follow through. It's amazing just how little respect you have for the military. The US military is not full of mindless drones who will do anything their commanders say.

You haven't even tried to explain how information isn't the key to everything. And you've run away from every example that shows how nations who are totalitarian or under revolt from their own people first cut off all communications.

 

[TurtleDude]

The sixteenth amendment because it is the only thing keeping this country out of complete corporate feudalism.

that is the most idiotic thing I have seen in several weeks on this forum

 

[keith]

Given the current interpretation of the equal protection clause of the 14th Amendment I would argue the 19th Amendment is no longer needed.

 

[Grendel]

The Second Amendment is the most important, because without out it there is no way to defend the others.

The First Amendment is the second most important, because without it the best ideas could be threatened.

The first is the 1st most important, because it prevents the need for the second from arising. The second is only necessary when the first fails. And, as has been pointed out, without the first, the people in power can very adeptly control what the population thinks, preventing them from ever rising to the cause to employ those weapons in the first place.

The value of the Second Amendment is that a breakdown of society would be extremely bloody. It just raises the stakes of failure.

 

[michijo]

I almost completely ignore public displays of freedom of speech. People standing around with signs, for just one second attempting to pull the heart strings of strangers, playing a guitar, holding a sign, singing a song, trying to convince you of their religion, to me its all so useless. More and more I am closed to it and made a sort of deal with myself: I ignore everyone's freedom of speech and I also don't use my own freedom of speech. Its sort of a good deal. Ignore everyone.

 

[lawboy]

The 4th is the most important. Without it police could jail you for any reason at any time.

At one time in this country it did not offend the 4th AM to take a person in for questioning against his will (emphasis added) even when not under arrest, now it is forbidden.

Also at one time police could arrest you in your home without a warrant, not talking about exigency now.

 

[Dittohead not!]

I'm not sure about most important, they're all important after all, but the most endangered is the fifth:

Amendment V

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

The last part, "nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation", went out the window several years ago with the passing of asset forfeiture laws, and has further been stomped on with indefinite detention without trial.

Gone, eroded away, forgotten. What's next?

 

[AmazingMeg]

The most important Amendment is the one I've written below that needs to become an amendment.

Congress shall pass no law that they do not follow themselves. Congress shall be limited to serve 12 years in Congress be it in the House or Senate, and may not switch. Citizens are allowed to impeach a member of Congress at any time simply by popular vote alone.

 

[TurtleDude]

The most important Amendment is the one I've written below that needs to become an amendment.

Congress shall pass no law that they do not follow themselves. Congress shall be limited to serve 12 years in Congress be it in the House or Senate, and may not switch. Citizens are allowed to impeach a member of Congress at any time simply by popular vote alone.

that is a suggestion of Dr Walter Williams

Congress shall make no law that is not applicable to congress

 

[AmazingMeg]

Yep, a doctor will take credit for it but I'm sure some guy driving home in his truck with his colleague probably was talking about the same thing but doesn't get credit.

 

[El Rondo]

The Bill of Right and particularly the 1st, 2nd, 4th, and 5th.

 

[Phil_Osophy]

The second, for sure. Without the second, there is no way to defend the rest. Without the second, the government has the monopoly on force.

 

[PirateMk1]

Which is the most important spoke in a wheel?

That's a good answer and if you don't mind I intend to uhmm borrow it.

 

[PirateMk1]

All other amendments rest upon the first. Without the capacity for free speech, ideas and information can be controlled. Once you control the flow of information, you can control everything else.

"Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master." - Commissioner Pravin Lal

Harsaws answer is the correct answer. The first amendment cannot exist without the second and visa versa. They are all equally important. The amendments we have are interdependent with one another to help protect us and our sovereign rights.

 

[PirateMk1]

Incorrect. Without the free flow of information, the right to bear arms becomes irrelevant because what people think and believe becomes controlled by those who control the information. The right to bear arms only matters when you have differences of beliefs. Once information is controlled, what you believe can be bent to what those in power want and in time, your beliefs resemble what they want you to believe.

Again, this quote comes to mind:

"Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master." - Commissioner Pravin Lal

Violence is just a method. Information is real power.

Information is NOT power. It is key to wielding power effectively, but in and of itself not power. Information is like a transmission on a car or gears in another devise, it multiplies the EFFECTIVENESS of the application of power.

A small motor with the proper gearing can move a load as effectively as large motor with little to no gearing.
I liken it to a man with much information and a little power can be as effective as a man with little information and a lot of power.

 

[Dittohead not!]

Information is NOT power. It is key to wielding power effectively, but in and of itself not power. Information is like a transmission on a car or gears in another devise, it multiplies the EFFECTIVENESS of the application of power.

A small motor with the proper gearing can move a load as effectively as large motor with little to no gearing.
I liken it to a man with much information and a little power can be as effective as a man with little information and a lot of power.

A man with little information and a lot of power is a danger to himself and others.

 

[PirateMk1]

A man with little information and a lot of power is a danger to himself and others.

Very true. But there has always been a certain effectiveness to brute strength. If you have a lot of power you can get by without as much knowledge. Its better to have knowledge though, as it makes whatever power you have more effective.

 

[Harshaw]

That's a good answer and if you don't mind I intend to uhmm borrow it.

I claim no copyright on it.

 

[LaMidRighter]

Very true. But there has always been a certain effectiveness to brute strength. If you have a lot of power you can get by without as much knowledge. Its better to have knowledge though, as it makes whatever power you have more effective.

But when you have brute strength and superior knowledge there is no chance of failure.

 

[Hard Truth]

All other amendments rest upon the first. Without the capacity for free speech, ideas and information can be controlled. Once you control the flow of information, you can control everything else.

"Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master." - Commissioner Pravin Lal

With the right to publicly advocate, speak out and protest, the people can advocate for all of their other rights and needs. Without that right, the people have no power.

 

[PirateMk1]

But when you have brute strength and superior knowledge there is no chance of failure.

:lamo There's always a chance failure friend always. Superior knowledge just helps stack the deck in your favor.

 

[LaMidRighter]

:lamo There's always a chance failure friend always. Superior knowledge just helps stack the deck in your favor.

Fair enough, but anyone who can play devil's advocate against their own plans will have their opponents tactics beaten before the battle starts.

EDIT - However there is no such thing as idiot proof, life keeps presenting better idiots it seems. :mrgreen:

 

[Dittohead not!]

But when you have brute strength and superior knowledge there is no chance of failure.

provided what you know is actually true.