Transgender Woman Arrested for Taking Pictures in Target Changing Room

[calamity]

Ah yes because they would know for sure that a male looking person is actually a transgender. Hell if we are worried cis males dress in "female" clothes and pretend to be trans, why not the easier route of just walking in, in "male" clothes, and claiming to be a FtM? Especially in a state like NC, where they are saying that a fully transitioned FtM has to use the female restroom?

Sure. See. There is no reason to flip reality on its head. Just leave everything as is. I still can't figure out why guys in dresses can't just use the guys' John. We have stalls, if they insist on sitting whilst they pee.

 

[Dragonfly]

I thought things like this weren't supposed to happen.

Oh please. :roll:

Murder is not supposed to happen. Rape is not supposed to happen. Assault it not supposed to happen.

Even when there's capital punishment for doing something you're not supposed to do, does that actually stop/prevent it from happening?

Your faux outrage is noted. :roll:

 

[calamity]

The average height of a man is only a couple inches different than the average height of a woman. Therefore your first descriptor was an "exception" from the beginning since the majority of transgender women would only be statistically within a couple inches of most cisgender women, not 6 ft 3 in tall as you describe.

How is the less than 10% of sexual predators being unknown to their victims and even then a far smaller percent of those willing to attack in public, not the exception?

How exactly are the other two exceptions? There are more examples of transgender men and women going to the restroom unnoticed than those that get noticed and very few instances of anyone raising an alarm over this when they are noticed. The same for using fitting rooms.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Let's see if that's true.

U.S. [men] 175.9 cm (5 ft 9 1/2 in) [women] 162.1 cm (5 ft 4 in)

Height Chart of Men and Women in Different Countries

I guess that would be true if you defined a 5-1/2 inch difference as "only a couple inches." I call it 1/2 a foot. :lol:


What's more, you'd be hard pressed to find men who are 5'4" tall. And, since that is the average height of women, there are plenty of females who are probably 5'0" or less. You only find men of that size on Hunger Games.

 

[roguenuke]

Let's see if that's true.

I guess that would be true if you defined a 5-1/2 inch difference as "only a couple inches." I call it 1/2 a foot. :lol:

What's more, you'd be hard pressed to find men who are 5'4" tall. And, since that is the average height of women, there are plenty of females who are probably 5'0" or less. You only find men of that size on Hunger Games.

So I was wrong and going off of earlier knowledge (I definitely do not see that many women who are shorter than I am). I'm not that tall. But I do have a sister who is the same height as my husband, at 5'9".

I know a man who is under 5'4" (we thought it was absolutely adorable when he danced with my sister who is only 5'1", they looked about 12, dancing in the middle of a lot taller people). I know several men who are shorter than me, at 5'6" (one made Chief when I did, and there were only 5 of us, 4 guys and me). In reality, we should be looking at most common heights or height range for men and women, not average heights.

Less than 20% of men are over 6 feet tall. There is a much higher likelihood that a transgender woman would be under 6 feet than over 6 feet tall, particularly 6'3" as in your first example.

Average height for men, height and weight chart

So you still started out with the exception. And there are lots of women out there who are 5'7", 5'8", 5'9" and even 5'10", just as many men are of these heights as well.

And it doesn't change the fact that all three things you mentioned were still exceptions, not any sort of rule. Having a guy, man, or transgender woman who is over 6 feet tall would be an exception, not the normal. Feeling uncomfortable about having someone you believe is of the opposite sex using the restroom near you or changing near you is the exception not the norm. Being attacked or even just videotaped by a stranger while using a public restroom or fitting room (particularly one in a store doing any sort of regular business) is the exception, not any sort of rule or normal.

 

[maquiscat]

Sure. See. There is no reason to flip reality on its head. Just leave everything as is. I still can't figure out why guys in dresses can't just use the guys' John. We have stalls, if they insist on sitting whilst they pee.

You still haven't addressed the person with the beard and in jeans and in men's clothing who was born with a vagina who looks nothing like a female, but whom you wish to make use the women's restroom, even if it makes cis women uncomfortable.

 

[calamity]

You still haven't addressed the person with the beard and in jeans and in men's clothing who was born with a vagina who looks nothing like a female, but whom you wish to make use the women's restroom, even if it makes cis women uncomfortable.

I responded to that when HJ asked. I stated that the women I know are not intimidated by real women who happen to look like men.

1. They are not a 6'3" tall hulk in a dress
2. They are not known to be sexual predators like men tend to be: 90% of all sexual violence is perpetrated by males.
3. They are women

 

[roughdraft274]

Transgender Woman Arrested for Taking Pictures in Target Changing Room : snopes.com

I thought things like this weren't supposed to happen. In fact, I pretty much believed they wouldn't and said so several times but, if you look at the picture of the person at the link, he does not look female at all or look like he's even trying so is he really trans or just saying so to take a few pics? It also bothers me that the suggestion that something was only done about this because it occurred in a dressing room, not a bathroom and therefore was not subject to Target's policy regarding trans people using their bathrooms. So would nothing have been done had this been in a Target bathroom?

And yes, the link is from Snopes and they confirm this story is true (unlike a similar story in April).

Isn't the problem here is that people are taking pictures in dressing rooms at all? I mean, wouldn't this be just as upsetting if this were a woman taking pictures of people in dressing rooms?

Playmate to Inmate? Photo of Nude Woman in Gym Locker Room May Land Ex-Playboy Model Behind Bars - Inside Edition

 

[calamity]

Isn't the problem here is that people are taking pictures in dressing rooms at all? I mean, wouldn't this be just as upsetting if this were a woman taking pictures of people in dressing rooms?

Playmate to Inmate? Photo of Nude Woman in Gym Locker Room May Land Ex-Playboy Model Behind Bars - Inside Edition

I guess next we will need "No Picture Taking Allowed" signs in lockerrooms just like "Contents Hot" labels are required on coffee lids and the "Don't Touch Blade while Engine is Running" warning on lawnmowers.

 

[maquiscat]

1. They are not a 6'3" tall hulk in a dress

We've already established that this is the exception, ye who whined that we were using exceptions to prove the rule.

2. They are not known to be sexual predators like men tend to be: 90% of all sexual violence is perpetrated by males.

As noted, the vast majority of sexual violence happens in the home and by those whom the victim knows. Once again, you who complained of us doing so, used the exception to try to prove your rule.

3. They are women

They would have to recognize that they were a woman first. Can you tell which of these are the woman?

 

[calamity]

We've already established that this is the exception, ye who whined that we were using exceptions to prove the rule.



As noted, the vast majority of sexual violence happens in the home and by those whom the victim knows. Once again, you who complained of us doing so, used the exception to try to prove your rule.



They would have to recognize that they were a woman first. Can you tell which of these are the woman?
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1. Men are on average a 1/2 foot taller than women

2. Men are 90% of the violent sex offenders. Who cares where they offend?

3. Who cares? If they have a vagina, they are women.

 

[maquiscat]

1. Men are on average a 1/2 foot taller than women

What is the average height of trans MtF's? If as a group they average lower than cis males, then your point is moot. For that matter are Trans FtM on average as tall or taller than the average cis male?

2. Men are 90% of the violent sex offenders. Who cares where they offend?

If someone is going to do me harm, I would rather like to know where they most likely are so that I can be where they most likely are not. I am sure most other women feel similar. Violent sex offenders are most likely NOT in a locker room or restroom.

3. Who cares? If they have a vagina, they are women.

And women know which of the pictured have vaginas and which have penises how? How do they know which of the above to be nervous about in the restroom?

 

[calamity]

What is the average height of trans MtF's? If as a group they average lower than cis males, then your point is moot. For that matter are Trans FtM on average as tall or taller than the average cis male?

Stupid questions. Males are on average 1/2 foot taller than females. That's a fact. Being trans has no influence on their height, unless, of course, you can show that it does. :roll:

If someone is going to do me harm, I would rather like to know where they most likely are so that I can be where they most likely are not. I am sure most other women feel similar. Violent sex offenders are most likely NOT in a locker room or restroom.

Most likely? Would not just one woman raped in a bathroom be too many?
Woman raped in bathroom at Manhattan bar | New York Post

And women know which of the pictured have vaginas and which have penises how? How do they know which of the above to be nervous about in the restroom?

If only people with vaginas used the women's bathroom, then they would be good with knowing that the person next to them is a woman. Duh.

 

[roguenuke]

Stupid questions. Males are on average 1/2 foot taller than females. That's a fact. Being trans has no influence on their height, unless, of course, you can show that it does. :roll:

Most likely? Would not just one woman raped in a bathroom be too many?
Woman raped in bathroom at Manhattan bar | New York Post

If only people with vaginas used the women's bathroom, then they would be good with knowing that the person next to them is a woman. Duh.

On average means little when it comes to how common or not 6 ft 3 in tall (or 7'11" tall) is to either gender. While there may not be a woman alive who is 7'11", and one or two men might be living at that height, the chances of a person being that height and transgender are very, very small. Even at 6 ft 3 in tall, the chances of a man being that height are very small, not that much different than the chances of a woman being that height. It is much more common that a man would be under 6 feet tall, than over, much closer to the more common heights cisgender women range.

You are the one who was complaining about exceptions to the rules being called out and one woman being raped in the restroom is an exception when compared to the number of women who use public restroom every day without being raped.

But only those with vaginas do not use women's restrooms now. We already make exceptions. And enforcement of this is not really based on what is in someone's pants, but rather outside, clothed appearance.

 

[calamity]

On average means little when it comes to how common or not 6 ft 3 in tall (or 7'11" tall) is to either gender. While there may not be a woman alive who is 7'11", and one or two men might be living at that height, the chances of a person being that height and transgender are very, very small. Even at 6 ft 3 in tall, the chances of a man being that height are very small, not that much different than the chances of a woman being that height. It is much more common that a man would be under 6 feet tall, than over, much closer to the more common heights cisgender women range.

You are the one who was complaining about exceptions to the rules being called out and one woman being raped in the restroom is an exception when compared to the number of women who use public restroom every day without being raped.

But only those with vaginas do not use women's restrooms now. We already make exceptions. And enforcement of this is not really based on what is in someone's pants, but rather outside, clothed appearance.

No women are 6"3" tall in the US. Where as roughly 7 million or more men are.

Cumulative Percent Distribution of Population, by Height and Sex statistics - USA Census numbers

 

[roguenuke]

No women are 6"3" tall in the US. Where as roughly 7 million or more men are.

Cumulative Percent Distribution of Population, by Height and Sex statistics - USA Census numbers

Wrong. We know for a fact that at least some women in the US are over 6'4" tall, so they are rounding (as they clearly state in the lower corner. This means that .49% of the female population could be over 6 feet tall and not show up there. There could be over 600000 women or more in the US at 6'4" tall.

Britney Griner
Heather Greene
Rita Miniva Besa
Caroline Welz
Margo Dydek

Top 10 Tallest Women in the World | Top 1 US


Plus, since the census is self reported information, those men could also be reporting their heights as taller than they really are. Not sure where you came up with 7 million when that would be 5% of men in the US despite each population showing less than 5%.

 

[notquiteright]

Wrong. We know for a fact that at least some women in the US are over 6'4" tall, so they are rounding (as they clearly state in the lower corner. This means that .49% of the female population could be over 6 feet tall and not show up there. There could be over 600000 women or more in the US at 6'4" tall. Plus, since the census is self reported information, those men could also be reporting their heights as taller than they really are. Not sure where you came up with 7 million when that would be 5% of men in the US despite each population showing less than 5%.

Well we damn sure say our penises are longer than they are, our weight is less than it is, and do you ever wonder at the ridiculous comb overs some guys try??? :roll:

I can't get too cozy with 'self reporting' census in many regards... inheritance, height, weight, penis size, driving skills are just a few... eace

 

[notquiteright]

Gosh. It's almost as if, if we guarantee predators access to victims, they will take advantage of that....

Gosh. It's almost as if predators have never tried this before now... :roll:

Seriously??? Some of ya'll need a reality check... upskirt pics, down the blouse balcony shots, bathroom invasions, dressing room pics have been around since Kodak made their first brownie... get a grip... ahhh ok, poor choice of words.... eace

 

[roguenuke]

Well we damn sure say our penises are longer than they are, our weight is less than it is, and do you ever wonder at the ridiculous comb overs some guys try??? :roll:

I can't get too cozy with 'self reporting' census in many regards... inheritance, height, weight, penis size, driving skills are just a few... eace

Ever been in the military? Imagine how tall the men and women would look in there if they didn't actually measure us. They go to great lengths to ensure it is as accurate (and low) as possible too. Many sailors have complained how they can change heights by as much as two inches from one command to another. I've been measured at 5'6", 5'7" and 5'8".

 

[cpwill]

Gosh. It's almost as if predators have never tried this before now.

Oh sure. Now we are simply enabling them by guaranteeing them access to their targets.

 

[sangha]

Oh sure. Now we are simply enabling them by guaranteeing them access to their targets.

What stopped them before?

 

[CLAX1911]

Transgender Woman Arrested for Taking Pictures in Target Changing Room : snopes.com

I thought things like this weren't supposed to happen. In fact, I pretty much believed they wouldn't and said so several times but, if you look at the picture of the person at the link, he does not look female at all or look like he's even trying so is he really trans or just saying so to take a few pics? It also bothers me that the suggestion that something was only done about this because it occurred in a dressing room, not a bathroom and therefore was not subject to Target's policy regarding trans people using their bathrooms. So would nothing have been done had this been in a Target bathroom?

And yes, the link is from Snopes and they confirm this story is true (unlike a similar story in April).

I'm pretty sure something would have been done no matter the location, or even the sex of those involved. It's not legal to take pictures of people undressing without their knowledge or approval.

 

[notquiteright]

Ever been in the military? Imagine how tall the men and women would look in there if they didn't actually measure us. They go to great lengths to ensure it is as accurate (and low) as possible too. Many sailors have complained how they can change heights by as much as two inches from one command to another. I've been measured at 5'6", 5'7" and 5'8".

LOL, yes I did a little time in Uncle Sugar's Green Machine- 60% 'disabled' grunt. I always get a good laugh when both men and women tell their weight, height, and 'real' hair color for that matter. Having seen a few people around the world I had to laugh when the other poster believes women can't be over a certain height...

Back in my day they didn't measure us much- they seemed happy with us still being upright, breathing, and capable of carrying our body weight for as long as they wanted... eace

 

[notquiteright]

Oh sure. Now we are simply enabling them by guaranteeing them access to their targets.

Oh sure, like they REALLY needed that... :roll:

You need to get out more... eace

 

[calamity]

LOL, yes I did a little time in Uncle Sugar's Green Machine- 60% 'disabled' grunt. I always get a good laugh when both men and women tell their weight, height, and 'real' hair color for that matter. Having seen a few people around the world I had to laugh when the other poster believes women can't be over a certain height...

Back in my day they didn't measure us much- they seemed happy with us still being upright, breathing, and capable of carrying our body weight for as long as they wanted... eace

How does that take away from the fact that men on average are 1/2 foot taller than women? It's people saying that height differences between sexes are not that pronounced who are spinning tales.

 

[calamity]

Ever been in the military? Imagine how tall the men and women would look in there if they didn't actually measure us. They go to great lengths to ensure it is as accurate (and low) as possible too. Many sailors have complained how they can change heights by as much as two inches from one command to another. I've been measured at 5'6", 5'7" and 5'8".

So, even at your highest measurement, you're still an inch and a half shorter than the average American male. :roll:

And, yeah...I've been measured anywhere from 6'1" to 6'4" depending on who does the deed. In my basketball days, they listed me at the highest possible number; in my 50's the number suddenly dropped 3 inches. I'm sure the real number is somewhere inbetween, a good 10 inches taller than the average female.