7s7 Islam - Six Belges sur dix souhaitent l'interdiction des minarets (1039467)
Nearly 60% of the Belgians would support a ban on minarets, according to a poll. That's more than the 57% of Swiss people who voted for the ban a few days ago.
In fact, if a referendum occured, there would probably even more people voting for a ban, since people are often reluctant to say that they support "non-PC" ideas, as the swiss referendum showed.
Young people are more tolerant than the older ones, and so are the women.
Nearly 57% would favor a ban on mosques, and 61% don't want a mosque in their neighborhood.
The fact that the (rich) Flemish are more tolerant (only 34% would totally support a ban on minarets) than the (poorer) Walloons (44% totally agree with a ban) seems to prove what I'd been saying in the Swiss thread: prosperous communities are more open and tolerant than declining communities.
Prosperous communities often are. However might this be a bit to do with education and those in the prosperous communities getting a better one.
Those who feel deprived often have poor education and it is only to easy for nationalists and the like to home in on this and give them some group to fear and hate, hence making their ambitions more achievable.
And I would also love to see a poll here and in the US about kicking out Muslims of the country... bet that would get high favourable ratings too (not a majority though).
Muslims are not enough in the USA to be considered as a real threat, except by really extremist people. Furthermore, the USA are more ethnically diverse than European countries, I guess that should make them more open to diversity.
If a minority had to be aimed by propaganda in the USA, it would be the Latinos. They're numerous and many Americans seem to think that there is an invasion of latino illegals.
I lol at Europe.
Israelis do not support the ban on minarets.It's a protection measure against a community whose growing influence is seen as a cultural threat. Not so different from Israel preventing the return of Palestinians.
Israelis do not support the ban on minarets.
Minarets do not change the demography.
I am all in favor for Europe maintaining its population's majority in comparison to the immigrants, but banning minarets is pretty much against the freedom of religion, isn't it?
If that's the direction Europe takes, so be it, their nation their rules.Banning minarets is symbolic, you can be sure that the same proportion of people would support more restrictive immigration. But that would sound like the extreme-right, so instead they attack symbols (there are 4 minarets in Switzerland and 6 in Belgium).
And as PeteEU said, some people support these bans because of fear, rational or not.
There is another example of such fears in Belgium: there are more and more Frenchspeakers around Brussels (= in a Flemish area). They're also perceived as a threat to the Flemish identity (and it's true that many of them don't speak Dutch), so as a result the Flemish massively support parties who want to restrict the rights of these Frenchspeaking "immigrants" (and these rights are symbolic, it's about bilingual signs or bilingual electoral posters)
Banning the minarets cannot really be justified, as it goes directly against the essence of the freedom of religion.
If that's the direction Europe takes, so be it, their nation their rules.
It would have been, however, more wise and less radical to limit the minarets, instead of banning them altogether.
Limiting the minarets could be justified with the claim to maintain the European culture and prevent a dominance of an Islamic culture on European soil.
Banning the minarets cannot really be justified, as it goes directly against the essence of the freedom of religion.
It has not much about tolerance but of fear. It happens always during times of troubles. Minorities are blamed for the ills of society and people would do anything to strike out and punish those minorities. It has happened through out history all over the world.
But it would be interesting to see such polls in the US, plus a similar poll everywhere that did not target minarets specifically but "religious towers" of all kinds.
And I would also love to see a poll here and in the US about kicking out Muslims of the country... bet that would get high favourable ratings too (not a majority though).
There is an invasion of illegal latinos, the west coast is being over run....BUB said:If a minority had to be aimed by propaganda in the USA, it would be the Latinos. They're numerous and many Americans seem to think that there is an invasion of latino illegals.
When you have bugs, you get out the bug spray.....gardener said:I see the Belgians and Swiss as striking a symbolic blow against the excessive accomidations their governments make in regards to an extremely illiberal minority refusing to adopt their liberal customs. Now, this might be a misplaced expression of anger, and due to people's inability to understand certain concepts, such a desire to preserve their liberal ways is somehow seen as "right wing", I think people have a genuine and very legitimate concern here that the way of life they have developed is under attack by those who have moved into their space, but want nothing to do with their way of life.
I think they are making a statement against the stupidity of multiculturalism, and for a melting pot approach to immigration. They may be jousting at the wrong windmill, but they probably feel powerless in the face of the increasing Islamization of Europe, and are striking where they can.
Why? Mosques are not forbidden, and no one said a thing in this poll against praying Allah. Furthermore, as I said, minarets are not a religious thing (the Koran does not mention it), the proof is that most mosques don't even have a minaret!
Things are different now. I believe its more or less factual that Muslim birth rates have reached such high levels in Europe that the indigneous population have no chance of jumping back. A fith of the European Union will be Muslim by 2050 and statistics show France will be an Islamic Republic within the next 100 years. Such news can be frightful to many Europeans, which is understandable, and naturally such fear of Islamic birth rates gives rise to racist sentiments. I for one appreciate the base cultural values which forms the freeworld, something you'd be very hard pressed to find in Islam.
This is purely factual.
If you go Istanbul for example, only the Ottoman era mosque's have minarets.
it was funded by Saudi Arabia in their effort to promote wahhabism in Europe.
And you should stop reading American inspired right wing studies who's only goal is to create conflict where there is non.
yes the muslim birth rate in Europe is higher, but it is declining. In the 30 years of major Muslim immigration in Europe the birth rate has gone down dramatically. Heck even in Turkey, the birth rate is not even meeting replacement rate last I looked. Why? because Muslim women are getting educated and understand their only goal in life is not to have 10 children.
So having studies saying in 50 years Europe will be everything from Muslim majority to even having individual countries having a muslim majority always does not take into consideration the falling brithrate among Muslim women for every generation.. Why does it not take it into consideration.. because it would not fit into their fear mongering.
Actually most of this stuff is European right wing studies. What do the Americans care? :S
That is true, but it doesnt change anything. Muslim birthrates are far higher than non-Muslim birthrates and that will certainly lead to a massive Muslim population in Europe, not to mention non-European birthrates are still declining.
Perhaps it doesnt take into consideration future European Muslim immigration, who remain relatively uneducated and conservative compared to their European Muslim counterparts.
Why should anyone be "tolerant" of a violent cult that oppresses women and promotes hatred and religious insanity? Good for Europe for wanting cult religions like these Islamists out of their country. If they love Sharia law so much, they're free to keep there degeneracy confined to the middle East.7s7 Islam - Six Belges sur dix souhaitent l'interdiction des minarets (1039467)
Nearly 60% of the Belgians would support a ban on minarets, according to a poll. That's more than the 57% of Swiss people who voted for the ban a few days ago.
In fact, if a referendum occured, there would probably even more people voting for a ban, since people are often reluctant to say that they support "non-PC" ideas, as the swiss referendum showed.
Young people are more tolerant than the older ones, and so are the women.
Nearly 57% would favor a ban on mosques, and 61% don't want a mosque in their neighborhood.
The fact that the (rich) Flemish are more tolerant (only 34% would totally support a ban on minarets) than the (poorer) Walloons (44% totally agree with a ban) seems to prove what I'd been saying in the Swiss thread: prosperous communities are more open and tolerant than declining communities.
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