WillRockwell
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Most of it, Obama seems to put the emphasis on Israel to change, and be the ones forced to make concessions and do what the Palestinians want... Everytime they've done this they've gotten burned. Obama's POV seems to be "Make Israel weak equals peace".
I find that to be at the very least, naive, and at worst malicious.
I find it amusing that you consider yourself such a MidEast expert that the current peace process seems "naive". Been there done that, eh?
Bill Clinton very nearly had the knot unraveled in 2000, but Arafat decided he didn't want a legacy as a nation builder. I remember news reports that there could be a Palestinian state in as little as six weeks. Israel agreed to concessions, as the stronger party it must. Asking Palestine to renounce aggression is no small thing.
....as Clinton did, as Bush 41 did, as Reagan did, as Carter did, as Ford did, as Nixon did, as Johnson did, as Kennedy did, as Ike did, as.....Peace in the Middle East will not come by kissing Israel's ass, as Bush did. If anyone can negotiate the delicate obstacles to peace, I believe Hillary and Obama can.
Israel can handle criticism, and they can handle us backing off a little to work for peace in the Mid-East. They may not like the process, but they will like the result.
You don't know what the result is going to be, so how can you say they'll like the result? Backing down from the Muslims isn't going to achieve peace. Got news for ya on that one.
I wonder if you'd of said that say... two years ago or so? I'm thinking no.
I see you are ignoring the fact... Israel got burned in that attempt.
How far backwards do they have to bend for peace when that bend puts them at greater risk?
Given that Israel, unlike the Palestinians and the other Arab states, do not condone the use of terrorism as public policy, saying "yes" to everything Israel wants, while not the wisest of courses, is considerably more prudent than saying "no" to everything Israel needs....like defensible borders and an understanding that lobbing rockets at Israeli civilians is not an acceptable hobby, not even for Hamas and Hezbollah lackeys.
Well then...your guess is wrong. Because every one of our ex-Presidents comes from a Christian background (at least I think so). I would assume that at lease some of them have sat through at least one sermon filled with the type of hate that sometimes comes across a Christian pulpit.
But not having sat through 200+ years of sermons, its hard to say.
I love how you moved the goal posts there buddy.
20 years of racist hate filled bigotry is now the same as "one hate filled sermon".
How much further will you go to lie to yourself?
For the first time in years, the nationalist camp will hold a large scale rally against United States policies vis-à-vis Israel.
Peace in the Middle East will not come by kissing Israel's ass, as Bush did. If anyone can negotiate the delicate obstacles to peace, I believe Hillary and Obama can.
I don't care what the hell Israel thinks. They can have whatever anti-US rallies they want. If that's all they have for argument for our support or whatever, then they ain't got **** for an argument. If it were up to me, I wouldn't fund or support any of those guys over there. None of them want peace, none of them will do what it takes to end this conflict, and I don't think any of our time, energy, or money should go into it.
That's the same thing those protesters say.The fact that they have the gall to tell us what to do is pretty nuts.
The situation is odviously very complicated and and results from actions today will be seen in the future. However, I believe that the alternation in our Israeli relations of demanding more of them in improving relations with theSince you already received the sarcastic replies to this posting and those that followed in its defense I will attempt not to pile on etc.
My reply to this original statement is that since peace in the middle east has been on the agenda of pretty much every administration since the establishment of Israel, and many have treated it as a priority and invested much time and effort into establishing peace etc. just exactly what can or will Clinton or Obama have to utilize that will allow them a increased chance at success?
If you believe that Obama's actions have caused some other effect that has not been sourced yet, then if you want to bring it up, it would make sense if you would be the one to source it.Nothing against either of them, but this problem is so intricate and deeply rooted in thousands of years of history that is showered in brutality it would seem difficult to believe that anyone with the history or experience in this area as these two have would have true ability to have a positive effect.
Also something I have not seen posted yet is the very fact that the conflicts in question have been "used" to facilitate or substantiate other actions that have proven very successful if not profitable for those outside the conflict with deep concerns or plenty of advice.
At least from your last sentence, that can be interpreted as we should stop supporting Israel financially, because that makes it easier for Israel to have the power to have a hardline responce to the Palestinians.Being I have heard the stories from both sides or views from those who have lived through this ordeal, and knowing the very deep beliefs and scaring involved I honestly just do not see the answer to these problems coming from outside the region, and almost believe it must come from within the problem.
I almost want to twist this into a story of why it is not a good idea to hire a shady attorney to help make people be happy and get along, anymore than to hire one to fix your roof, but I figured I would keep it clean and simple.
Still though protests against the US are not anything new in the ME, it is still interesting to hear of them being held inside our strongest ally in the area, and this should alert us all that something is either changing, or not exactly right.
That's the same thing those protesters say.
That was not my point.When your country has received over a trillion dollars in welfare, that argument goes out the window.
By the way, Egypt receives nearly the same amount of foreign aid as Israel but I don't see America trying to order it around.
Lol at this kind of logic.It should.
Any country which gets that much in aid is basically their bitch, especially if they rely on it as it can be pulled theoretically away from them.
Lol at this kind of logic.
Sovereignty is not bought with money.
That was not my point.
The protesters share your view (the other country should not order it around) because the only country that gave any orders is America.
Foreign aid is a show of support and all, but it doesn't buy Obama the ability to 'demand' stuff from Israel, Israel is a sovereign nation, and it is an ally of the US, not a puppet state.
By the way, Egypt receives nearly the same amount of foreign aid as Israel but I don't see America trying to order it around.
That was not my point.
The protesters share your view (the other country should not order it around) because the only country that gave any orders is America.
Foreign aid is a show of support and all, but it doesn't buy Obama the ability to 'demand' stuff from Israel, Israel is a sovereign nation, and it is an ally of the US, not a puppet state.
By the way, Egypt receives nearly the same amount of foreign aid as Israel but I don't see America trying to order it around.
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