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Why does Trump command such support?

gbg3 said:
Agreed! It's starting off interestingly too. I'd guess quite a few Independents voted exactly as you described, against Trump. But, I'd also guess many of those voters hoped and expected Biden would be relatively moderate. Some may have hated Trump but rather liked (or certainly didn't mind) a lot of Trump's mainstream conservative policy and potentially thought Trump progress would stay largely intact. (I certainly think Trump's policy was very mainstream conservative and in no way was it the least bit "far right".)
But, there seems to be a big Dem push to do a lot and go really left (and quickly) while they have this chance - mostly an enormous power grab attempt IMO. Citizenship for 11 million immigrants (and that number is likely far higher but no one really knows what the accurate number is), practically wide open borders, catch and release, higher taxes, much bigger government, damaging "marriage" to the teachers' unions at the terrible expense of America's school age children, expensive climate policies, heavy regulations on all sorts of things, very lenient and loose voting rules, etc.. Basically, BOLD leftist policy. I think much of it is meant to "cement" Dems in power (like adding so many new voters likely to require extensive and expensive welfare programs and thus make these new voters big government/Dem voters well into the future). But in the bold and rapid power grab process - will Dems lose many of those Independents and sabotage their very plan by losing badly in 22 and 24 as a result of scaring too many of the very voters they need. Which way this ends up going certainly does remain to be seen!!!!
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I think we need to look at 2000 election in total. Yes, Biden won by some 7 million plus votes. But the GOP had a net gain of 13 house seats, 2 state legislatures and a governorship. This was the first election since 1884 where a presidential candidate won the popular vote along with the presidency and still lost house seats. Republican congressional candidates received more voters, a higher percentage than Trump. Which simply means we had a lot of ticket splitters, voting for Biden for president, but Republican down ballot.

This election in total gives the Democrats no mandate, it neither endorses nor rejects either party's agenda or ideals. This election was a total mixed bag. If the Democrats continue to govern as this election gave them a mandate to go extreme left, I have no doubt they'll lose both chambers in 2020 much like 1994 and 2010. Independents thought they were voting for a moderate in Biden. Not the policies of a Sanders, Warren, AOC and the like. But the Democratic congress is pushing Biden to the extreme far left. If Gallup has party affiliation right, independents now make up 45% of the electorate as of January 2021. That's up from 30% in 2006. Both major parties are shrinking, which I attribute to them moving further and further left and right, the polarization and ideologues of each, Which could mean we'll have some very wild swings come election time. The possibility exist for one party to gain 50 house seats in one election and immediately lose them in the next.
 
manrow said:
Is it really that simple?
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Yep, it is. Clinton made independents angry in 1994 with his tax increases which included raising taxes on social security, his assult weapons ban and Hillary's failed healthcare plan. A result of the Republicans gaining 54 house seats. Bush made independents angry in 2006 and the democrats gained 33 house seats. Obama with the ACA which independents were total against, resulted in a 63 seat pick up for the Republicans. 2018, independents were angry at Trump. Not so much for his policies but his behavior and obnoxious spoiled brat personality. The Democrats picked up 43 seats.

Want to know how 2022 will turnout, watch how independents view congressional Democrats.
 
Perotista said:
I think we need to look at 2000 election in total. Yes, Biden won by some 7 million plus votes. But the GOP had a net gain of 13 house seats, 2 state legislatures and a governorship. This was the first election since 1884 where a presidential candidate won the popular vote along with the presidency and still lost house seats. Republican congressional candidates received more voters, a higher percentage than Trump. Which simply means we had a lot of ticket splitters, voting for Biden for president, but Republican down ballot.

This election in total gives the Democrats no mandate, it neither endorses nor rejects either party's agenda or ideals. This election was a total mixed bag. If the Democrats continue to govern as this election gave them a mandate to go extreme left, I have no doubt they'll lose both chambers in 2020 much like 1994 and 2010. Independents thought they were voting for a moderate in Biden. Not the policies of a Sanders, Warren, AOC and the like. But the Democratic congress is pushing Biden to the extreme far left. If Gallup has party affiliation right, independents now make up 45% of the electorate as of January 2021. That's up from 30% in 2006. Both major parties are shrinking, which I attribute to them moving further and further left and right, the polarization and ideologues of each, Which could mean we'll have some very wild swings come election time. The possibility exist for one party to gain 50 house seats in one election and immediately lose them in the next.
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There is report out that Trump does indeed plan to run again in 2024.

We could very well have a Biden-Trump II in 2024. It would be a 82 yr old vs a 78 yr old.

People say No Way. But don't underestimate the mental status of many Americans. I saw on tv the other night a woman in Texas claiming the snow was fake and sent there by Bill Gates. I imagine she votes too.
 
Perotista said:
A lot of it goes to our modern era of politics. The polarization, the divisiveness, the mega, ultra high partisanship. Most Republicans and certainly Trump supporters think the Democratic Party and the MSM have pillared Trump and tried to destroy him and his presidency wrongly without mercy for 4 years. It's has become unimportant whether Trump made a million mistakes and governed about as poorly as one could, he's family which was done wrong, a Republican which which the opposition and MSM worked very hard to destroy totally without reason or simply because he won an election over Hillary Clinton, the left's and MSM's darling, queen is how they put it.

It also boils down to each major party viewing the other party as this nation's number one enemy, more of an enemy than Russia, China, North Korea, Iran, terrorist, out to destroy this country.

www.rasmussenreports.com

Voters See Each Other as America’s Enemy

U.S. voters now regard each other as a bigger enemy than Russia or North Korea and just as dangerous as China.
www.rasmussenreports.com www.rasmussenreports.com

Trump would have never happened in any previous political era outside of our modern one. Today most of these Trump supporters think they're being silenced by force by the federal government. That the Democrats are trying to use the 6 Jan D.C. riot as the equivalent of the burning of burning of the Reichstag in order to bring about one party rule without opposition. Especially when they see Pelosi call those who voted not to impeach Trump as the "Enemy from within." The calls to expel all those who voted against impeachment. They support Trump because they think he was right, that what is happening now is nothing more than a Democratic Power grab much like Hitler did with the burning of the Reichstag to ensure one party rule on America while silencing anyone, expelling anyone with a different belief.

Pelosi wants security money to face 'enemy' within House

www.yahoo.com

Police tighten Congress security in era of rising threats

The House’s chief law enforcement officer is tightening security for traveling lawmakers as Congress reassesses safety in an era when threats against members were surging even before Donald Trump’s supporters attacked the Capitol. Capitol Police officers will be stationed at Washington-area...
www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com

As long as both parties use the divide and conquer strategy in search for votes, pitting one group of voters against another things will only get worst. The whole idea of this modern era of politics is to get the voter to hate the other guy more than they hate you. So the divide will only continue to grow, violence will grow. People have come to belief all the negative personal attacks that have been forth coming from both parties for the last 30 years. It's us vs. them. It's got to a point where the R and the D is much more important than the big A, America by both political party leaders.
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One side is doing the harm, the other is reacting. Theres no bothsiding this.
 
Crosscheck said:
There is report out that Trump does indeed plan to run again in 2024.

We could very well have a Biden-Trump II in 2024. It would be a 82 yr old vs a 78 yr old.

People say No Way. But don't underestimate the mental status of many Americans. I saw on tv the other night a woman in Texas claiming the snow was fake and sent there by Bill Gates. I imagine she votes too.
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Biden has said in the past on a couple of occasions that he plans on serving only one term. Now whether or not he sticks to that, I don't know. What we need is some fresh young faces. I would imagine Biden is grooming Harris to be his successor. How well that goes over, time will tell. Then how much influence Trump will have on the GOP also remains to be seen. Once these lawsuits kick in, Trump might be rather busy to delve into politics much.

It's time for the Republican Party to move on past Trump. He lost, he needs to just fade away.
 
Callen said:
Two elements play in policy and values. Most Republicans can deliver on conservative policy, true conservative policy not right wing populist policy. I believe the Republicans can win back the WH , Senate and House but not with Trumpsters and conspiracy theory whackos, too many Americans are done with that. If they run relatively main stream conservatives , people who deal in policy and not divisiveness nor hateful rehtoric and conspiracy theories they can win. If they decide to go with the Cruz' s, DeSantis, Johnson's and Green's they will lose.
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It won't matter who the Republican nominee is, unless it's Trump. It could be Kasich or Cruz and I think the Dem attacks will be virtually identical and just as underhanded and completely unfair - Kavanaugh style attacks no matter who it is. If it's Trump, the attacks will be even worse. No matter who it is, Dems will say or do anything to win - there is no low that is too low or any corrupt that is too corrupt. The Dems of 2021 will very willingly go full on ugly and they demonstrate that with each day that passes.
 
gbg3 said:
It won't matter who the Republican nominee is, unless it's Trump. It could be Kasich or Cruz and I think the Dem attacks will be virtually identical and just as underhanded and completely unfair - Kavanaugh style attacks no matter who it is. If it's Trump, the attacks will be even worse. No matter who it is, Dems will say or do anything to win - there is no low that is too low or any corrupt that is too corrupt. The Dems of 2021 will very willingly go full on ugly and they demonstrate that with each day that passes.
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My God

You describe the republicans perfectly. They are the party of baseless attacks
 
gbg3 said:
Dems will say or do anything to win - there is no low that is too low or any corrupt that is too corrupt. The Dems of 2021 will very willingly go full on ugly and they demonstrate that with each day that passes.
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My oh my Newsmax and Fox must be in overdrive ! Got any real facts to support that? Accusations of corrupt and going low are rich coming from a Trump worshipper.
 
Aunt Antifa said:
We are a country founded on white supremacy. It’s still a very powerful, motivating force for large swaths of our population. It is embarrassing for sure.
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I think there is far more ugly truth in your three sentences than any of us want to acknowledge.

In 2012, the Republican autopsy (see link below) said that the party must change. Typical of Republicans, rather than face and embrace reality, they choose ignorance, sticking their head in the sand while doubling down on their commitment to only serve the white community. To keep that going, they had to also double down on their effort to suppress the minority vote while increasing turnout the white vote (nationalism -- the immigrants and minorities are taking away our America). Thus far that has worked, sort of....... It will not work forever, hence they aren't all that keen on democracy anymore as the one reality that is in the back of their minds, the Republicans can not win free and fair elections much longer.

DocumentCloud

www.documentcloud.org www.documentcloud.org
 
upsideguy said:
I think there is far more ugly truth in your three sentences than any of us want to acknowledge.

In 2012, the Republican autopsy (see link below) said that the party must change. Typical of Republicans, rather than face and embrace reality, they choose ignorance, sticking their head in the sand while doubling down on their commitment to only serve the white community. To keep that going, they had to also double down on their effort to suppress the minority vote while increasing turnout the white vote (nationalism -- the immigrants and minorities are taking away our America). Thus far that has worked, sort of....... It will not work forever, hence they aren't all that keen on democracy anymore as the one reality that is in the back of their minds, the Republicans can not win free and fair elections much longer.

DocumentCloud

www.documentcloud.org www.documentcloud.org
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Interesting analysis.
However on this thread alone, some have pointed out the limitations of the Democrats, and you have achieved the same for the Republicans, so are their new parties out there just waiting to emerge?
 
manrow said:
Interesting analysis.
However on this thread alone, some have pointed out the limitations of the Democrats, and you have achieved the same for the Republicans, so are their new parties out there just waiting to emerge?
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The media is reporting that Trump is due to make a speech in Florida today; it may include his ambition to stand for president again in 2024. Who wants to hear that?
 
code1211 said:
Another empty and meaningless post.
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Why do you refuse to recognize Trump for the sleazy, lying, piece of shit he truly is?
Do you support such racism, bullying and evil behavior?
Why do you hate people who aren't rich?
 
Trump, just like he learned from Rush Limbaugh, feeds their hatred bigotry and fear.

He gives their racist views voice

He tells them exactly what they want to hear.

Now why evangelicals support him is a little more difficult. Guess it is just because he is not a democrat
 
SMTA said:
Why do you refuse to recognize Trump for the sleazy, lying, piece of shit he truly is?
Do you support such racism, bullying and evil behavior?
Why do you hate people who aren't rich?
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Have you viewed the latest tv appearance of Trump, repeating the same old mantra, as though suffering from dementia?
How can anyone support him as a realistic leader of America? He is and always has been a joke.
 
SMTA said:
Why do you refuse to recognize Trump for the sleazy, lying, piece of shit he truly is?
Do you support such racism, bullying and evil behavior?
Why do you hate people who aren't rich?
Click to expand...

Nothing in your post has roots in the real world.
 
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