[W:277] Florida's DeSantis moves to allow citizens to shoot looters, rioters targeting businesses (1 Viewer)

[OpportunityCost]

So angry! So irrational! Calm down and learn to stand against violence instead of for it.

You have made no stand whatsoever, you use Trump as an excuse to cover whatever violence your fellow travelers do. You stand for the violence, not me.

 

[Lovebug]

Emphasis on " DeSantis has drafted "

 

[Daddyo]

I suggest there's a reason why this nitwit held back on this boneheaded idea until after Biden was elected.
I can't guess what contorted line of reasoning told him to do this but when was the last riot in Florida?
Hey, maybe this is a pre-emptive measure to allow citizens to deal with irate rightists protesting the election!

Right wingers don't riot. Sorry try again.

Last riot was just a few months ago here in Tampa. Police did nothing to stop it. They just contained it as businesses burned and people died. Perhaps DeSantis recognized this seemingly common occurrence here and around the country by law enforcement to just contain the riot while violent thugs loot, burn, and kill. It doesn't have to be a negative reason everytime.

Defending my business saved it from at a minimum being looted. Having this law would have changed nothing. When my crew and I exited my business and confronted the looters they ran away at no time needing to have deadly force used on them. We were prepared had they not retreated. This law simply puts the law on our side. I worried about the legal issues for all 11 days. Even promised my wife that if deadly force needed to be used in any Grey areas that I would be the one to do it to keep my sons out of legal trouble. This law would eliminate many of those gray areas. I believe it will also act as a deterrent to looters and rioters as well.

#2 fear (when asked) by convicted burglars is a large dog.

#1 fear when asked the armed homeowner.

Many burglaries are prevented by both everyday. Without a shot fired or a chunk of ass bitten.

 

[Daddyo]

DeSatan could not have bungled his response more if he tried. Remember, Florida's per-case numbers were some of the worst in the nation this summer. It's also anti-mask governors in the Upper Midwest that are fueling the COVID-19 surge there.

Have a good look at the corona hotspot map. You blame DeSantis and opening up yet lock down masked up states are hot spots as well. What a joke.

Before you keep this mask bull crap going even longer please get your own house in order. Seems your own demonrat politicians don't wear masks all the time. I have yet to enter a business the didnt require masks to enter. We don't have to be commanded by hypocrites who don't comply themselves. Given all the lock down states in the hot spot zones you are a fool for even attempting to blame DeSantis.

 

[Daddyo]

I most certainly did. Trump calls BLM violent protesters. They are Nwords to right wing. Thus, the words, VIOLENT PROTESTERS, is right in the FRIGGIN title. And so, shooting Nwords protesting was FOREMOST on their minds. And the FACT that they used SUSPECTED, means go ahead and blow away Nwords that are protesting.

Sad and sick mentality. Always about race. I'm hispanic and right wing. Trump just got over 20 percent of the black vote. I have black friends who are right wing.

BTW of all the rioting and looting I saw nationally it was mostly white people.

And really you shouldn't project your own personal racist beliefs on others. Its really sad. Don't riot and loot and you will be fine. Riot and loot and you might not NO MATTER WHAT COLOR YOUR SKIN!

 

[Daddyo]

Do you think BLM is justified in protesting? NO, you dont. So, they are violent protesters, that some white folks get shot as well, is NOT a detractor from assertion.

Rioting is not protesting. Looting is not protesting. This law involves rioters and looters not protesters. If a protest goes from peaceful to rioting and looting I suggest you leave immediately. If you remain business owners will soon be able to legally protect their lives and businesses from you. I promise you that we don't give one shit what color your skin is. I promise you that a Florida cracker white boy will be treated just the same as a Latino, Asian, or black person. I dont care about anything other than keeping my family, myself, and my business safe.

This is why the false bullcrap narrative that blacks are being hunted by police and white people is so dangerous. The opposite is true if anything. Statistics say that blacks kill more whites than the opposite. So stop crying wolf.

 

[Daddyo]

Clearly define SUSPECTED. A SUPPOSED plastic bottle, empty, was what Barr used, to justify bashing PEACEFUL protesters. Calling them VIOLENT.

I also believe that an empty plastic bottle was what justified the punk merc right winger in shooting three humans.

The video I saw showed several men trying to disarm the guy. He responded to this deadly threat by shooting one of his attackers. Then I see a giant crowd chasing him trying to hurt or kill him. He again responded by shooting his attackers one of which was armed with a handgun as he was being shot. So from the actual video I can only see justifiable shootings. Far from an empty bottle but nice try.

A couple of things to note. More than one person threatening you either armed or unarmed is considered a deadly threat if they have bad intent.

Don't try to take someone's gun from them as you often force them to use it as they now fear you will take it and use it on them. So you may be unarmed and think you are not a threat however if you try to take it you will be armed if successful. Not smart BTW.

Just for some of you that don't quite understand how fast an unarmed but violent man can hurt or kill you......trust me do some research it is fast. Watch some videos of trained law enforcement being instantly overwhelmed by a single violent man. One punch in some cases. So now imagine a crowd of rioters. You simply cannot allow someone within arms reach or you are at risk. Please study this aspect of armed self defense.

When you do you will understand why this kid shot those guys. The video will make his best defense.

 

[Daddyo]

Of course they have. So have about a billion other things that damage some property and kill nobody.

At the rate you people are going, you'll have us back to being upset about all the people that sharks kill every year.

If I kick in your front door and attempt to burn down your home what will you do?

 

[NatMorton]

What do you suggest, besides violence, to stop looters and arsonists from destroying local businesses?

Allow the police to do their jobs, which I'll acknowledge is something many on the left would rather not allow.

 

[TheParser]

Sadly, that law is going nowhere.

The courts will knock it down.

And, of course, the BLM-friendly Biden administration will stop it.

Too bad!

If there were such a law, all looting would soon be a thing of the past.

 

[NatMorton]

Florida's DeSantis moves to allow citizens to shoot looters, rioters targeting businesses

Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis has drafted “anti-mob” legislation that would expand the state’s Stand Your Ground law – a move that some worry would allow armed citizens to shoot and potentially kill anyone they suspect of looting.

www.foxnews.com

Good.



...



The sad part is this should be the default situation in every state.

IMO, this bill goes way too far, but I understand the sentiment behind it.

Too few on the left understand that property rights are closely linked to human rights. If you do not respect what is mine, you do not respect me. Turning a blind eye to the abuse of one's property -- as so many Progressives do so long as the damage is done in the name of the cause du jour -- is step one toward directing the abuse at those owning that property.

So who cares if some white, privileged, corporate fat-cat got cracked over the head during our protest? He probably had it coming to him ...

 

[NatMorton]

Sadly, that law is going nowhere.

The courts will knock it down.

And, of course, the BLM-friendly Biden administration will stop it.

Too bad!

If there were such a law, all looting would soon be a thing of the past.

Would you support a bill allowing bystanders to shoot cops they deem racist?

 

[Daddyo]

I love how some people think that they can go batshit crazy over massively overblown problems, yet when a comparison is made to a problem that is actually a national crisis, they all scream, LOOK OVER THERE! ANNNNTEEEEEFFFAAAAHHHH!

Once again other people are able to multi-task. The world does stop spinning because of covid. Desantis simple addressed a problem. Police allowed rioters to destroy, loot, burn, and even kill. They deemed it to dangerous to go in. TPD was told by the mayor and city council to allow people to vent.

Desantis is simply giving those affected legal protection to save their businesses and lives. He is also making one hellava deterrent to future rioting and looting.

Since it will only affect people who are trying to destroy, steal, or kill from innocent people, I support it 100 percent. And avoiding being affected by this law is as simple as remaining a law abiding member of society. Very easy for the vast majority of Americans. If you plan on protesting leave if it becomes violent. Simple.

Thank you Ron for answering my request. I'm sure it wasn't just me but it feels good to have a governor who addressed a citizens fear and concern.

 

[Daddyo]

And I proved it. Beyond a shadow of a doubt, WITH the titles of articles.

All you proved is that your mind is filled with racist hate IMO.

 

[Daddyo]

Maybe the next chance to shooter violent protesters it'll be rightists pissed off about the election. Won't that be fun? Especially if they shoot back.

Right wingers don't riot and loot.

We protest and only become defensive when attacked by the animals on the left as witnessed a few days ago.

 

[Daddyo]

Pretending to be a guide, now, are you? Shall I stop and ask for directions to the nearest AANNNNTEEEEEFUUUUHHHHH rally?

Once this law passes you can bet your paycheck it won't be in Florida!

 

[SenorXm/Sirius]

If anyone thinks this law will stop at just shooting looters and rioters hasn't been paying attention..

Pretty soon citizens will be shooting joggers for no reason, oh wait never mind.. That's already happening...

Anyway weekly I read people in Florida are shooting each other over parking spaces, backyard disputes, a guy killed his pregnant wife because he 'says' he thought she was a burglar...

Yeah just want this divided, full of deplorables country needs... More reasons to kill each other..

 

[Daddyo]

Um, police officers, national guard, etc.

Sadely police here locally did nothing except to contain it.

I called police and asked if another riot broke out would TPD allow it or stop it. The answer was allow it followed by and its not coming from the department.

This forced me to sleep in my business for 11 day straight. Sucked very bad.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Fine, you support the death penalty for minor theft. Write your reps.
My point is that a rule such as this, given all the possibilities of mistaken identities, the chaos in a riot situation, the cops mistaking your vigilante for a looter, etc., a law like this should be called something like “The Cluster **** Promotion Act.”

Describing a rioting, looting and arson situation as “minor theft” is ridiculous. While each arm load of property being stolen may (or may not) be “minor theft”, the ability to have multiple perps and/or a perp make multiple (repeat) raids once physical security measures have been breached, the property owner (or their assigns) should have the power to stop the chaos and lawlessness with deadly force.

I agree that having such a law allows potential for abuse, but Texas has a law allowing use of deadly force to protect property and alleged cases of abuse are rare.

 

[Daddyo]

Draft legislation means it hasn't passed the state house and the state senate yet. The bill has a long way to go before it becomes law.

It's a political stunt aimed to boost Santos' popularity.

Why just businesses? Why not homes?



.

Its assumed that you can defend your castle or home. Business is different in the eyes of the law. I struggled with concern for how much justification was needed to use d force. I operated under floridas current self defence law which allows deadly force only when you are in eminent fear of death or great bodily harm. During an active riot things can go from ok to you are dead in seconds often eliminating the chance for you to defend yourself.

Case in point I saw a video of rioters confronting a shotgun armed store owner. They kept approaching him arms up in the surrender position. He kept backing up as they did this fearing a gun grab. Had they instantly attack he would have been compromised especially if he hesitated fearing the lack of justification in the eyes of the law. He was forced to retreat back into his shop and the rioters destroyed his business.

Sad and scary. I didn't know how scary until a large crowd formed next to my business at a gas station. Its overwhelming. Getting down to business with a firearm is easy its the fear of being wrong or incorrect in the eyes of the law that is bad. Getting killed or injured seems less a concern than going to prison for being wrong.

The alternative is allow all that you have worked for to be destroyed of stolen. Have to thank DeSantis for trying to help.

 

[JoeyJoystick]

Violence is always wrong. Stopping violence with violence is therefore also wrong. 2 Wrongs do not make 1 right.

You need to take away the reason why people are violent. Actually, the violence is a side effect. People are angry and demonstrating. Take away their anger. And their won't be demonstrations. Without demonstrations their won't be rioters either. The rioters are not the demonstrators. They are stupid people who like violence and use the demonstrations as an excuse to be violent.

Put cameras everywhere. Trace them. Arrest them. Lock them up for a very long time. In prison they can be violent all they want and this will be dealt with accordingly by either the other inmates or the guards.

Joey.

 

[NatMorton]

Violence is always wrong. Stopping violence with violence is therefore also wrong. 2 Wrongs do not make 1 right.

You need to take away the reason why people are violent. Actually, the violence is a side effect. People are angry and demonstrating. Take away their anger. And their won't be demonstrations. Without demonstrations their won't be rioters either. The rioters are not the demonstrators. They are stupid people who like violence and use the demonstrations as an excuse to be violent.

Put cameras everywhere. Trace them. Arrest them. Lock them up for a very long time. In prison they can be violent all they want and this will be dealt with accordingly by either the other inmates or the guards.

Joey.

Not always. Violence as a means of self-defense is, I think, considered acceptable by most people. As for property, far less so unless that violence is applied by professionals (i.e. the police).

In other words, if you see your store getting looted on TV, grab your gun, drive down to your shop, and start shooting, that's wrong. If you're in your store when the violent looting starts, then you can reasonably infer your life is also at risk and defend yourself.

 

[Phys251]

Have a good look at the corona hotspot map. You blame DeSantis and opening up yet lock down masked up states are hot spots as well. What a joke.

Before you keep this mask bull crap going even longer please get your own house in order. Seems your own demonrat politicians don't wear masks all the time. I have yet to enter a business the didnt require masks to enter. We don't have to be commanded by hypocrites who don't comply themselves. Given all the lock down states in the hot spot zones you are a fool for even attempting to blame DeSantis.

Why don't we look at the current hotspots right now. Averaged over the last week, the worst spike in cases right now are in North Dakota, South Dakota, Wyoming, Iowa, and Nebraska. All Red states. Even the Republican governor of North Dakota realized things are so bad in his state that he finally, finally issued a statewide mask mandate.

You people don't care about human life. You are just fine with a quarter million dead Americans, yet if one protester throws one brick through one window, you people scream AAANNNNTEEEEFFFAAAHHHHH!

 

[JoeyJoystick]

Not always. Violence as a means of self-defense is, I think, considered acceptable by most people. As for property, far less so unless that violence is applied by professionals (i.e. the police).

In other words, if you see your store getting looted on TV, grab your gun, drive down to your shop, and start shooting, that's wrong. If you're in your store when the violent looting starts, then you can reasonably infer your life is also at risk and defend yourself.

Hi NatMorton,

Don't get me wrong, I would defend myself. But I still hate violence. And I still think we should always try to do anything we can to avoid violence.

Joey

 

[aociswundumho]

In other words, if you see your store getting looted on TV, grab your gun, drive down to your shop, and start shooting, that's wrong.

This seems like a strawman, because I don't think anyone in this thread believes you have the right to drive up and start shooting. Force has to be proportionate in order to be just.

If you're in your store when the violent looting starts, then you can reasonably infer your life is also at risk and defend yourself.

Suppose the looters say to you (credibly) that they have no interest in harming you, they only want your stuff, and they start hauling the contents of your store away. Would you let them? Let's suppose in this scenario you own a jewelry store, and you have no insurance to cover the loss.