The term 'Cis gendered'

[Visbek]

That proof exists in this very thread. See X-Factor's posts as one example.

lol

Lursa has not demonstrated that cis is any sort of insult, nor does a mere declaration by fiat change an acceptable term into an insult. Quite a few people in this thread are intent on objecting to it because they think it is "PC."

The objections remind me a little of this....

 

[Lursa]

lol

Lursa has not demonstrated that cis is any sort of insult, nor does a mere declaration by fiat change an acceptable term into an insult. Quite a few people in this thread are intent on objecting to it because they think it is "PC."

So as X-Factor has asked many times in this thread....is his perception that him being called a cis-male is an insult...a lie? Incorrect? What? Please tell me. Otherwise I think you are unable to actually process words on a screen, lol.

 

[Absentglare]

Good ****ing grief! There is no male and female brain. Just a brain.

Male and female brains are the same, but people are all different – and that gives me hope | Deborah Orr | Opinion | The Guardian

I was about to point that out. The whole male and female brain thing was debunked a while ago.

You're confusing the presence of a continuum with a complete inability to distinguish major categories on either side of that continuum.

 

[chromium]

Not at all. I'm not saying it can't ever be used, and people can proudly claim it if they want and I'm sure it has all sorts of value in those circles where "gender" consumes people's thoughts all day, every day. They can say what they want as that will never be my circle. But trying to foist that label on me personally, like I've come to this decision, "hey, my brain and my body totally match. How cool is that (don't tell me, it's wrong to be cool with it)." In my mind, I simply am what I am and have never felt the need to carve out every single thing I think and feel and label it all something different.

well thanks for finally explaining it. I don't think in those terms either. The word just doesn't bother me nearly as much though because i realize i'm part of the vast majority whose brain and anatomy do match. If things were reversed, i would probably think of myself as 'cisgender' on a regular basis.

 

[Absentglare]

MLK would be rejected by the "SJW" crowd for not being "inclusive" enough.


FACT.

No, that's what we call bull**** speculation.

no answer? anyone?

You seem to be confusing your personal problems with the speakers' accuracy.

 

[Absentglare]

So as X-Factor has asked many times in this thread....is his perception that him being called a cis-male is an insult...a lie? Incorrect? What? Please tell me. Otherwise I think you are unable to actually process words on a screen, lol.

It depends on the USAGE.

There are times when calling someone 'cis' is meant as an insult, or that it's perceived as an insult.

Since we don't have decades of 'cisgenders' being severely and horrifically oppressed by transgenders, maybe lighten up and stop getting all PC about a perfectly PC term that can be abused.

 

[chromium]

Ah, but if a person is still physically male, is it wrong to call him a "he"? I mean, aren't you and S&M saying that the brain and the body are equally valid? Now, I do admit to some confusion of what it means to be "transsexual". To me, it's meant someone who gone through the full transition, including surgery and now lives as the other sex. Now it seems like it's just anyone who claims they're now a woman even if they've done nothing to present themselves as a woman.

because a huge component of gender is how we present ourselves. Most of us don't go walking around in public with our dicks hanging, so for 99% of interaction, the difficult process of having one's genitals removed isn't necessary

 

[calamity]

You're confusing the presence of a continuum with a complete inability to distinguish major categories on either side of that continuum.

Drop the double-talk, and just admit that male and female brains are the same.

 

[Visbek]

So as X-Factor has asked many times in this thread....is his perception that him being called a cis-male is an insult...a lie? Incorrect? What? Please tell me.

At a minimum, it is incorrect.

As I've said many times, it's not an insult; thus, it is wrong. It would be the equivalent of being offended at someone calling you American, or heterosexual, or a homo sapien.

I don't know if it is a lie. In order to qualify as a lie, the utterer a) has to know the correct meaning, b) know that it is not a pejorative term, and c) engage in a deliberate choice to deceive. That might be the case, but I don't have quite enough information to make that judgment.

That said, it is very likely the claim that "it's offensive!" is due to ignorance, bad faith or both.

And as I said: You cannot declare by fiat that an inoffensive term is offensive.

 

[ReverendHellh0und]

No, that's what we call bull**** speculation.

Actually, brah, this is what we call FACT.

College Students Want MLK Quote Removed For NOT BEING INCLUSIVE ENOUGH - Progressives Today

You seem to be confusing your personal problems with the speakers' accuracy.

You seem experiencing some cognitive dissonance, and you realize it, so you don't answer. Identifying the issue is indeed the first step.

 

[Lursa]

At a minimum, it is incorrect.

As I've said many times, it's not an insult; thus, it is wrong. It would be the equivalent of being offended at someone calling you American, or heterosexual, or a homo sapien.

I don't know if it is a lie. In order to qualify as a lie, the utterer a) has to know the correct meaning, b) know that it is not a pejorative term, and c) engage in a deliberate choice to deceive. That might be the case, but I don't have quite enough information to make that judgment.

That said, it is very likely the claim that "it's offensive!" is due to ignorance, bad faith or both.

And as I said: You cannot declare by fiat that an inoffensive term is offensive.

So is X-Factor lying when he says it's insulting to him?

"Oriental" and "Dwarf" are not offensive terms...Oriental is practically the equivalent of American (of all the Americas). Yet they have been perceived as insults.

Again, you have not remotely proven your premise.

 

[roguenuke]

And people base their own gender identity on a myriad of things we do not fully understand. According to those studies in the link I posted above, a very high percentage of people who are uneasy about their assigned gender also suffer from a number of other mental health issues. 90% of them do, in fact.

If these people are not comfortable with life in general, be it depression, anxiety, psychosis, what have you, is it any wonder that they would also not be comfortable with their gender?

Or it could be that their being uncomfortable with their sex/gender or their treatment for being different by others makes them probe to those other things.

 

[Lursa]

It depends on the USAGE.

There are times when calling someone 'cis' is meant as an insult, or that it's perceived as an insult.

Since we don't have decades of 'cisgenders' being severely and horrifically oppressed by transgenders, maybe lighten up and stop getting all PC about a perfectly PC term that can be abused.

LOL I'm not. I'm trying to make a point.

 

[calamity]

Or it could be that their being uncomfortable with their sex/gender or their treatment for being different by others makes them probe to those other things.

Could be this; could be that. I believe that has always been my position. It's the "mutilate them and pump them up with hormones" crowd that insists on a single solution.

 

[Visbek]

So is X-Factor lying when he says it's insulting to him?

I've already answered that.

"Oriental" and "Dwarf" are not offensive terms...Oriental is practically the equivalent of American (of all the Americas). Yet they have been perceived as insults.

I've already answered that.

Again, you have not remotely proven your premise.

If you are not reading what I've written, that is not my problem.

 

[Lursa]

I've already answered that.

I've already answered that.

If you are not reading what I've written, that is not my problem.

I already spelled it all out as well. You did not 'prove' your "a,b,c", and I certainly countered (again) with my example of Oriental. You failed to support your premise.

 

[cAPSLOCK]

The problem with the word "normal" is what the opposite of the word construes. It's a putdown.

What if someone was "of abnormal intelligence" Or had an abnormally large body part (one that people want to be large. ETC...

I believe it is possible to say someone's sexual identity or orientation can be abnormal, in that someone can have an abnormal amount of freckles.

Is the judgement implied or inferred?

 

[X Factor]

I already spelled it all out as well. You did not 'prove' your "a,b,c", and I certainly countered (again) with my example of Oriental. You failed to support your premise.

What? You didn't find his "because I said so" a compelling argument? :lol:

 

[Harry Guerrilla]

Wrong.

Most gender variant people have no distress, and no GID.

That only affects people with a specific issue that causes their brain and body to disagree on their fundamental sex, not much different from intersex people whose body and chromosomes may disagree.

Transsexual people are only a minority of those who are gender variant. And there's a good argument to be made that they actually aren't gender variant, but rather another type of intersex.

I'm not one to believe in most of those "other" gender variants and think it's a bunch of college kids looking to be different.
In other words, it's all made up.

Transgender, sure I believe it, otherwise it's bunk.

 

[Absentglare]

Drop the double-talk, and just admit that male and female brains are the same.

If that were the case, patients would not improve after changing gender.

 

[Absentglare]

Actually, brah, this is what we call FACT.

College Students Want MLK Quote Removed For NOT BEING INCLUSIVE ENOUGH - Progressives Today







You seem experiencing some cognitive dissonance, and you realize it, so you don't answer. Identifying the issue is indeed the first step.

Lol, that has nothing to do with MLK's behavior. If he were alive today, he might very well agree with those students.

You don't get to pawn off your fantasy as fact.

 

[Absentglare]

So is X-Factor lying when he says it's insulting to him?

"Oriental" and "Dwarf" are not offensive terms...Oriental is practically the equivalent of American (of all the Americas). Yet they have been perceived as insults.

Again, you have not remotely proven your premise.

Lying requires intent. X-Factor is not lying, but that doesn't mean he is correct.

I have little doubt that he perceives it as an insult. However, what he is perceiving may not be supported by the speakers intent (which enlightens the descriptive aspect of meaning) or the historical context (which enlightens the prescriptive aspect of linguistics). With neither a prescriptive nor descriptive definition of 'cis' can justifiably said to pose a believable insult to a reasonable person, i think you can say he'd be wrong.

Now, if you can demonstrate that descriptive usage of the term 'cis' has a negative connotation, then make your case. A psychologist who treats GID for a living, for example, is likely exposed to a great deal of animosity that GID patients have toward those who do not suffer from the condition. That might skew the sample.

I, myself, have seen no good reason to consider 'cis' an insult, unless one were opposed to the characterization of being born to the gender with which they currently identify. I suppose, if it were known to be inaccurate, it could be an insult (?).

Oriental has a negative historical connotation. It had been used in offensive ways for a looooong time. The corollary of 'American' would be 'Asian' which is generally not the same. It depends on the usage. Saying "Asians are all the same" would likely offend many Asians, and justifiably so. In general, the term 'Asian' is not offensive.

 

[calamity]

If that were the case, patients would not improve after changing gender.

From what I've read just today, and posted links on this thread, that is still inconclusive. More and larger studies are needed.

It could be a placebo effect for those who claim an improvement. Other data shows that many trans do not improve and that suicides and other negative outcomes are more prevalent in that group than the general population.

 

[Absentglare]

What if someone was "of abnormal intelligence" Or had an abnormally large body part (one that people want to be large. ETC...

I believe it is possible to say someone's sexual identity or orientation can be abnormal, in that someone can have an abnormal amount of freckles.

Is the judgement implied or inferred?

I have often wanted to trade intelligence for happiness. It is a case of "always greener on the other side," but what they don't tell you is that there's **** everywhere.

Some people think their problems stem from how they differ from average. We perceive a problem, we imagine an explanation, and then we test it.

What is implied is that normal people are happy. Sadly, this is false, as live is suffering.

 

[SmokeAndMirrors]

I'm not one to believe in most of those "other" gender variants and think it's a bunch of college kids looking to be different.
In other words, it's all made up.

Transgender, sure I believe it, otherwise it's bunk.

Welp, science, anthropology, and psychology disagree with you. Gender variant people are as old as time across cultures. You can think the earth is flat -- doesn't make it true.

By the by, what you mean to say is transsexual. Transgender is completely different.

If you can't even be bothered to figure out what the words mean, I have trouble taking your total dismissal of reality seriously.