• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Roger Stone slams Mueller indictment, says he's prepared for the fight of his life

I haven't read any of this thread yet. Please allow me to make a prediction nonetheless. (We've never seen anything Mueller has done.) No collusion! (All of the assholes who have been indicted and jailed basically slept in Trump's bed - because we know his immigrant wife doesn't.) No collusion! (Trump lies every times he opens his idiot mouth and has been busted to death by the special prosecutor.) No collusion!

Now, I'll read and see if I was right.
 
190125131328-roger-stone-nixon-salute-large-169.jpg



I found this really odd considering how things played out for Nixon.

You know Stone's obsession with Nixon, don't you?
 
Well, I mean Roger Stone has no integrity or honor. This is a guy who got a tattoo of Nixon on his back after Nixon resigned in disgrace for breaking the law and lying about it.

I never said Stone had honor, but it hasn't stopped the usual twists of my words with certain people.
 
Reducto ad absurdum

Nobody said Soviet good - Russian bad.
Make no mistake about it however, Putin is a not a friend to Western countries, particularly ours.
The fact that they were communist versus state controlled capitalism doesn't really matter because we're not talking economics, we're talking foreign policy and diplomatic relations.

Putin is not inherently an enemy of the West, unless we make him one -- and there's a game afoot to do this, for the purpose of facilitating the narrative of Eternal-Enemy-Putin.

Constructing an AOC straw man is tantamount to thread hijacking.

It's not thread-hijacking, it's a recognition of the fact that her ideology (and that of many current American Leftists) is closer to Soviet ideology than Russia's is.
So Russia isn't the torch-bearer for Soviet socialism -- the American Left is. They are the danger to American democracy, not Vladimir Putin.

Russia isn't trying to gag and muzzle Americans -- it's American Leftists who are.
Roger Stone must not be gagged, he must be free to speak his mind, and the rest of us can all decide whether to believe him or not.
 
Last edited:
Putin is not inherently an enemy of the West, unless we make him one -- and there's a game afoot to do this, for the purpose of facilitating the narrative of Eternal-Enemy-Putin.

--Maybe you could expand on that and explain why there is a need for some kind of "narrative of Eternal-Enemy-Putin."
And no, just repeating "Because Leftists" over and over again isn't good enough. Use detail in supporting your argument.
Construct an argument that uses history, foreign policy and economics, and which also uses Putin's OWN PERSONAL history as well his past relationship to both the old USSR and the United States.

If you're unable to do that, then you're just resorting to knee-jerk reactionary dog whistling and I am not interested in comparing whistle sizes however I do have elements of ALL of the above in my argument, which says that Putin has nothing good in store for the West. And by the West, I mean the United States AND its allies.

It's not thread-hijacking, it's a recognition of the fact that her ideology (and that of many current American Leftists) is closer to Soviet ideology than Russia's is.
So Russia isn't the torch-bearer for Soviet socialism -- the American Left is. They are the danger to American democracy, not Vladimir Putin.

Russia isn't trying to gag and muzzle Americans -- it's American Leftists who are.
Roger Stone must not be gagged, he must be free to speak his mind, and the rest of us can all decide whether to believe him or not.

It IS THREAD hijacking because the thread is ABOUT Roger Stone.
I can't stop you from acting like your hair is on fire and screeching your Bircherite Commie paranoia and calling every Democrat on the face of the Earth a Communist in training, but I can and will point out that it is idiotic, and I can and will point out that it is a LAME deflection from the subject.

And Russia is no longer communist, thus further pointing the subject away from "AOC - as YOU appear to see her"
 
How about legal goal posts? Is it illegal to ask some guy to ask somebody else about some information he or she might have?

It is if you know that said information was stolen by a foreign agent OR you know that the person or organization asking you to "look into the thief to determine if they have more information they can use against your (political) rival/competition" and you fail to report it. Yeah, that's illegal especially if you lie about it to federal law enforcement. Making things worse for him:

On August 8, 2016, Stone told a conference of Republicans, “I actually have communicated with [WikiLeaks co-founder Julian] Assange. I believe the next tranche of his documents pertain to the Clinton Foundation, but there’s no telling what the October surprise may be.”

So, Roger Stone can fight for his honor, but based on what I've read about his part in the Mueller investigation on Russian collusion, he's not an honorable man.
 
Last edited:
It is if you know that said information was stolen by a foreign agent OR you know that the person or organization asking you to "look into the thief to determine if they have more information they can use against your (political) rival/competition" and you fail to report it. Yeah, that's illegal especially if you lie about it to federal law enforcement.

So, Roger Stone can fight for his honor, but based on what I've read about his part in the Mueller investigation on Russian collusion, he's not an honorable man.

The indictment seems to say the Trump campaign was trying to find out when the next release was going to be. Scarcely the scenario as listed above.
 
The indictment seems to say the Trump campaign was trying to find out when the next release was going to be. Scarcely the scenario as listed above.

All the more reason to stop trying to give the man's actions any more cover. He had to know what he was doing was wrong. It's no different than trying to buy stolen merchandise from a street peddler when you know the merchandise is hot! If you're caught, you're guilty for accessory to the theft. Why should this be treated any differently?

Now, granted, Roger Stone didn't get what he was after but the fact remains:

1) He lied about his contacts with WikiLeaks and Julian Assange; and,

2) He clearly made attempts to obtain stolen information from a foreign agent.

At the very least, he's guilty of obstruction of justice.
 
Last edited:
I never said Stone had honor, but it hasn't stopped the usual twists of my words with certain people.

Per Trix:
"Roger Stone slams Mueller indictment, says he's prepared for the fight of his life"

Good for him. A person who is not willing to fight for their own honor is a person whose life means very little.

Then please explain the point you were trying to make. Is it that you admire dishonorable people who attempt to defend their nonexistent honor?
 
The FBI is going to bring indictments on one and possibly two more people that were questioned by the House Intelligence Committee last year and lied to them under oath. It should happen pretty soon and there's only speculation as to who they are. The guesses so far are Don Jr. and Jared Kushner.
 
All the more reason to stop trying to give the man's actions any more cover. He had to know what he was doing was wrong. It's no different than trying to buy stolen merchandise from a street peddler when you know the merchandise is hot! If you're caught, you're guilty for accessory to the theft. Why should this be treated any differently?

Now, granted, Roger Stone didn't get what he was after but the fact remains:

1) He lied about his contacts with WikiLeaks and Julian Assange; and,

2) He clearly made attempts to obtain stolen information from a foreign agent.

At the very least, he's guilty of obstruction of justice.

He wasn't trying to buy the emails. He was trying to find out when they would be released.
If there is a crime here, Mueller missed it. No charges.
 
--Maybe you could expand on that and explain why there is a need for some kind of "narrative of Eternal-Enemy-Putin."
And no, just repeating "Because Leftists" over and over again isn't good enough. Use detail in supporting your argument.
Construct an argument that uses history, foreign policy and economics, and which also uses Putin's OWN PERSONAL history as well his past relationship to both the old USSR and the United States.

The very first time Trump dared to say that he felt NATO allies should pay more, this all of a sudden elicited a ripple of horrified cries from various circles among the Left. I remember how Mad-Maddie-Albright quickly appeared on CNN to express her deep dismay at such a statement. It was very quickly following this that suddenly rumors began surfacing that Trump's campaign manager was somehow connected to the former govt in Ukraine. They hadn't yet spun up their lie to directly claim "Trump Working For Putin", but started out with "Manafort Has Ties To Yanuckovitch" -- it's only later that they expanded it to Trump-Collusion-With-Putin. The Great TrumPutin Conspiracy Theory then gradually expanded to include those like Roger Stone. All of it based on innuendo, hearsay, and fractional facts (From Fractional Banking to Fractional Reporting to Fractional Justice System).



If you're unable to do that, then you're just resorting to knee-jerk reactionary dog whistling and I am not interested in comparing whistle sizes however I do have elements of ALL of the above in my argument, which says that Putin has nothing good in store for the West. And by the West, I mean the United States AND its allies.

Aha - the "enemy" and the "allies" - such a circular argument.
We label the enemy not for being a threat to us, but because he's a threat to our allies -- and of course our allies are defined as those in conflict with the enemy.
This is a totally circular argument designed to promote a particular narrative.


It IS THREAD hijacking because the thread is ABOUT Roger Stone.
I can't stop you from acting like your hair is on fire and screeching your Bircherite Commie paranoia and calling every Democrat on the face of the Earth a Communist in training, but I can and will point out that it is idiotic, and I can and will point out that it is a LAME deflection from the subject.

I'm not the one obsessed with fighting the Cold War -- it's your Lefty McCarthyites who are -- it's their so-called "patriotism" which is "the last refuge of scoundrels".


And Russia is no longer communist, thus further pointing the subject away from "AOC - as YOU appear to see her"

Glad of you to mention that "Russia is no longer communist" - because there are a lot of Lefty shills who like to simply name-drop Moscow as America's "longtime enemy", along with "KGB Putin" -- both politicians and their media acolytes do this.
 
Stone needs to talk...Or else...Traitors like him should be jailed or executed
 
Stone needs to talk...Or else...Traitors like him should be jailed or executed

You and Mueller don't just want Stone to talk -- you want him to Bear False Witness against your real target -- the legitimately elected President of the United States, Donald Trump.
 
The very first time Trump dared to say that he felt NATO allies should pay more, this all of a sudden elicited a ripple of horrified cries from various circles among the Left. I remember how Mad-Maddie-Albright quickly appeared on CNN to express her deep dismay at such a statement. It was very quickly following this that suddenly rumors began surfacing that Trump's campaign manager was somehow connected to the former govt in Ukraine. They hadn't yet spun up their lie to directly claim "Trump Working For Putin", but started out with "Manafort Has Ties To Yanuckovitch" -- it's only later that they expanded it to Trump-Collusion-With-Putin. The Great TrumPutin Conspiracy Theory then gradually expanded to include those like Roger Stone. All of it based on innuendo, hearsay, and fractional facts (From Fractional Banking to Fractional Reporting to Fractional Justice System).

Are we talking about Trump or Putin? Because Putin's problems are exacerbated by his relationship to Trump, however even if Trump did not exist, Putin would still be a problem. Putin's anger toward the West date back specifically TO the end of the Cold War, the fall of the Berlin Wall to be specific. He was a station chief with the KGB in East Germany when it happened and he speaks of his feeling of humiliation.

NATO allies SHOULD pay more, however threatening to WITHDRAW from NATO (Trump's idea) is dangerous, however it IS exactly what Putin would want, which I find interesting.

Aha - the "enemy" and the "allies" - such a circular argument.
We label the enemy not for being a threat to us, but because he's a threat to our allies -- and of course our allies are defined as those in conflict with the enemy.
This is a totally circular argument designed to promote a particular narrative.

So you have difficulty with the fact that we have allies, fine...we'll remove the allies from the argument for your sake.

I'm not the one obsessed with fighting the Cold War -- it's your Lefty McCarthyites who are -- it's their so-called "patriotism" which is "the last refuge of scoundrels".

Here is where we must come to a FULL STOP because you appear to not understand what a McCarthyite is.
You will need to look it up and get the definition explained to you, because the term does not adapt to anything that is of the Left. But in any case, screeching about your hatred of liberals does not help your argument anyway.
We aren't fighting the Cold War. This is about America retaining sovereignty over its domestic and foreign policy independent of the wishes of Vladimir Putin.

Glad of you to mention that "Russia is no longer communist" - because there are a lot of Lefty shills who like to simply name-drop Moscow as America's "longtime enemy", along with "KGB Putin" -- both politicians and their media acolytes do this.

It looks as if you don't have the slightest idea of what a "Lefty" even is, because in the same breath you castigate liberals for being pals of communism and simultaneously accuse them of namedropping Moscow as America's enemy.
You can't have it both ways. It's impossible.
However, the classic knee-jerk reactionary paranoid accusation would be to imply that Lefties are buddy buddy with Moscow.
And that would make YOU the McCarthyite, seeing as how you're the extremist on the Right.

I almost wonder if you're just engaging in POE flip flopping, because no sane person would try to construct an argument with such pathetically lame descriptors.

Lefty McCarthyite indeed.... :lamo
 
You and Mueller don't just want Stone to talk -- you want him to Bear False Witness against your real target -- the legitimately elected President of the United States, Donald Trump.

Oh no, by all means he's free to talk all he wants. You kidding? Who said he shouldn't flap his gums?
Certainly not me. It's fun to watch him paint himself into a corner Giuliani style.
 
You and Mueller don't just want Stone to talk -- you want him to Bear False Witness against your real target -- the legitimately elected President of the United States, Donald Trump.

Uuuh - I think the point is that he has already born False Witness, and now it's time to come clean.
 
I never said Stone had honor, but it hasn't stopped the usual twists of my words with certain people.

You: "Good for him. A person who is not willing to fight for their own honor is a person whose life means very little."
Me: "Well, I mean Roger Stone has no integrity or honor."

I literally never claimed that you had said that; I was the one who stated that he had no honor. Do you honestly believe these two things are the same?
 
You: "Good for him. A person who is not willing to fight for their own honor is a person whose life means very little."
Me: "Well, I mean Roger Stone has no integrity or honor."

I literally never claimed that you had said that; I was the one who stated that he had no honor. Do you honestly believe these two things are the same?

I never said he had honor either... Stone can say whatever he wants. The fact is my statement is a general statement about those who believe they have honor and fight for things they feel is important to them.
Ready to move on now?
 
I never said he had honor either... Stone can say whatever he wants. The fact is my statement is a general statement about those who believe they have honor and fight for things they feel is important to them.
Ready to move on now?

Good, I'm glad we agree that Roger Stone has no honor.
 
Stone's big words appear not to have helped him.

"CBS reports that in the Roger Stone indictment, data was “released during the 2016 Election to damage Hillary Clinton.” Oh really! What about the Fake and Unverified “Dossier,” a total phony conjob, that was paid for by Crooked Hillary to damage me and the Trump Campaign? What about all of the one sided Fake Media coverage (collusion with Crooked H?) that I had to endure during my very successful presidential campaign. What about the now revealed bias by Facebook and many others. Roger Stone didn’t even work for me anywhere near the Election!"

-Trump

Trump is already distancing himself from Stone. This is following pretty much the same pattern that we saw unfold with Michael Cohen.
 
Back
Top Bottom