- Joined
- Jul 20, 2005
- Messages
- 20,688
- Reaction score
- 7,320
- Location
- Washington, DC
- Gender
- Male
- Political Leaning
- Liberal
They'll end up with a hostile government either way.
It's far too late, they've thrown their support behind Mubarak, people aren't gonna forget that.
I hope that pompous prick steps down though. The democratic aspirations of the Egyptian people outweigh America's need for a friendly Egypt.
And how exactly do you intend to do that? Rigging a foreign election.
There's no garuntee of this outcome if there's an election...
Better the devil you know... then the devil you don't...
I would not call for a rigged anything, but surely there is opposition to Mubarak that is pro-West and capable of bringing about reforms that Egypt desparately needs.
To stand behind him is to repeat mistakes of the past, Western support for the Shah comes to mind....
Quite frankly, anti-western rhetoric will go far in Egypt if there's an election...
Just because you're pro-Western, doesn't mean you'll be reformists... their president at the moment is pro-western, that can be used against any party that is.
Nationalist parties will do well I think.
I agree, but if I were in Washington I would throw my support behind ElBaradei.
I doubt a democratic Egypt could be described as a "US ally" or a "friendly Egypt," but there's no reason to think it will be a rogue state that destabilizes the region.
lol if I were in Washington...
That's not the only thing I would do :2razz:
I agree, but if I were in Washington I would throw my support behind ElBaradei.
lol if I were in Washington...
That's not the only thing I would do :2razz:
"We strongly support the democratic aspirations of the Egyptian people and unequivocally condemn violence against them. We urge President Mubarak to step down immediately, and for Mohammed ElBaradei to lead a transition government in the lead up to elections."
- What Hillary Clinton should say on national television. Right now. This may be Mubarak's last day in power.
If I were anything to do with the US government I'd stay well away from endorsing any candidate nor would I involve myself in Egypt's internal politics in any way. That would be a guarantee that those you oppose would win.
If I were anything to do with the US government I'd stay well away from endorsing any candidate nor would I involve myself in Egypt's internal politics in any way. That would be a guarantee that those you oppose would win.
Why? Who says that the Egyptian public wants ElBaradei to lead it in a transition government?
Apocalypse said:Hell, who says that the majority of Egyptians do not still support Mubarak?
Apocalypse said:A few tens of thousands of protesters mean nothing, only in Cairo there are almost 8 million people.
Unless we see this in a referendum or elections, let's not jump to conclusions and engage in such hyperbole arguments.
Then a very public announcement that we support the Muslim Brotherhood should do the trick then, eh?
Someone has to lead a transition government, and ElBaradei is the only prominent opposition figure who has offered himself up as far as I know. Whom would you suggest?
The fact that he won't stand for a free and fair election suggests as much.
Mubarak is done for, regardless of whether or not a majority of Egyptians support the protests.
It certainly wouldn't do El Baradei's chances any harm at all.
I wouldn't suggest anyone. It's not my job to do the suggestions just as it's not the American government's job.
It should happen naturally, the Egyptian nation should work it out itself.
Apocalypse said:That makes no sense, he himself cannot know the public's wishes, no one can unless you ask the entire public in a referendum or an elections.
Apocalypse said:In my opinion the Mubarak family will stay in the rule of Egypt for at least two more decades. His regime is quite more stable then most tend to think.
Why? Who says that the Egyptian public wants ElBaradei to lead it in a transition government? Hell, who says that the majority of Egyptians do not still support Mubarak?
A few tens of thousands of protesters mean nothing, only in Cairo there are almost 8 million people.
Unless we see this in a referendum or elections, let's not jump to conclusions and engage in such hyperbole arguments.
Who is "the Egyptian nation"? How do you propose they "work it out themselves"? If the international community does not help guide their transition to democracy, the likely result will be a scramble for power in the vacuum left by Mubarak's departure. That does not bode well for the democratic health of the nation. Far better to support ElBaradei or some other prominent figure who has shown an inclination to support the conditions necessary for a healthy democracy to emerge...namely free speech and free media.
Umm
I think that's what the protesters are demanding..
Mubarak is entirely dependent on the US for his survival.
How much confidence could you, we or the Egyptian people place in the results of a referendum or election conducted by the Mubarak regime? I agree that demonstrations by just a few thousand out of a population of 80 million cannot be assumed to represent the will of the majority and can be easily dismissed by the regime (look at how various regimes totally ignored 1.5 million+ person demonstrations against involvement in the Iraq war. There's a way to go yet, we in the West should keep our mouths shut and keep our fingers out of pies that our meddling could only spoil.
The Tunisians don't seem to need Western involvement to create a transition government. And as I said, it's not the responsibility of some external entity to promote one candidate or another, nor would it be accepted positively by the Egyptians as Anda pointed out above.
Apocalypse said:And unless a true referendum or elections happen you cannot expect the US to take one position or another as to who they believe the majority of Egypt support.
Apocalypse said:As I said my opinion is that he would "survive" and that his family would stay in rule of the regime for a long long time. That is my opinion, your opinion is different, and that's pretty much it.
I doubt a true referendum or elections would occur in Egypt truly, I was simply pointing out that unless we have those as evidence we simply cannot say who is the most supported candidate in Egypt.
The US has enough on its plate without stirring up trouble in Egypt. :roll:
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?