Putin agrees to ceqse fire. This should make the left angry. TRUMP DID IT

[bullseyelqcs]

It is a good conditional surrender. It will stop the loss of life.

Then why doesn't Russia just go ahead and conditionally walk away from someone elses sovereign territory, thus stopping the loss of life?

 

[Questerr]

No, just tired of wasting my time. Did you read the report I linked? I will bet you deny all the facts in it.

How is you addressing your open hypocrisy wasting your time?

Why does Ukraine have “feckless drones” because they had to attack the same target multiple times, but Russia doesn’t have “feckless missiles” even though they had to attack the same target multiple times?

How are you not just a mindless shill for Russia?

 

[iguanaman]

paywalled ^ you got anything else on sanctions and Russian extractions?

The whole net is getting paywalled. Check out post #171. Meanwhile take a look at this if you want the truth about Kurst.

 

[anatta]

@anatta where'd you go?

ya the Baltics and Finland. Finland already had a robust defense. So if that is all you care to criticize about my expansive post chosen to redact, im not going to bother further

 

[anatta]

The whole net is getting paywalled. Check out post #171. Meanwhile take a look at this if you want the truth about Kurst.

Ukraine’s retreat from Kursk appears to mark end of audacious operation

Some say incursion achieved many goals while others wonder if it cost Ukrainian lives for no tangible gain

www.theguardian.com

The Ukrainian retreat from the Kursk region, carried out in stages over the past two weeks, appears to mark the end of one of the most audacious and surprising operations of the conflict, and strips Ukraine of one of its few solid bargaining chips in possible peace negotiations with Russia.

For seven months, Ukraine held on to a chunk of Russian territory, including the town of Sudzha, which had a prewar population of about 5,000. It was the first time a foreign army had occupied Russian land since the second world war.

 

[iguanaman]

Ukraine’s retreat from Kursk appears to mark end of audacious operation

Some say incursion achieved many goals while others wonder if it cost Ukrainian lives for no tangible gain

www.theguardian.com

The Ukrainian retreat from the Kursk region, carried out in stages over the past two weeks, appears to mark the end of one of the most audacious and surprising operations of the conflict, and strips Ukraine of one of its few solid bargaining chips in possible peace negotiations with Russia.

For seven months, Ukraine held on to a chunk of Russian territory, including the town of Sudzha, which had a prewar population of about 5,000. It was the first time a foreign army had occupied Russian land since the second world war.

View attachment 67560772

The "tangible gain" was the diversion of 10's of 1000's of Russians from the frontlines in Ukraine and also a way to bring the war to Russian people. Both of those objectives were successful. Do you know how many Russian men and equipment were neutralized in the Kurst incursion? Zelensky ordered the withdrawal so Putin would not have Kurst as an excuse to refuse the ceasefire too. Of course he knew Putin would still not agree to anything but a surrender of Ukraine. He does not want peace.

 

[LouC]

Call me when there is a True Cease Fire brokered and it is not some lopsided agreement where Putin wins and Trump wins and Ukraine gets the shaft.

Of course, this war was promised to be ended by Donald Trump before he ever took office.

But it doesn't even appear he can get a 30 day cease fire squeezed out.

 

[anatta]

The "tangible gain" was the diversion of 10's of 1000's of Russians from the frontlines in Ukraine and also a way to bring the war to Russian people. Both of those objectives were successful. Do you know how many Russian men and equipment were neutralized in the Kurst incursion? Zelensky ordered the withdrawal so Putin would not have Kurst as an excuse to refuse the ceasefire too. Of course he knew Putin would still not agree to anything but a surrender of Ukraine. He does not want peace.

Nobody knows. but batles of attrition do not favor Ukr
we do know the 2nd front reduced troops and abilities in Donbas - and the gains in Kursk were not held.
Did Z actually order a withdrawal? i see no evidence of that

 

[iguanaman]

Nobody knows. but batles of attrition do not favor Ukr
we do know the 2nd front reduced troops and abilities in Donbas - and the gains in Kursk were not held.
Did Z actually order a withdrawal? i see no evidence of that

Kurst was held as long as Ukraine wanted to. When the vast majority of the attrition is on the Russian side it certainly benefits Ukraine more. Ukraine is taking ground now in Ukraine and the Russia offensive has stalled. These are the facts and your attitude that Russia is somehow an invincible force is also laughable. They are losing and will lose this war.

 

[anatta]

Kurst was held as long as Ukraine wanted to.

lol. it wanted it's offensive to stall and get pushed back? that is serious fiction

When the vast majority of the attrition is on the Russian side it certainly benefits Ukraine more.

the numbers are basically made up estimates with prejudice

Ukraine is taking ground now in Ukraine and the Russia offensive has stalled.

Russia gained 4000 sq kilometers in 2024

These are the facts and your attitude that Russia is somehow an invincible force is also laughable. They are losing and will lose this war.

your facts are unsupported wish lists

 

[Questerr]

ya the Baltics and Finland. Finland already had a robust defense. So if that is all you care to criticize about my expansive post chosen to redact, im not going to bother further

How does Russia get NATO off their borders when NATO has been on their border for over a decade? The Baltic states aren’t going to agree to quit NATO. Neither will Finland.

So how is it “doable”?

 

[Lord of Planar]

Then why doesn't Russia just go ahead and conditionally walk away from someone elses sovereign territory, thus stopping the loss of life?

Why should they? They now occupy much of east Ukraine. Why should they walk away?

 

[Hamish Howl]

So, @Theowl32

How's that cease fire holding up?

 

[Lord of Planar]

How is you addressing your open hypocrisy wasting your time?

Why does Ukraine have “feckless drones” because they had to attack the same target multiple times, but Russia doesn’t have “feckless missiles” even though they had to attack the same target multiple times?

How are you not just a mindless shill for Russia?

Have you looked at the damage cause by attacked at the two facilities? Who has recovered faster?

This topic doesn't matter as much as there is little trusted fact to go by.

Back to the reason of the war to begin with. You should read that report that was linked, and I linked again.

Do you want the link again? Here it is.

https://www.mearsheimer.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/Why-the-Ukraine-Crisis-Is.pdf

Get yourself inform by more than just the propaganda you have.

 

[Peter]

I want the fighting to stop and for Russia to **** off out of Ukraine.

I don't care if Trump is in power when it happens.

 

[anatta]

How does Russia get NATO off their borders when NATO has been on their border for over a decade? The Baltic states aren’t going to agree to quit NATO. Neither will Finland.

So how is it “doable”?

i said "Ya" and noted the northern exceptions.
Maybe Putin meant no further NATO states. Maybe he meant getting the Baltics out of NATO..lol no. Anyways who cares what he meant?
Negotiation to include no further NATO expansion is what it will boil down to -if it gets that far.

in 1994 Georgia joined the NATO-run Partnership for Peace.

NATO would encircle Russia if it could. Putin has no choice but to resist any expansion. But he cant undo it either

 

[Questerr]

Have you looked at the damage cause by attacked at the two facilities? Who has recovered faster?

This topic doesn't matter as much as there is little trusted fact to go by.

Back to the reason of the war to begin with. You should read that report that was linked, and I linked again.

Do you want the link again? Here it is.

https://www.mearsheimer.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/Why-the-Ukraine-Crisis-Is.pdf

Get yourself inform by more than just the propaganda you have.

Why are you moving the goalposts? Anything to defend Russia’s war of aggression apparently.

 

[Questerr]

i said "Ya" and noted the northern exceptions.
Maybe Putin meant no further NATO states. Maybe he meant getting the Baltics out of NATO..lol no. Anyways who cares what he meant?
Negotiation to include no further NATO expansion is what it will boil down to -if it gets that far.


NATO would encircle Russia if it could. Putin has no choice but to resist any expansion. But he cant undo it either

Why does it matter if Ukraine is added to NATO for “NATO on Russia’s borders” if NATO has been on Russia’s border for a couple decades now?

NATO is a defensive alliance. If Russia doesn’t attack NATO that “encirclement” doesn’t matter.

BTW, resistance to “encirclement” is what drove the militarist expansionism of the German Empire prior to WW1. Are you saying Russia wants to follow in their footsteps?

 

[Manc Skipper]

The whole net is getting paywalled. Check out post #171. Meanwhile take a look at this if you want the truth about Kurst.

The world according to Putin. How's reality?

 

[anatta]

Why does it matter if Ukraine is added to NATO for “NATO on Russia’s borders” if NATO has been on Russia’s border for a couple decades now?

do you get Ukraine is a different then the Baltics towards Russia? Russia and Ukraine are many close ties

NATO is a defensive alliance. If Russia doesn’t attack NATO that “encirclement” doesn’t matter.

then NATO expansion NEVER matters

BTW, resistance to “encirclement” is what drove the militarist expansionism of the German Empire prior to WW1. Are you saying Russia wants to follow in their footsteps?

what? stick to the topic

 

[Questerr]

do you get Ukraine is a different then the Baltics towards Russia? Russia and Ukraine are many close ties

then NATO expansion NEVER matters

what? stick to the topic

Russia has just as many “close ties” with the Baltic States.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Why are you moving the goalposts? Anything to defend Russia’s war of aggression apparently.

In many ways I do defend Russia on this. I understand why they took action against the Nazi's of Ukraine.

Have you read the material I linked yet?

 

[iguanaman]

Call me when there is a True Cease Fire brokered and it is not some lopsided agreement where Putin wins and Trump wins and Ukraine gets the shaft.

Of course, this war was promised to be ended by Donald Trump before he ever took office.

But it doesn't even appear he can get a 30 day cease fire squeezed out.

Actually now according to Trump his promise of peace in 24 hours was "sarcasm". He is so full of it that he just uses his lies as excuses now.

Quote from Trump: "Well, I was being a little bit sarcastic when I said that I would. What I really meant is I would like to get it settled, and I think I will be successful."

https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-promise-end-war-ukraine-192413827.html

 

[Questerr]

In many ways I do defend Russia on this. I understand why they took action against the Nazi's of Ukraine.

Have you read the material I linked yet?

The Jewish Nazis of Ukraine?

 

[iguanaman]

In many ways I do defend Russia on this. I understand why they took action against the Nazi's of Ukraine.

Have you read the material I linked yet?

Putin is the fascist and that is why he is the first leader to send his tanks rolling into a european country since that other fascist 75 years ago. What was his name again? Fascist like to invade their neighbors and kill a lot of people to steal their stuff.