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Oh, The GOP Sure Showed Obama...

Unitedwestand13 said:
The republicans did the health care law a favor because the government shutdown actually overshadowed the problems in the activation of the exchanges
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Nah, people still hate this thing. Problem is the Republicans didn't play their hand correctly. Nobody, including those inconvenienced were going to keep blaming one side, with Obamacare, this thing is going to fester and get worse, there is no silver lining.
 
washunut said:
As a lifelong democrat, although I think they have strayed comments like yours bring me back to why I am part of a party that is more of an open tent.
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There is no such thing as an open tent party. Parties just use the idea of an open tent to pull people in that they never actually even bother to represent.
 
LaMidRighter said:
This is why I left the Republican party, no spine and even less convictions. Obama is a horrible negotiator and a worse White House occupant.
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I dunno, from the looks of it he appears to be a pretty good negotiator if this story holds up.
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
More a function of the incompetence of the GOP leadership than Obama successfully navigating that mess.
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The need to both govern pragmatically and appease the frothing-at-the-mouth nutbars has basically turned the GOP leadership into a circular firing squad.
 
LaMidRighter said:
Then the court of public opinion decides who is holding the bad hand. Honestly, there is an unpopular law that people want gone, and the people refusing to talk were the ones refusing to negotiate on it, that kind of leverage is incredible, and like the wimps they are, the GOP pissed it away. That is why they are a dying party destined to fail, and unfortunately when they have to be replaced it's going to cost more than they can ever imagine.
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That one-third of the people want gone.

Welcome to Forbes
 
Kobie said:
I dunno, from the looks of it he appears to be a pretty good negotiator if this story holds up.
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Winning a negotiation is not the same thing as being a good negotiator. If the other side is equally bad you just have a bad negotiating process.
 
Perotista said:
No it is not. From what I have seen of the president and this is only my opinion.
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I meant odd in the sense that he clearly has crowd skills and charisma, but won't/can't use those to push policy. And he clearly has public speaking skills that allow him to move his audience on an emotional level. he just can't talk policy for ****.

So what you get is a great feel good speech about some vague, wishy washy notion like 'we should not hate". But complete ineptitude when that sentiment is attempted to be translated in policy or something more concrete

But I agree with pretty much everything else. And it really solidifies the accusations about inexperience


He has basically been in the campaign mode since day one and not a governing mode. Remember it was Biden and McConnell who came to the agreements needed after the GOP took over the house. Obama just doesn't like to talk to Republicans or work the phones or to really use the bully pulpit and put political capital on the line to get things passed and done.

His main use of the bully pulpit for his first four years was everything was Bush the Seconds fault and now everything is the Republicans fault. That is what all his speeches consisted of, I don't listen to him anymore. If it weren't for the Republicans being their own worst enemy, worst than any Democrat, Obama would be on the ropes today.
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Kobie said:
The need to both govern pragmatically and appease the frothing-at-the-mouth nutbars has basically turned the GOP leadership into a circular firing squad.
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where does pragmatism play into their current strategy?
 
LaMidRighter said:
Who knows why those polls failed? Honestly, Obama is the worst thing that's ever happened to the White House, and there are extremist clowns that are screwing this country up in both parties. To be honest, Romney was no threat to Obama, and I'm on record as saying such.
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Those polls failed? The 2012 election polls proved accurate.
 
LaMidRighter said:
Yeah, the Congress is showing slightly higher approval than cockroaches(both parties, deserved) but slightly higher than Obamacare. It's a toss up.
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Congress' approval is dwarfed by Obamacare approval.
 
Kobie said:
Those polls failed? The 2012 election polls proved accurate.
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Yeah, apples and oranges. The fact is that a lot of people who didn't like Romney sat the election out, there weren't any real threats to the Senate in 2012 because a lot of those districts were "locked in" to the incumbent, and the races were still close. Now, polling on Obamacare shows less than 30% approval, and dropping. See, I'm actually a registered Libertarian, and am disgusted with both parties, I would love to see them both lose membership and go the way of the Whigs and Torries to be replaced with either general candidates or new caucuses.
 
Kobie said:
Realizing that they had overplayed their hand, in this case.
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I guess you could make that argument, but that's like saying it was pragmatic to buy that fire extinguisher after you decided to build that bonfire in your living room
 
Kobie said:
No they're not.

RealClearPolitics - Election Other - Public Approval of Health Care Law

And the Forbes poll wasn't about approval. It was about repeal, which is the way it gets gone.
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Actually, repeal is about 60% for in every poll I've seen, approval is below 30%, so either way your claim that "only" 1/3 of the people want repeal or replacement is not completely accurate. Sure, a poll here or there may say that, but overall the polling of it is not good, and it shouldn't be. As a former insurance professional I will tell you flat out that bill is a catastrophe, but it was written by idiots on behalf of lobbyists so of course it's going to suck.
 
LaMidRighter said:
Yeah, apples and oranges. The fact is that a lot of people who didn't like Romney sat the election out, there weren't any real threats to the Senate in 2012 because a lot of those districts were "locked in" to the incumbent, and the races were still close. Now, polling on Obamacare shows less than 30% approval, and dropping. See, I'm actually a registered Libertarian, and am disgusted with both parties, I would love to see them both lose membership and go the way of the Whigs and Torries to be replaced with either general candidates or new caucuses.
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One poll shows less than 30% approval, in the link I provided. And no, it's not dropping. RCP poll averages bottomed out at 38 percent in mid-September; they've bounced between 38 and 40 (well within the margin of error) ever since.

RealClearPolitics - Election Other - Public Approval of Health Care Law

I'll continue to post these numbers when you quit claiming that all polls have ACA approval below 30%.
 
LaMidRighter said:
Actually, repeal is about 60% for in every poll I've seen, approval is below 30%, so either way your claim that "only" 1/3 of the people want repeal or replacement is not completely accurate. Sure, a poll here or there may say that, but overall the polling of it is not good, and it shouldn't be. As a former insurance professional I will tell you flat out that bill is a catastrophe, but it was written by idiots on behalf of lobbyists so of course it's going to suck.
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Then link one. The Forbes poll I linked says 1/3 want repeal. If you have a poll that is DOUBLE that, please, share it with the class.

It's becoming patently obvious that when people post links that refute what you are claiming, you don't read them, and instead continue to claim things that aren't true.
 
LaMidRighter said:
Let me tell you something. Neither party represents this republic anymore, and neither deserves to exist further. Honestly, if you think me pointing it out is helping either party then I don't know what to tell you. Obama, Reid, Pelosi, Feinstein, and the most of the Democrat representatives are complete incompetents, they pass laws on things they have no knowledge of, overregulate, kill economies, and then tell you they did you a favor. Republicans tend to be people who have a better idea of how things work, but politically they are a bunch of Barney Fifes.
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I agree with a lot of what you are saying. That being said, sadly we realistically only have two choices of who ww will be governed by. That is all I was trying to say.
 
To Tea Partiers,

Welcome to reality. Grow up and stop rebelling like teenagers and hippies.

Sincerely,

The Establishment.
 
Fiddytree said:
To Tea Partiers,

Welcome to reality. Grow up and stop rebelling like teenagers.

Sincerely,

The Establishment.
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dear establisment,

we are unfortunately unable to process your message due to the recent shut down, and we are currentlly understaffed to handle the processing of messages or able to walk and chew gum at the same time.

sincerely yours

the u.s postal service
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
where does pragmatism play into their current strategy?
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Well, I think the assumption has been that the GOP's absurd strategy was directed at the Democrats and the President. I don't think that's the case anymore. I think the strategy was an attempt by Boehner to both appease the teapartiers (let's call them the freaks), while not taking their brinksmanship so far that traditional Republicans (let's call them the normals) would be unable to compete in national or statewide elections in the near future.

This whole farce was an attempt by Boehner to show the freaks that the normals respect them and want them to stay in the party, while at the same time trying not to let the freaks drive the normals into a position that will result in a complete inability to compete in national (or even statewide) elections.

Whether it has succeeded or not won't be known unless and until there's an agreement, and Cruz, along with the rightwing noise machine, makes its decision to either stick with the normals or disown them completely, either by starting a third party or by initiating an internecine war to take control of the RNC. I'm not quite sure which result I'm rooting for.
 
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One of the new strategies of the republican party, as advocated by Paul Ryan in the WSJ, is to shift the emphasis, instead of abandon, from Obamacare to entitlement reform!

LOOK NOW THEY WANT TO RAISE THE RETIREMENT AGE!!! IS THAT WHAT WE WANT??
 
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