Officer charged with 2nd-degree manslaughter in Daunte Wright killing

[Checkerboard Strangler]

I agree. But I thought their mission is to protect and serve...

So called "warrior training" is new. It is not the kind of policing most of us grew up with.
It is adapted from military training, and civilians are now viewed as "the enemy".

Don't take my word for it.

 

[joko104]

But wasn't it show in the shooting of the unarmed Capital protester that the ONLY force police should ever use is deadly force? Single near point blank shot? Every Democrat on the forum on that topic insists that non-lethal force should never be used by police.

 

[Grizzly Adams]

As an officer, you have to know where each weapon is, what weapon you are pulling out, using on someone. It is not okay to use your gun when you meant to use your taser. Those are two different weapons and used in different circumstances. She made a mistake, but it was one that cost another person their life. (Technically, she and her trainee made many smaller mistakes before that, but none of those were the same as the one she made that killed the suspect.)

Okay, but that's not consciously taking the chance of death or serious physical injury, so far as I can tell.

 

[Grizzly Adams]

Yes. Legally and morally, yes. There are numerous incidences of taser fatalities. By statute it is defined as a dangerous weapon on that basis. Dangerous weapon:

Minnesota Statutes SS 609.02 DEFINITIONS. Note also, it is not "non-lethal" but intended to be "less than lethal force".

Okay, but what is the relevance of that principle to this situation? I think any reasonable person would agree that ECD deployment in this scenario would be within the bounds of a reasonable use of force. If that's the case, use of an ECD isn't an unreasonable and conscious risk of death or serious physical injury.

 

[Grizzly Adams]

Why am I not surprised that you cannot figure out what the point could possibly be in comparing a black man who is shot dead because he looked like he might want to flee ...

....and a video of a 61 year old white man allowed to stay in his pickup even as it tries to escape, striking police cars, and even with one cop right there at the drivers' side...even as it dangerously lurches forward and side-to-side, threatening those cops lives.




The old white dude was allowed to literally drive off with a cop still hanging from the driver's side window and Grizzly things "deeeeee-erp, I don't see a point here" proves something about Checkerboard's post.

Yes, I can't imagine even a single reason why a cop on top of a fleeing vehicle might want to avoid turning that vehicle into an uncontrolled two-ton missile. Not a single one.

 

[Grizzly Adams]

+

​

MINNEAPOLIS (WCCO) — Hutchinson police say a 61-year-old man is in custody after allegedly dragging an officer with his vehicle while simultaneously striking him with a hammer following a dispute about face masks at a Menards store. . . The suspect led the officer on a slow-speed chase that ended near the Hutchinson Mall off Highway 15 and Freemont Avenue Southwest. The officer approached the car, then became stuck in the driver’s side window. The suspect sped off with the officer hanging on, and then struck him on the head with a hammer.​

Police: Man Drags Hutchinson Officer With Vehicle, Hits Him With Hammer After Face Mask Dispute

Hutchinson police say a 61-year-old man is in custody after allegedly dragging an officer with his vehicle while simultaneously striking him with a hammer following a dispute about face masks at a Menards store.

minnesota.cbslocal.com

And @Grizzly Adams can't figure out why someone might have brought it up.





These threads are as predictable as they are degenerate. Fess up. It's not that you have some consistent view about policing that you are applying to different situations with different results. You just don't give a **** when it's dead black dude.

No, I don't think you give a **** when it's a dead black dude.

See, I can make up BS racist garbage just as easily as you can.

 

[Integrityrespec]

Then he would still be alive and the cops could arrest him another day. There was no need to shoot the guy-or tase him for that matter. That's the easy way out.

Of course that's ignoring their job and responsibility. Plus, what if the criminal goes out and committs another crime, maybe murder or rape, before the police manage to relocate him. Oh, and then he runs again so the cops need to just let him go again. What a stupid idea. Don't make and arrest because the criminal doesn't want to get arrested. What a damn fool idea.

 

[Lethargic Aptitude]

I don't believe police negligent discharges should be criminally prosecuted. Unless it can be proven this was more than a horrible mistake.

Why?

 

[Lethargic Aptitude]

Of course that's ignoring their job and responsibility. Plus, what if the criminal goes out and committs another crime, maybe murder or rape, before the police manage to relocate him. Oh, and then he runs again so the cops need to just let him go again. What a stupid idea. Don't make and arrest because the criminal doesn't want to get arrested. What a damn fool idea.

So shoot em, because they might do something else and why waste the prefect time to shoot someone?

 

[snakestretcher]

Of course that's ignoring their job and responsibility. Plus, what if the criminal goes out and committs another crime, maybe murder or rape, before the police manage to relocate him. Oh, and then he runs again so the cops need to just let him go again. What a stupid idea. Don't make and arrest because the criminal doesn't want to get arrested. What a damn fool idea.

Cops do it all the time when, for example, a car chase is abandoned when deemed too dangerous to continue. But what if the driver goes off and commits another crime...?
You can 'what if' as much as you like but you're not a clairvoyant.

 

[roguenuke]

Okay, but that's not consciously taking the chance of death or serious physical injury, so far as I can tell.

Yes it is. At least as much as the drunk driver who wouldn't even know be aware that they are drunk necessarily when they get behind the wheel of their car. And if any of us did what she did, there wouldn't even be any question that it was negligent homicide.

I'm not even saying tazing him would have been wrong. But you have to know which one is your taser and which one is your gun.

 

[Grizzly Adams]

Yes it is. At least as much as the drunk driver who wouldn't even know be aware that they are drunk necessarily when they get behind the wheel of their car. And if any of us did what she did, there wouldn't even be any question that it was negligent homicide.

I'm not even saying tazing him would have been wrong. But you have to know which one is your taser and which one is your gun.

You're not arguing with me, you're arguing with the phrasing of the statute. Requiring that the risk of death or serious physical injury be consciously taken means something. Your interpretation eliminates the operation of that requirement.

 

[HangLow]

​

 

[Tonawanda]

I don't believe police negligent discharges should be criminally prosecuted. Unless it can be proven this was more than a horrible mistake.

Unfortunately, it is very negligent, and a very horrible mistake. Some don't agree.

April 14, 2021
There are no accidents in police terror and white supremacy.
BLM

 

[ecofarm]

Unfortunately, it is very negligent, and a very horrible mistake. Some don't agree.

April 14, 2021
There are no accidents in police terror and white supremacy.
BLM

I don't suspect it was more than a horrible mistake. Granted, attitudes about black people are unique in a racist society and no one escapes all personal prejudice ingrained in language and culture over thousands of years, but I'm not seeing other than a horrible mistake.

Negligence? Okay. Sufficient to bring personal charges against an on-duty act? I don't think so. It's certainly not "depraved indifference", right? I think negligence worthy of charges needs to include the opportunity, however brief, to change one's choice of action. There was not time for the officer to reconsider their action; it was a mistake and not malevolent.

 

[sjmay]

I don't suspect it was more than a horrible accident. Granted, attitudes about black people are unique in a racist society and no one escapes all personal prejudice ingrained in language and culture over thousands of years, but I'm not seeing other than a horrible mistake.

Negligence? Okay. Sufficient to bring personal charges against an on-duty act? I don't think so. It's certainly not "depraved indifference", right? I think negligence worthy of charges needs to include the opportunity, however brief, to change one's choice of action.

I don't necessarily disagree with you, and I don't necessarily agree with you either...

This is one of those moments, where you almost have to take in the totality of the circumstances and see what's best. What has Potter's career been like up until now, does not prosecuting her send the wrong message, does prosecuting her, send the wrong message....

It's one of those situation where there is no clear cut right or wrong, and no matter what they do, someone is gonna be pissed, not that that is something that should be factored in, it's just reality.

I still think a good outcome of this, is 5 year suspended sentence, convicted felon status etc. That disqualifies her from any law enforcement position etc,

 

[ecofarm]

I don't necessarily disagree with you, and I don't necessarily agree with you either...

This is one of those moments, where you almost have to take in the totality of the circumstances and see what's best. What has Potter's career been like up until now, does not prosecuting her send the wrong message, does prosecuting her, send the wrong message....

It's one of those situation where there is no clear cut right or wrong, and no matter what they do, someone is gonna be pissed, not that that is something that should be factored in, it's just reality.

I still think a good outcome of this, is 5 year suspended sentence, convicted felon status etc. That disqualifies her from any law enforcement position etc,

I don't agree with your conclusion but I'm with you until there.

 

[sjmay]

I don't agree with your conclusion but I'm with you until there.

Fair enough, I just think there has to be some other consequence other than, being allowed to resign and fade into the shadows.....

I'm in agreement with you, horrible accident.....but even those have consequences, I'm just not sure just losing her job is suffice.

 

[ecofarm]

Fair enough, I just think there has to be some other consequence other than, being allowed to resign and fade into the shadows.....

I'm in agreement with you, horrible accident.....but even those have consequences, I'm just not sure just losing her job is suffice.

Should our concern be with her or the victim's family. Not that we can't do both, but where's the justice. I'm not feeling justice from the cop's prosecution.

 

[sjmay]

Should our concern be with her or the victim's family. Not that we can't do both, but where's the justice.

There is no "justice" in this case, to me, justice comes into play when intent is there....

Both families are now tragically altered, and the cops family is going to blame the kid running, and the kid's family is going to blame the cop, and they are both right.

 

[ecofarm]

There is no "justice" in this case, to me, justice comes into play when intent is there....

Both families are now tragically altered, and the cops family is going to blame the kid running, and the kid's family is going to blame the cop, and they are both right.

All blame is on the cop. That's the logical outcome of the admission of a mistake.

Justice is what makes society worthwhile. It's what makes signing the Social Contract worthwhile. Do I feel justice is served in regard to the cop's prosecution? Not really. But I would in regard to the victim's family being helped by the people.

 

[ecofarm]

Is punishing cops for making mistakes justice? No. Justice is better trained cops or better equipment. Punishing them for stupid horrible mistakes doesn't change anything.

If there is malevolence, maliciousness, any non-duty intent, then prosecution is justice. But prosecuting mistakes? That's not justice.

 

[Cope]

Is punishing cops for making mistakes justice? No. Justice is better trained cops or better equipment. Punishing them for stupid horrible mistakes doesn't change anything.

If there is malevolence, maliciousness, any non-duty intent, then prosecution is justice. But prosecuting mistakes? That's not justice.

Punishment for cops isn't "justice" per say but they do need to realize that mistakes that cost lives, have consequences.

 

[ecofarm]

Punishment for cops isn't "justice" per say but they do need to realize that mistakes that cost lives, have consequences.

If we presume them human, that's kinda taken care of. Where's the justice.

 

[Tonawanda]

I don't suspect it was more than a horrible mistake. Granted, attitudes about black people are unique in a racist society and no one escapes all personal prejudice ingrained in language and culture over thousands of years, but I'm not seeing other than a horrible mistake.

Negligence? Okay. Sufficient to bring personal charges against an on-duty act? I don't think so. It's certainly not "depraved indifference", right? I think negligence worthy of charges needs to include the opportunity, however brief, to change one's choice of action. There was not time for the officer to reconsider their action; it was a mistake and not malevolent.