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Muslims cannot integrate into West

rogerredy

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A trained danish psychologist who worked closely with muslims for 3 years in Denmark has made this claim in his book, and he uses facts and research to support his claim.

Read his interview here, very interesting stuff that the left and awful political leadership of europe should be embracing, but instead prefer to redirect their own muslim citizens' anger with endless UN resolutions against israel.

See:

Integration Of Muslims In Western Societies Is Not Possible | Global Terrorism
 

Infinite Chaos

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From the article

Currently 70% of the prison population in the Copenhagen youth prison consists of young man of Muslim heritage. Is this recent violence and general violent tendency among Muslims solely coincidental, or is there a direct connection?

From what I recall, there was not too long ago a time when a large number of prisoners in UK prisons were black, a large number of young black men were unemployed and a large number of certain crimes were percieved to be mainly committed by young black men...

Did anyone (apart from the extreme right) say blacks couldn't integrate?

Does anyone (apart from the extreme right) still say that blacks can't integrate?

"nuff said."
 

Sylviane88

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This article is absolutely unfair ... But let me ask you how can muslims integrate in a society that is full of hatred against them (like Denmark)... Many of people hate islam for a reason that is false ... this reason is created by other people who call themselves: "muslims", however, indeed, they do everything prohibited by Islam and refused by any mind ... killing the non-muslims for no reason ! ... killing even the muslims for no reason ! ... their goal is hidden: it's to make Islam seems to be bad, intolerant of other religions.

there is no relationship between those people and islam.

why must islam pay for what those did ? ... They claim they are muslims however they do what is prohibited by islam !!!
Islam is never responsible of what those terrorits do, why don't blame them ?
Quran said in [2:256]: ""There is no compulsion in religion; truly the right way has become clearly distinct from error; therefore, whoever rejects Satan (and what he calls to) and believes in Allah, he indeed has laid hold on the firmest handhold, which shall not break off, and Allah is Hearing, Knowing."""

Muhammad, The Messenger of Allah said, "One who kills a non-Muslim person under protection will not even smell the fragrance of Paradise."

he also said: ""Whoever hurts a non-Muslim person under protection, I am his adversary, and I shall be an adversary to him on the Day of Resurrection""
The Qur'an commands Muslims to stick up for themselves in a defensive battle -- i.e. if an enemy army attacks, then Muslims are to fight against that army until they stop their aggression. All of the verses that speak about fighting/war in the Qur'an are in this context.
 

Laila

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This article is absolutely unfair ... But let me ask you how can muslims integrate in a society that is full of hatred against them (like Denmark)... Many of people hate islam for a reason that is false ... this reason is created by other people who call themselves: "muslims", however, indeed, they do everything prohibited by Islam and refused by any mind ... killing the non-muslims for no reason ! ... killing even the muslims for no reason ! ... their goal is hidden: it's to make Islam seems to be bad, intolerant of other religions.

Muslims must integrate into society regardless of whether some within a society hates them or not.
Blacks were once despised in US by the majority white but they got over it, so can Muslims.

I hate this victim status some Muslims are trying to claim in Europe. The simple fact is Muslims have more freedom in Europe than they ever would have in their own countries. Be grateful and be quiet.
 

reefedjib

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... killing the non-muslims for no reason ! ... killing even the muslims for no reason ! ...

Why the difference in emphasis between killing non-muslims and muslims? Are muslims more special?
 

Sylviane88

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Why the difference in emphasis between killing non-muslims and muslims? Are muslims more special?

I didn't mean so, I meant that those terrorists -doing that- are not implementing the islamic law, unlike many people may think.

and killing muslims is the most obvious proof that those terrorists are not muslims, even if they claim so.

that's all ... God bless you. and don't try to make me racist ... our prophet said:"""All mankind is from Adam and Eve, an Arab has no superiority over a non-Arab nor a non-Arab has any superiority over an Arab; also a white has no superiority over a black nor a black has any superiority over a white - except by piety and good action."""
 

Sylviane88

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Muslims must integrate into society regardless of whether some within a society hates them or not.
Blacks were once despised in US by the majority white but they got over it, so can Muslims.

I don't say muslims don't want to integrate into western countries .. I said they have some difficulties to do so.

PS. just a question: aren't you muslim ?
 

Laila

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I don't say muslims don't want to integrate into western countries .. I said they have some difficulties to do so.

PS. just a question: aren't you muslim ?

Your point?
There are difficulties in every group integrating into a society. No one said it would be a easy ride.
 

alexa

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Muslims must integrate into society regardless of whether some within a society hates them or not.
Blacks were once despised in US by the majority white but they got over it, so can Muslims.

I hate this victim status some Muslims are trying to claim in Europe. The simple fact is Muslims have more freedom in Europe than they ever would have in their own countries. Be grateful and be quiet.

I appreciate your view Laila. Blacks had a pretty difficult time here too until the 80's when we made changes.

Did you see Monday nights panorama? I sure as heck would not be wanting to integrate into any of that.

I think we do still have issues in this country to deal with regarding racism towards Asian Muslims and yes of course they need to integrate too but I think we need to deal with both sides of the problem.

I came upon this site with this book you can download for free called Identity and Belonging.

It certainly raised issues I had not realised before. You can download it here

Identity and Belonging in a Changing Great Britain | Facing History and Ourselves

I know nothing about how things are in Denmark though.
 

Laila

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I appreciate your view Laila. Blacks had a pretty difficult time here too until the 80's when we made changes.

Did you see Monday nights panorama? I sure as heck would not be wanting to integrate into any of that.

I think we do still have issues in this country to deal with regarding racism towards Asian Muslims and yes of course they need to integrate too but I think we need to deal with both sides of the problem.

I came upon this site with this book you can download for free called Identity and Belonging.

It certainly raised issues I had not realised before. You can download it here

Identity and Belonging in a Changing Great Britain | Facing History and Ourselves

I know nothing about how things are in Denmark though.

Yes I did and it is sad that Asian Muslims still have to go through that but simply refusing to integrate because some ignorant members of society dislike you helps no one but them and achieves nothing in the long run.
 

reefedjib

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I didn't mean so, I meant that those terrorists -doing that- are not implementing the islamic law, unlike many people may think.

and killing muslims is the most obvious proof that those terrorists are not muslims, even if they claim so.

But if they had only killed non-muslims, they'd be square with the Prophet?

that's all ... God bless you. and don't try to make me racist ... our prophet said:"""All mankind is from Adam and Eve, an Arab has no superiority over a non-Arab nor a non-Arab has any superiority over an Arab; also a white has no superiority over a black nor a black has any superiority over a white - except by piety and good action."""

Race has nothing to do with it. It is about believers and non-believers. Yet it seems a muslim has superiority over a non-muslim. The allegiance of a muslim is to being muslim before being to the country they are living in. That's a problem.
 

Sylviane88

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But if they had only killed non-muslims, they'd be square with the Prophet?

let our prophet answer you:"""One who kills a non-Muslim person under protection will not even smell the fragrance of Paradise."""
"""Whoever hurts a non-Muslim person under protection, I am his adversary, and I shall be an adversary to him on the Day of Resurrection."""

Race has nothing to do with it. It is about believers and non-believers. Yet it seems a muslim has superiority over a non-muslim. The allegiance of a muslim is to being muslim before being to the country they are living in. That's a problem.

I follow Islam as a religion ... a man who does sth prohibited by Islam does not represent more than himself ... islam is quite innocent.

For example I will not say that christianity call to kill just because Hitler was a christian and killed so many people in the name of his creed
 
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alexa

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Yes I did and it is sad that Asian Muslims still have to go through that but simply refusing to integrate because some ignorant members of society dislike you helps no one but them and achieves nothing in the long run.

Well clearly they couldn't integrate into that kind of society - they would be dead!

I remember plenty of Asian Muslims integrating in the 80's. I am also aware they were the group who people often seemed to think were exempt from bothering to take care not to be racist to.

Also lets not forget Asian Muslims do integrate - just not them all.

If you can manage try and read the book. I found it very interesting.
 

B L Zeebub

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I don't say muslims don't want to integrate into western countries .. I said they have some difficulties to do so.

PS. just a question: aren't you Muslim ?
Should they not follow the prophets word, and leave the country to find one that is more accommodating?
 

reefedjib

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let our prophet answer you:"""One who kills a non-Muslim person under protection will not even smell the fragrance of Paradise."""
"""Whoever hurts a non-Muslim person under protection, I am his adversary, and I shall be an adversary to him on the Day of Resurrection."""

But what about a non-muslim not under protection?



I follow Islam as a religion ... a man who does sth prohibited by Islam does not represent more than himself ... islam is quite innocent.

I don't really understand what you are saying. Islam and the associated works of interpretation does specify a system of jurisprudence does it not? This would be at odds with a countries system of jurisprudence. I understand that in some western countries, muslims are demanding that they try criminals under this alternate system of juriprudence. I am sorry, I cannot recall the name for this.

For example I will not say that christianity call to kill just because Hitler was a christian and killed so many people in the name of his creed

I don't really understand what you are saying. People following Christianity have killed millions of people.
 

Infinite Chaos

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-- Did you see Monday nights panorama? --

It was horrible car-crash TV that I could only watch with my hands half covering my eyes. I watched and squirmed in horror for 10 minutes and had to turn the TV off.

I so wanted to think our society had moved beyond this - even our sink estates and it was horrible to be reminded how nasty some people still are.
 

Oftencold

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Actually, it was the Democrats in America at least -- the Left that opposed civil
Rights and thereby integration of Blacks into Society. But aside from being incorrect you point is irrelevant.
 

Sylviane88

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But what about a non-muslim not under protection?

First do you understand what does "under protection" mean ?

It means a non-muslim living in an islamic country.

Muslims in a non-islamic country should follow the law of the new country .. because the law of islam is implemented only in the islamic countries.

this was the answer of your next question: what about non-muslims living in non-islamic country ?:)

I don't really understand what you are saying.

I mean Islam should not be the responsible of the behaviour of some of who call themselves: "muslims".
 
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rogerredy

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This article is absolutely unfair

Why - because it exposes the wretchedness of islamic culture?

... But let me ask you how can muslims integrate in a society that is full of hatred against them (like Denmark)

Why do you blame Denmark instead of asking what are muslims doing to drive that hatred? You are doing EXACTLY what the author says muslims consistently do, which is completely avoid ANY self-reflection, which in this case is questioning what YOU as muslims are doing that the larger Danish society finds unacceptable.

... Many of people hate islam for a reason that is false ... this reason is created by other people who call themselves: "muslims", however, indeed, they do everything prohibited by Islam and refused by any mind ... killing the non-muslims for no reason ! ... killing even the muslims for no reason ! ... their goal is hidden: it's to make Islam seems to be bad, intolerant of other religions.

We are not talking about a "fringe" group as the author of the book explains, the hatred and violence is endemic to muslim/islamic culture.

there is no relationship between those people and islam.

Who are "those people"?
 
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rogerredy

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I didn't mean so, I meant that those terrorists -doing that- are not implementing the islamic law, unlike many people may think.

and killing muslims is the most obvious proof that those terrorists are not muslims, even if they claim so.

that's all ... God bless you. and don't try to make me racist ... our prophet said:"""All mankind is from Adam and Eve, an Arab has no superiority over a non-Arab nor a non-Arab has any superiority over an Arab; also a white has no superiority over a black nor a black has any superiority over a white - except by piety and good action."""

Again, we are not talking about "terrorists," we are talking about muslims and islam in general. The author states that muslims cannot integrate into western society as they AS A WHOLE reject the basics of western cutlure, such as freedom of speech, compromise, negotiation, etc.

The author is not referring to suicide bombers, he is referring to all muslims.
 

rogerredy

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I don't say muslims don't want to integrate into western countries .. I said they have some difficulties to do so.

PS. just a question: aren't you muslim ?

What is interesting is that sikhs from india have VERY successfully integrated into UK society, yet indian muslims have been highly UNSUCCESSFUL in their integration.

Clearly, the Danish author is correct in his interpretation of islamic culture.
 

reefedjib

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Muslims in a non-islamic country should follow the law of the new country .. because the law of islam is implemented only in the islamic countries.

That's what I wanted. Thanks :)


I mean Islam should not be the responsible of the behaviour of some of who call themselves: "muslims".

I agree.

I also wrote: "Islam and the associated works of interpretation does specify a system of jurisprudence does it not? This would be at odds with a country's system of jurisprudence. I understand that in some western countries, muslims are demanding that they try criminals under this alternate system of juriprudence. I am sorry, I cannot recall the name for this." I think it is Sharia, now that I think about it. Comments?
 

rogerredy

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let our prophet answer you:"""One who kills a non-Muslim person under protection will not even smell the fragrance of Paradise."""

I am not interested in the religion of islam, but i am interested in 2 things:

1) why would a non-muslim need protection in the first place in a muslim-majority country?

2) why do you refer to certain countries as "muslim" or "islamic"? Not to derail my own thread, but then can I also expect then that since you embrace the concept of an "islamic" country, are you also as comfortable with a "jewish" nation? Or are only muslims allowed sovereignty on earth?

I follow Islam as a religion ... a man who does sth prohibited by Islam does not represent more than himself ... islam is quite innocent.

That's a lovely notion, but since almost all 57 muslim-majority countries are not democratic, and endure massive emigration TO Western countries - not the other way around - clearly the cultural failings of islam and muslim-majority countries are endemic and widespread.
 

Sylviane88

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Again, we are not talking about "terrorists," we are talking about muslims and islam in general.

If you're really interested by islam, you should not take your opinions from a biased source (like your man and your article which seems to be pretty fair) Here is islam "in general" www.islamreligion.com ... your article is a proof showing your total ignorance of the religion of islam.

God bless you !
 
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