Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train Wreck

[UtahBill]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

You actually can, but self-defense is an affirmative defense, and no prosecutor worth their salt is going to spend their time going after someone with a clearly demonstrable affirmative defense.

Why can't the states use that defense? The economy of Arizona, and other border states, is being affected, yet the Feds don't want to accept the blame when they don't enforce the law.
If AZ chooses to continue enforcing their law, what can the Feds do about it? Send in troops?
Arrest Sheriff Joe and the governor?

 

[TacticalEvilDan]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

States can't use that as their defense for the same reason they can't use it as a justification for declaring war or maintaining a navy.

As for what the Feds can do, they're doing it -- they're challenging it in court.

 

[UtahBill]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

States can't use that as their defense for the same reason they can't use it as a justification for declaring war or maintaining a navy.

As for what the Feds can do, they're doing it -- they're challenging it in court.

And the states (AZ doesn't stand alone here) can choose to ignore the findings, then what?
I did see on the news that the feds in several states are deporting hundreds every week, many with minor criminal records and many who speak perfect english and have no ties to relatives in Mexico.
Tough break?

 

[UtahBill]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

States can't use that as their defense for the same reason they can't use it as a justification for declaring war or maintaining a navy.

.

Neither of which is applicable, unless AZ decides to declare war on Mexico. And being landlocked, AZ has no need of a navy. An army, maybe, or would that be the national gaurd?
AZ has every right to defend its law abiding tax paying citizens from law breakers, and being from another country shouldn't give the criminals any benefit toward any kind of defense...

I wonder what would happen if we made Mexico provide defense attorneys for their citizens who break laws in AZ?

 

[TacticalEvilDan]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

And the states (AZ doesn't stand alone here) can choose to ignore the findings, then what?

Then you get the same result that we've had in the past when a state-level authority flouted the authority of the Federal government.

I did see on the news that the feds in several states are deporting hundreds every week, many with minor criminal records and many who speak perfect english and have no ties to relatives in Mexico.
Tough break?

Yep.

 

[TacticalEvilDan]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

Neither of which is applicable, unless AZ decides to declare war on Mexico. And being landlocked, AZ has no need of a navy. An army, maybe, or would that be the national gaurd?

Oh, for crying out loud. You know full well that my point was that states can't claim power not theirs simply by claiming a need in the name of self-preservation.

AZ has every right to defend its law abiding tax paying citizens from law breakers, and being from another country shouldn't give the criminals any benefit toward any kind of defense...

I wholeheartedly agree, when the laws being broken are within its authority to enforce.

I wonder what would happen if we made Mexico provide defense attorneys for their citizens who break laws in AZ?

A Federal court would tell you to sit down and shut up. :lol:

 

[Crosscheck]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

Its a futile attempt to call someone an idiot if they hold a political office because that person did have to be intelligent enough to get people to vote for him or her.

I just like that sentence. You made my laugh my friend.

 

[justabubba]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

The person on street babbling is not in politics so yes people would assume that some random stranger that no one knows anything about is just babbling or perhaps an idiot. Its a futile attempt to call someone an idiot if they hold a political office because that person did have to be intelligent enough to get people to vote for him or her.Yes she got her position because of Arizona line of succession laws, but she did have to run for Arizona secretary of state like she also had to run for other political offices as well.

that comment is SO signature worthy

 

[UtahBill]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

Oh, for crying out loud. You know full well that my point was that states can't claim power not theirs simply by claiming a need in the name of self-preservation.
:lol:

So we sacrifice the border states in the name of Federal Jurisdiction? Turn them over to Mexico?
My bet is, AZ can keep on doing what they want, and the FEDS can only whine about it.
again, what can the FEDS do? realistically, we all know that there won't be another civil war...

 

[Chappy]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

I don't buy this argument.

Patterson wasn't elected governor of New York, but that doesn't mean he can't do the job. It just means he got it because it was vacated.

Patterson? How's that been working out?

I didn't suggest Jan Brewer can't do the job — I do suggest that's she's out of her league and just demonstrated that she's a weak candidate and a poor governor.

 

[UtahBill]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

I didn't suggest Jan Brewer can't do the job — I do suggest that's she's out of her league and just demonstrated that she's a weak candidate and a poor governor.

Then she should run for president, she has met all the qualifications...:2razz:

 

[TacticalEvilDan]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

So we sacrifice the border states in the name of Federal Jurisdiction? Turn them over to Mexico?

No, we stop being stupid enough to reelect the morons who refuse to fix the problem.

My bet is, AZ can keep on doing what they want, and the FEDS can only whine about it.
again, what can the FEDS do? realistically, we all know that there won't be another civil war...

There wasn't a civil war of desegregation either, and that was a fairly pronounced clash of governments.


TED,
Not comparing immigration enforcement to segregation.

 

[TacticalEvilDan]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

Patterson? How's that been working out?

It's had its ups and downs, but considering the fact that NY politics have been ****ed-up for as long as I can remember he's nothing special.

I didn't suggest Jan Brewer can't do the job — I do suggest that's she's out of her league and just demonstrated that she's a weak candidate and a poor governor.

Why, because she didn't come off perfect on camera? Gimmie a break.

 

[VanceMack]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

So what if the Federal government disagrees with me? Since when did that render any argument around here invalid? :lol:

Oh, wait, when it reinforces your point. Riiiiiiiiiiight.

It simply destroys any argument against state enforcement of federal laws. Oh...wait...you are CONSISTENT...right...You dopnt think state law enforcement should apprehend kidnappers, bank robbers, murderers, or ANYONE with a federal rap. OK...then I'll concede that you have a valid and consistent point...that in your world law enforcement agencies dont cross boundaries. Mark that one down...

 

[VanceMack]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

Jan Brewer was never elected governor, and, now we know why. Perhaps, she should spend more time learning to speak in public and less time chasing headless bodies in the desert.

Better yet she should invest in ateam of speech writers and practice smooth delivery with a teleprompter. THAT will make her even MORE qualified than the current CiC...

 

[VanceMack]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

States can't use that as their defense for the same reason they can't use it as a justification for declaring war or maintaining a navy.

As for what the Feds can do, they're doing it -- they're challenging it in court.

Oh yes...and its a GENIUS argument isnt it...We believe that even though WE have trained hundreds of state law enforcement agencies and dumped BILLIONS in taxpayer dollars into that training now claim it is illegal for those states to actually DO what we trained them and asked them to do.

How would YOU vote on that jury?

 

[TacticalEvilDan]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

It simply destroys any argument against state enforcement of federal laws. Oh...wait...you are CONSISTENT...right...You dopnt think state law enforcement should apprehend kidnappers, bank robbers, murderers, or ANYONE with a federal rap. OK...then I'll concede that you have a valid and consistent point...that in your world law enforcement agencies dont cross boundaries. Mark that one down...

I think that the Federal authorities can certainly request the assistance of state, county and local authorities in the enforcement of Federal law.

If it isn't obvious to you, at this stage, that the Federal government wants Arizona to butt the hell out, then I guess there isn't much more to say. :lol:

 

[TacticalEvilDan]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

Oh yes...and its a GENIUS argument isnt it...We believe that even though WE have trained hundreds of state law enforcement agencies and dumped BILLIONS in taxpayer dollars into that training now claim it is illegal for those states to actually DO what we trained them and asked them to do.

How would YOU vote on that jury?

Seeing as how I don't think state and local authorities should be policing the border, I'd vote to tell the states to kiss my ass.

 

[UtahBill]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

It's had its ups and downs, but considering the fact that NY politics have been ****ed-up for as long as I can remember he's nothing special.



Why, because she didn't come off perfect on camera? Gimmie a break.

Post 63, you are quoting someone else, not me....

 

[jamesrage]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

No, in other words I don't care enough about whether there are or aren't to do any sort of research.

So you can't prove that anyone other than proillegals(illegal immigration proponents) oppose SB1070.

 

[VanceMack]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

I think that the Federal authorities can certainly request the assistance of state, county and local authorities in the enforcement of Federal law.

If it isn't obvious to you, at this stage, that the Federal government wants Arizona to butt the hell out, then I guess there isn't much more to say. :lol:

WHat is crystal clear and blatantly obviopus to EVERYONE but the true believers is that the democrats dont WANT enforcement andf the Obama adminsitration is using this as a chance to shriek 'racism' and score political points. IF the fed wanted the states to butt out the fed probably wouldnt have trained over 1.2 MILLION state police personnel on ICE enforcement, now would they have?

 

[VanceMack]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

Seeing as how I don't think state and local authorities should be policing the border, I'd vote to tell the states to kiss my ass.

They arent enforcing the border, they are following duye dilligence as police officers and asking individuals that have been stopped for criminal behavior to produce identification. The same BTW as they do every OTHER citizen. Twist it, spin it, justify it how you want...this is democrat race baiting politics at its core.

 

[TacticalEvilDan]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

So you can't prove that anyone other than proillegals(illegal immigration proponents) oppose SB1070.

Sure I can.

I'm not a proponent of illegal immigration, and I oppose SB 1070.

:lol:

 

[TacticalEvilDan]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

WHat is crystal clear and blatantly obviopus to EVERYONE but the true believers is that the democrats dont WANT enforcement andf the Obama adminsitration is using this as a chance to shriek 'racism' and score political points. IF the fed wanted the states to butt out the fed probably wouldnt have trained over 1.2 MILLION state police personnel on ICE enforcement, now would they have?

Neither the Democrats nor the Republicans want enforcement. Both sides have had the opportunity to do so each time they've had power over the last 30 years, and the situation still hasn't been dealt with.

 

[TacticalEvilDan]

Re: Jan Brewer's Opening Statement for the Gubernatorial Debate...OMG, It's a Train W

They arent enforcing the border, they are following duye dilligence as police officers and asking individuals that have been stopped for criminal behavior to produce identification. The same BTW as they do every OTHER citizen. Twist it, spin it, justify it how you want...this is democrat race baiting politics at its core.

If you're enforcing immigration law, you're enforcing the border. The two activities are one and the same.