Its worse than we thought: tuition fees to rise to £9,000

[Lord Tammerlain]

You're correct that cost is a barrier in many aspects of life. It always has been and always will be. Anything of value has a cost associated with it. Call it the opinion of an American vs a European socialist, but I'd rather see the costs directly rather than having them hidden.

I could have had free health care and free education, but based on your tax rate compared to mine, your "free" health care and "free" education are much more expensive than mine.

By ensuring higher education is more widely available to the general population those socialist countries are ensuring something that America used to view as an ideal, equal opportunity. If an 18 year old can not go to higher education due to financial reasons, her/his opportunity for success is lower then the one who can. What happens to that individual in school or after is entirely up to that person, but he/she did have the opportunity to succeed

 

[PeteEU]

I agree with you that the principle is a good one, but it doesn't fit with your principles of removing cost barriers for the poor. It's a practical limitation, like the low entrance barrier that exists in the States.

Yes it does.. The cost barriers for Danish "poor" have been removed. It is not the job of Denmark to educate other nations poor is it now...

 

[kaya'08]

The education standards are pretty much the same, both here and in the US. Same stuff you learn.... heck often from the same bloody text books. All text books at the Copenhagen Business School are American pretty much.

It's not about that, its about the quality of the facilities of the university and the experience of the lecturers aswell as the success rate and average grade rate at said university.
Is there many European universities that surpass Cambridge/Oxford in terms of success, facilities or quality of degrees? If they are common in Europe then i suppose British universities are "overrated" - but i dont think this is the case.

 

[Andalublue]

It's not about that, its about the quality of the facilities of the university and the experience of the lecturers aswell as the success rate and average grade rate at said university.
Is there many European universities that surpass Cambridge/Oxford in terms of success, facilities or quality of degrees? If they are common in Europe then i suppose British universities are "overrated" - but i dont think this is the case.

Kaya, Oxbridge are two of the best-funded, most prestigious academic institutions in the World. There are several European universities that can compare academically, such as the École Polytechnique, Barcelona, Göttingen, Trinity College Dublin, SFIT Zürich, Utrecht... all outstanding. Comparisons to Oxbridge aren't exactly necessary, however. The more middle-ranking UK universities are easily comparable with universities across the continent.

 

[FederalRepublic]

By ensuring higher education is more widely available to the general population those socialist countries are ensuring something that America used to view as an ideal, equal opportunity. If an 18 year old can not go to higher education due to financial reasons, her/his opportunity for success is lower then the one who can. What happens to that individual in school or after is entirely up to that person, but he/she did have the opportunity to succeed

You are making an incorrect assumption that higher education is not widely available in the America. There are ways around the financial barriers. Nevermind that our education is less expensive than yours. If a student is not willing to do the work involved, they don't deserve to go. Equal opportunity doesn't mean life is easy...

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

You are making an incorrect assumption that higher education is not widely available in the America. There are ways around the financial barriers. Nevermind that our education is less expensive than yours. If a student is not willing to do the work involved, they don't deserve to go. Equal opportunity doesn't mean life is easy...

It is widely avaliable, however costs are a deterent in comparison to many european countries. Even with student loans being available the costs are going to be an issue and prevent some students from attending higher education. If I am not mistaken the number of post secondary grads are higher as % of population in most northern european countries then the US.

As for costs for education, I am Canadian, the costs here in Canada are roughly on par with the US public universities for our public universities

 

[FederalRepublic]

It is widely avaliable, however costs are a deterent in comparison to many european countries. Even with student loans being available the costs are going to be an issue and prevent some students from attending higher education. If I am not mistaken the number of post secondary grads are higher as % of population in most northern european countries then the US.

As for costs for education, I am Canadian, the costs here in Canada are roughly on par with the US public universities for our public universities

Hard work is a deterent. I get it. I don't know about the number of post secondary grads, but a bunch of PhD's does not necessarily a better society (or economy) make. This is particulary true if said PhD's have an aversion to hard work.

You may have a point on Canadian universities. Sorry, I was wrapped up in Denmark.

 

[paris]

Student tuition fee protest turns violent as Tory headquarters evacuated - Telegraph

A demonstration against tuition fees by tens of thousands of students and lecturers descended into violence today when a group of protesters smashed their way into the headquarters of the Conservative party.

Heheheeace

 

[Fiddytree]

Hard work is a deterent. I get it. I don't know about the number of post secondary grads, but a bunch of PhD's does not necessarily a better society (or economy) make. This is particulary true if said PhD's have an aversion to hard work.

You may have a point on Canadian universities. Sorry, I was wrapped up in Denmark.

Indeed. Education for its intrinsic value is one thing but in the job market, it is quite another. No matter what benchmark system we set, employers will want an employee with a certain about of zing that few of the other candidates have. There will quite literally be inequalities abound no matter the direction we take it. Flooding the market with that many more BAs, MAs, PhDs can increase the issue.

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

Hard work is a deterent. I get it. I don't know about the number of post secondary grads, but a bunch of PhD's does not necessarily a better society (or economy) make. This is particulary true if said PhD's have an aversion to hard work.

You may have a point on Canadian universities. Sorry, I was wrapped up in Denmark.

I was taking specifically about the economic costs of attending university in the US compared to that in most european countries from what has been reported.

While PhD do not make a society better, in a highly competitive world where millions if not billions of people are now able to compete at for low skilled low education jobs, ensuring a higher level of education for a larger amount of the population will help ensure a better standard of living for the entire country. This does not mean everyone should have a PhD, but at least something better then purely a high school education

 

[FederalRepublic]

I was taking specifically about the economic costs of attending university in the US compared to that in most european countries from what has been reported.

While PhD do not make a society better, in a highly competitive world where millions if not billions of people are now able to compete at for low skilled low education jobs, ensuring a higher level of education for a larger amount of the population will help ensure a better standard of living for the entire country. This does not mean everyone should have a PhD, but at least something better then purely a high school education

I know that you were talking about economic costs. I also know that we have systems in place in the states to help anyone who really wants to go to college regardless of their economic status. In many cases that's grants and/or scholarships. In most cases (particularly for lower middle class) that's loans.

In the interest of full disclosure, I attended two different colleges for four semesters with my parents paying tuition. I had no idea why I was there or what I wanted to do and didn't feel comfortable wasting my parents money. I had to drop out of school and take responsibility for my own finances before I figured out where I was going. A couple of years in a trailer park suggested to me that I wanted more from life...

While PhD do not make a society better, in a highly competitive world where millions if not billions of people are now able to compete at for low skilled low education jobs, ensuring a higher level of education for a larger amount of the population will help ensure a better standard of living for the entire country. This does not mean everyone should have a PhD, but at least something better then purely a high school education

There is something to what you're saying here, but simply being educated in a particular field says nothing about your contribution to the standard of living in your country. If you don't have productive people, your standard of living will not hold up.

 

[washunut]

Right wing thinking at work.. class warfare at its worst. The UK is turning more and more like the US and a 3rd world country where higher education is only for the rich.

You call that amount of money much for college? That is still a great bargain.