Is It A Lie To Say You Support The Troops But Not Their Mission?

[Navy Pride]

Why is it unlawful? The President is commander-in-chief and can pretty much attack whomever he wants.



Really? So soldiers are free to disobey orders that they personally deem to be unlawful?



It's a hypothetical question. Forget about Bush if you want, and imagine some hypothetical future president declaring war on Canada because the Canadian foreign minister call him a nasty name. Would you "support our troops"?

1. Did you ever hear of the Nurenberg trials? Nuff said......

2. Sure they are but they better be right..........

3. If it was justified I would support it but it is a ridiculous comparison and you know it...........Maybe you don't....:roll:

 

[Navy Pride]

Whats wrong about hating the reasons our soldiers were sent to war for? Nobody is saying we hate our soldiers. Just the situation they're in. We dont agree with the things they do but we still hope they'll make it out alright.

Becasue your a Monday Morning Quarterback and you hate it because you hate President Bush......

 

[Skip]

Its amazing........Unlike Caine they don't cut and run after one deployment.......They volunteer for second and third tours and reenlist while in country.............

Hey, this debate is about supporting the troops.................... it's not about Caine or anyone else here....................... let's try to stay focused for a little bit OK my left wing friend................. Typical leftie, attacking the person not the argument......... Thanks....................

[/NP-ism]

 

[Navy Pride]

Well. this just proves how little you know of me.
Besides the fact that you are trying to bring personal attacks back into formidable debate.
For your information, I spent TWO deployments in Iraq. So STFU.
And I am proud of those who decide to do that. But I never intended to make a career out of the Army. I said the day I signed up that I would not be re-enlisting. I stuck to my word. My life is my life, and after I completed my obligation to the U.S. Government, I had every right to go on with doing what I wanted to do with my life. You only get one, Im not going to spend it doing something that I am not entirely happy with.
If you can't see the honor in that, there is something seriously wrong with you.



More pointless drivel.

Most guys I talk to feel a kindred with their comrades and want to finish the mission with them........I talked to one guy who lost a leg and he felt guilty that he left Iraq and his buddies were still there................He made 3 tours........You never felt that bonding huh? Why am I not surprised............:roll:


Lets get back on topic...........

 

[Navy Pride]

]Hey, this debate is about supporting the troops.....[/B]............... it's not about Caine or anyone else here....................... let's try to stay focused for a little bit OK my left wing friend................. Typical leftie, attacking the person not the argument......... Thanks....................

[/NP-ism]

Yeah of course your right......I apologize.........

 

[Hatuey]

Becasue your a Monday Morning Quarterback and you hate it because you hate President Bush......

Really? So obviously because I dislike Bush I dislike our troops. I dont hate President Bush. I've understood that he knows very little about Iraq other then what his cue cards say. Rumsfeld is another story. He was doing a heck of a job what happened? You gotta try harder then that NP. You again have shown how you are nothing more then blind sheep.

 

[disneydude]

Yeah of course your right......I apologize.........

WOW! :wow:

 

[Navy Pride]

Really? So obviously because I dislike Bush I dislike our troops. I dont hate President Bush. I've understood that he knows very little about Iraq other then what his cue cards say. Rumsfeld is another story. He was doing a heck of a job what happened? You gotta try harder then that NP. You again have shown how you are nothing more then blind sheep.

No I don't think you hate the troops..In fact you might even like them but because of the hate for this president that is eating you alive you don't want the troops to succeed in their mission because if they did then you would have to give the president some credit because he is their leader and the commander in chief and becasue of your hatred you could never do that..........

 

[Hatuey]

No I don't think you hate the troops..

So we agree then.

In fact you might even like them but because of the hate for this president that is eating you alive you don't want the troops to succeed in their mission

LoL oh yes it's eating me alive. Au contraire NP. I wish the troops would suceed. You've yet to realize that my beef isn't with them suceeding or not. My beef is with the people who sent them to war without a plan B. Because we all know the administration thought there would never be a hitch throughout this entire thing.

because if they did then you would have to give the president some credit

Again you're mistaken. Your partisanship is fogging up your glasses. I give Bush credit for the war on terror, his no child left behind program and the way he united all of the U.S. after 9/11. This support however is outwieghed by how politics have taken a hold of all of his initiatives. He is a spineless president with little strength in actual politics. We all know Rove/Rummy controled the chips. Bush was nothing more then the hand being used to move them around.

I have no problem with the war on terror. I have a problem on how it's been handled. The incredible inefficiency. The greatest military machine in world history cant qwell the rebelion of a few thousand.

Shameful and sad.

 

[Kandahar]

*Sigh*.....and why would an American President send the military into Canada because he was called a nasty name? Is there any incident in history where an American President sent the military abroad to kill because his feelings were hurt?

No, but presidents HAVE sent the military abroad for only slightly less ridiculous reasons. Is there no circumstance at all where you would be against deploying our military abroad, if that's what the president wanted to do? No possibility that you'd ever feel that such a deployment was too risky, or unjustified, or imprudent for advancing America's interests...not even in theory?

Trying to compare a real world issue with a trivial rediculous "what if" doesn't cut it. There is nothing as discouraging as being deployed and knowing that the same Americans that detest and loath what you are doing also support you. This PC slogan is meant to sooth the protestor..not comfort the troop.

"I hate this war and what you are doing, but here's a tooth brush and I support you." Makes no sense to us.

It isn't a trivial "what if." The point is that there are some circumstances where you would be against deploying troops...and therefore, you wouldn't "support our troops" either, according to your own standard.

 

[Kandahar]

1. Did you ever hear of the Nurenberg trials? Nuff said......

So you define the legality of a conflict within the scope of international law, as opposed to American law? So American soldiers are allowed to disobey orders if they conflict with international standards of conduct?

2. Sure they are but they better be right.

An interesting interpretation of the chain of command, especially coming from someone who was in the navy. Your superiors would almost certainly disagree with you. If soldiers are allowed to choose for themselves which orders to follow, the chain of command breaks down.

3. If it was justified I would support it but it is a ridiculous comparison and you know it...........Maybe you don't....:roll:

Ha! I knew I'd snare one of you guys.
We've now established that you would not support a conflict that you considered unjustified, and therefore you would not support our troops by your standard. So really, we're just quibbling about whether or not this particular conflict in Iraq is justified...not whether or not we support the troops.

 

[Navy Pride]

So you define the legality of a conflict within the scope of international law, as opposed to American law? So American soldiers are allowed to disobey orders if they conflict with international standards of conduct?



An interesting interpretation of the chain of command, especially coming from someone who was in the navy. Your superiors would almost certainly disagree with you. If soldiers are allowed to choose for themselves which orders to follow, the chain of command breaks down.



Ha! I knew I'd snare one of you guys.
We've now established that you would not support a conflict that you considered unjustified, and therefore you would not support our troops by your standard. So really, we're just quibbling about whether or not this particular conflict in Iraq is justified...not whether or not we support the troops.

I was a military man.I follow lawful orders............We are talking about Iraq......The Congress approved that war with 77 senators voting for it.....If the Congress approved and invasion of Canada and the President ordered it I would follow that order........

 

[Caine]

You never felt that bonding huh? Why am I not surprised............:roll:

Umm.. I still communicate with my old military buddies.... So yes, I still have a bond with them.

But, who is more important? My military buddies or my wife and family??????

This one is a no brainer, but NP here can't figure that one out..

Why am I not surprised? :roll:

And of course, after an unnecessary personal attack stemed from my response from the first personal attack that was unprovoked, he then demands to get back on topic.

Didn't I tell you to shut the **** up already?

 

[Kandahar]

I was a military man.I follow lawful orders............We are talking about Iraq......The Congress approved that war with 77 senators voting for it.....If the Congress approved and invasion of Canada and the President ordered it I would follow that order........

You'd support it even if the President and Congress were WRONG, and Canada hadn't done anything at all to deserve war?

Wow... :shock:

 

[Gibberish]

Well you are saying something completely different from you liberal buddies.......

Actually I disagree with liberals on many aspects, the same as I disagree with conservatives on many. That is why I label myself an independent.

I tend to say I am more of a social moderate(leaning slightly left)/fiscal conservative.

 

[Skip]

Like I've said before, Navy & his cronies labels everyone at or near the center a "liberal".

 

[dragonslayer]

I certainly support the troops and want them to come home safely.

Supporting the mission, is supporting Bush's phoney war, which I don't.

We need to get our troops out of Iraq, and get them home where they will die like normal Americans, and not be sacrificed to some corporate and right wing fake cause.

God Bless America and our troops.

 

[Navy Pride]

Like I've said before, Navy & his cronies labels everyone at or near the center a "liberal".

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck then its a duck Hussein.....

 

[Navy Pride]

I certainly support the troops and want them to come home safely.

Supporting the mission, is supporting Bush's phoney war, which I don't.

We need to get our troops out of Iraq, and get them home where they will die like normal Americans, and not be sacrificed to some corporate and right wing fake cause.

God Bless America and our troops.

So your saying because you hate the president you want the troops to fail in their mission even if it means our troops die in failing........Do I have that right?

 

[Kandahar]

So your saying because you hate the president you want the troops to fail in their mission even if it means our troops die in failing........Do I have that right?

Ever played poker? If you fold a hand that you know you can't win, does that mean that you "want to fail"? Of course not. It means you're playing smartly, and minimizing your losses.

We should be doing the same thing in Iraq. It's obvious that we can't win this hand, so we should fold now and minimize our losses. It has nothing to do with wanting the troops to fail.

I'd love to see our mission in Iraq succeed, just like I'd love to win every hand of poker. But it's not going to happen.

 

[dragonslayer]

So your saying because you hate the president you want the troops to fail in their mission even if it means our troops die in failing........Do I have that right?

if our troops are not there, they won't die. that is what I am saying.

If our troops are not there fighting in Bush's war, they will not die. I have often wondered what gives Bush the right to have his own personal little war where wonderful American youth are dying purely to satisfy him and cheney?

 

[CurrentAffairs]

if our troops are not there, they won't die. that is what I am saying.

If our troops are not there fighting in Bush's war, they will not die. I have often wondered what gives Bush the right to have his own personal little war where wonderful American youth are dying purely to satisfy him and cheney?

And I wonder why all of those wonderful American youth volunteer to serve in that war? Oh yeah, because they believe in the cause. Because they understand what is at stake. Because they realize that war has been necessary throughout the ages. Because they don't allow Rosie O'Donnell and Barbra Streisand to tell them what to think. Because they are proud of their country, proud of thier commander-in-chief and proud to serve YOU.

Don't worry, I'll thank them for you.

 

[Hatuey]

And I wonder why all of those wonderful American youth volunteer to serve in that war? Oh yeah, because they believe in the cause. Because they understand what is at stake. Because they realize that war has been necessary throughout the ages. Because they don't allow Rosie O'Donnell and Barbra Streisand to tell them what to think. Because they are proud of their country, proud of thier commander-in-chief and proud to serve YOU.

Don't worry, I'll thank them for you.

Yes. Our own freedom is at stake 10,000 miles away.

Cue the "Hail to the Chief" beat.

TA-NA-NA-Nu-Na-Nu-Na-Nu-Na-Nu-Nuuuuuu!

*Watches the marching bands roll by and salutes them for their brave sacrifices*

:cowboy: :2usflag: Oh, say can you see, by the dawn's early light,
What so proudly we hailed at the twilight's last gleaming?
Whose broad stripes and bright stars....:2usflag: :cowboy:

Yeeeeeehawwwwwwwwww
-------------------------------------------------------

Please save the patriotics for when Bush comes to shake your hand.

 

[CurrentAffairs]

Yes. Our own freedom is at stake 10,000 miles away.

Cue the "Hail to the Chief" beat.

TA-NA-NA-Nu-Na-Nu-Na-Nu-Na-Nu-Nuuuuuu!

*Watches the marching bands roll by and salutes them for their brave sacrifices*

:cowboy: :2usflag: Oh, say can you see, by the dawn's early light,
What so proudly we hailed at the twilight's last gleaming?
Whose broad stripes and bright stars....:2usflag: :cowboy:

Yeeeeeehawwwwwwwwww
-------------------------------------------------------

Please save the patriotics for when Bush comes to shake your hand.

Why does patriotism and support for one's country offend you so much?

 

[Hatuey]

Why does patriotism and support for one's country offend you so much?

It doesn't. There is a difference between being patriotic and sounding like a moron online trying to be more American then everybody else. The online 9/11 speeches that everybody has heard. The "Your freedom is at stake 10,000 miles away" fear mongering. The "If we dont do it they'll swim across atlantic and attack us again because we can't defend ourselves over here" bullshit frankly it's moronic and does nothing for your cause ad make you look like a moron.