How would you characterize the attack on the Pulse nightclub in Orlando?

[Josie]

Your choices are --

1. Islamic Terrorism

2. Domestic Gun Violence


Please vote and explain why.

 

[Glen Contrarian]

Your choices are --

1. Islamic Terrorism

2. Domestic Gun Violence


Please vote and explain why.

I can't vote because it's both. Actually, your first choice should be "Radical Islamic Terrorism", because it is in no way reflective of the beliefs of the overwhelming majority of Islam.

 

[Josie]

I can't vote because it's both. Actually, your first choice should be "Radical Islamic Terrorism", because it is in no way reflective of the beliefs of the overwhelming majority of Islam.

Oh stop. "Islamic Terrorism" MEANS radical Islam. Everyone knows that.

 

[Glen Contrarian]

Oh stop. "Islamic Terrorism" MEANS radical Islam. Everyone knows that.

I understand what you're trying to say, but words do matter. For instance, what if the murderer had been a black guy from, say, the south side of Chicago - would your first choice have been "Inner-city terrorism"? Because many would see that as a dog-whistle call for "black thug terrorism".

No, the comparison isn't exact, but I hope you get my point. It's not a matter of political correctness, but a matter of clarity of what you do and do not mean. Try not to assume others know what you mean...because there's always a few who will do their doggonedest to misinterpret...and the clearer you are, the less they will be able to do so.

 

[mak2]

This guy sounds like a well rounded nut job. Homophobia mixed with radical religion, history of violence back into at least middle school, and obviously nuts. Take your pick whatever you want the reason to be. I heard today he was texting the wife while he stood in the bathroom killing people.

 

[Lutherf]

So far it seems to have been a little of both.

My take is that the guy was a closet case with definite anger issues and a whole lot of BPD who was suffering serious conflict between his religion and his sexual identity. He likely saw the decision to shoot up the club as a path to redemption within his religion for an incurable personal failing.

The bottom line is that the version of Islam he latched on to drove the final "solution" for him but the reason he picked that particular location was most likely due to an internal conflict.

 

[grip]

I think *both* is going to be the overall consensus from the majority. Though it was more Radical Islam driven in stated purpose, I think must people see the whole thing as plain old crazy.

 

[Skeptic Bob]

Both, combined with self hating homophobia and likely mental illness.

 

[MaggieD]

Your choices are --

1. Islamic Terrorism

2. Domestic Gun Violence


Please vote and explain why.

Since we cannot possibly know the workings of someone's mind, I support the position that he himself espoused...radical Islamic terrorism.

 

[TheGoverness]

Your choices are --

1. Islamic Terrorism

2. Domestic Gun Violence


Please vote and explain why.

Well It was Islamic Terrorism, but also with mixture of other factors. But I think Islam still was the main motivation for why the perpetrator committed the Orlando massacre.

 

[Surrealistik]

Both, but if you're going to make me choose, I'm going with domestic gun violence.

 

[Redress]

Your choices are --

1. Islamic Terrorism

2. Domestic Gun Violence


Please vote and explain why.

Where is "attack on the patrons at the Pulse nightclub" option? I don't worry about silly semantic games.

 

[coldjoint]

I can't vote because it's both. Actually, your first choice should be "Radical Islamic Terrorism", because it is in no way reflective of the beliefs of the overwhelming majority of Islam.

You do not know that. And the polls show in the ME the majority of Muslims support Sharia. And Sharia says gays must die.

 

[grip]

Well It was Islamic Terrorism, but also with mixture of other factors. But I think Islam still was the main motivation for why the perpetrator committed the Orlando massacre.

I think he also may have went after a gay club specifically, because his father and faith explicitly denounced same sex. He targeted them to add even more notoriety to his attack, similar to why AQ went after the financial center of the World Trade Center, Pentagon and possibly WH. It was a twofer for him by adding the Pulse.

 

[coldjoint]

Where is "attack on the patrons at the Pulse nightclub" option? I don't worry about silly semantic games.

Thati s why liberals have accomplished nothing in the war on terror.

 

[iguanaman]

Oh stop. "Islamic Terrorism" MEANS radical Islam. Everyone knows that.

You left out homophobia too. The man was obsessed with gays. He hated them but could not stay away from them either. He was very conflicted about his sexuality. The call to ISIS was likely an afterthought not a motive.

 

[Josie]

You left out homophobia too. The man was obsessed with gays. He hated them but could not stay away from them either. He was very conflicted about his sexuality.

You keep saying that, but how do you know that?

 

[TheGoverness]

I think he also may have went after a gay club specifically, because his father and faith explicitly denounced same sex. He targeted them to add even more notoriety to his attack, similar to why AQ went after the financial center of the World Trade Center, Pentagon and possibly WH. It was a twofer for him by adding the Pulse.

And the fact that Omar himself was possibly gay, and probably had some serious confliction within himself.

 

[grip]

And the fact that Omar himself was possibly gay, and probably had some serious confliction within himself.

He probably couldn't resolve his attraction to same sex with his faith and father, which caused him to settle the internal conflict with a final act. They said he made announcements of support for competing terror groups, which sounds like confusion. I think people who do these horrifically grandiose gestures also often feel ineffectual and irrelevant and are seeking to have an impact.

 

[mak2]

I wonder if he got male or female virgins.

Since we cannot possibly know the workings of someone's mind, I support the position that he himself espoused...radical Islamic terrorism.

 

[Fledermaus]

Your choices are --

1. Islamic Terrorism

2. Domestic Gun Violence


Please vote and explain why.

I vote : More complex.

 

[TheGoverness]

I wonder if he got male or female virgins.

I'd say male. Allah probably made an exception for him.

 

[mak2]

I don't know why but it bothers me I thought of that.

I'd say male. Allah probably made an exception for him.

 

[Gina]

He probably couldn't resolve his attraction to same sex with his faith and father, which caused him to settle the internal conflict with a final act. They said he made announcements of support for competing terror groups, which sounds like confusion. I think people who do these horrifically grandiose gestures also often feel ineffectual and irrelevant and are seeking to have an impact.

This.

His claim that he was acting for ISIS is undercut by his various other claims to be part of al-Queda, Hezbollah and support for al-Nursa:

To be clear, these groups named by Mateen are not allies. The Islamic State and al-Qaeda both derive their theology from an extreme view of Sunni Islamism, but in practical terms the pair split in 2014, with the more established al-Qaeda publicly disavowing the actions of the more extreme Islamic State. Jabhat al-Nusra, al-Qaeda's affiliate in Syria, often fights the Islamic State in the Syrian conflict. Meanwhile, Hezbollah is a Shiite Islamist group. In Syria, it supports the government of Bashar al-Assad, effectively meaning it fights both the Islamic State and al-Qaeda.

Comey suggested Monday that Mateen may have not understood the distinctions among the groups. Relatives have given mixed reports about the level of Mateen's religiosity, with some suggesting he preferred working out to studying religion. He attended the Islamic Center of Fort Pierce, though he is said to have rarely spoken. His Afghan father has filmed videos that appeared to offer support for the Taliban, a fundamentalist movement that also opposes the Islamic State, though his messages also were sometimes incoherent.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...fference-between-isis-al-qaeda-and-hezbollah/

Mental illness and conflict over his same sex attraction seem the driving forces behind his actions which drove him to an act of domestic gun violence. If he didn't understand the difference between those groups, then his motivation as an Islamic terrorist must be questioned.

 

[grip]

This.

His claim that he was acting for ISIS is undercut by his various other claims to be part of al-Queda, Hezbollah and support for al-Nursa:


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...fference-between-isis-al-qaeda-and-hezbollah/

Mental illness and conflict over his same sex attraction seem the driving forces behind his actions which drove him to an act of domestic gun violence. If he didn't understand the difference between those groups, then his motivation as an Islamic terrorist must be questioned.

I agree and think his support of Radical Islam was merely the vehicle he used as an excuse to commit his crime.

I was shocked to find out that most of the ISIS fighters are taking a form of speed called Captagon. It appears as hypocrisy to kill in the name of a faith that they profess so vehemently, then break one of its cardinal commandments by using drugs. Most people who want to commit aggressive violence will use almost any motive as an excuse.