Ban on ‘Excessive’ Gas Prices Heading for House Vote

[CaughtInThe]

Exxon certainly can't afford it...

 

[NoMoreDems-Reps]

Ban on ‘Excessive’ Gas Prices Heading for House Vote | Transport Topics

The U.S. president would have the authority to declare an emergency that would make the sale of gasoline at “excessive” prices illegal under legislation House Democrats plan to bring to the floor next week.

www.ttnews.com

When this fails, next comes price controls and pretty soon you will be waiting in line for 4 hours to buy gas at a "fair" price.


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To all those who think the WH/DEM's are good, and care about the "little Guy" Please go find out how much
"ADDITIONAL Taxes" your state puts on each Gallon of Gas, then try to find out what they have done with that money,
that they force you to pay!

I think by now the Government could have put Solar on all State Buildings and bought Millions of Electric Cars
with all that TAX Money They've made us Pay, because Gas pollutes!!!....

 

[ElChupacabra]

My understanding is the problem stems
from continued supply chain problems and a massive recall. It’s not a problem the market can fix. Or the government for that matter.

There's also the trade policy aspect to this. Existing regulations prevent us from importing baby formula made in Europe with a few exceptions because the products meet FDA standards. That's not to say European formula is substandard, but there are differences in terms of labeling from what I remember reading. On the trade front, the USMCA placed restrictions on imports from Canada.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Your preferences will be moot pretty soon mah dude. Wasteful energy will become a thing of the past. I bought my EV a good while before spikes in gas prices and i’d never go for gasoline again.

Well aren’t you special. You likely got tax subsidy to help keep your cost of being freed from paying road use taxes on motor fuel even lower. I’m going to venture a guess that your (alleged urge?) EV is not capable of towing a 7000# GRVW trailer (a requirement for my work) and that you don’t rely on charging ports supplied by others to keep your EV charged and ready to drive. I know every few (only one to date) people who have (pure) EVs as opposed to hybrids which still use fossil fuels to take extended trips.

 

[cpwill]

American domestic demand IS down and American domestic supply IS up

1. That is irrelevant to the question of price.

2. you are incorrect, as demonstrated above.

What is NOT keeping pace is American domestic refining capacity.

While I certainly have no problem believing that domestic refining capacity is unequal to what full-bore American production would be

1. You have yet to demonstrate that this is so beyond your mere assertion. Initial searching seems to indicate that our refining capacity, in fact, well outstrips our crude production

2. It would still be irrelevant, since what drives price will be global supply.

In fact, since "OPEC+ Expects Large Oil Glut In Early 2022" (from OilPrice.com) the American petroleum industry has to strike NOW in order to maximize profits.

......I don't know if you noticed, but, it is early 2022 - in fact, we are getting past "early", and are now into "mid" 2022, and early 2022 did not turn out the way that author anticipated. There was the small matter of a war in Eastern Europe that occurred between the writing of that article in December of last year and now, for example.

 

[Surrealistik]

What makes the price a "gouge"?

I presume in the case of prices being increased well above any increase in the cost of inputs as is presently the case in many industries, particularly in the case of captive consumers with limited alternatives, either because of monopoly/oligopoly and excess pricing power (typically due to market consolidation), or explicit or implicit price fixing.

Revealed: top US corporations raising prices on Americans even as profits surge

A Guardian analysis uncovers how companies enriched themselves and their investors while boasting about jacking up prices

www.theguardian.com

The Dirty Secret of Inflation: Corporations Are Jacking Up Prices and Profits

Democrats are failing to speak to the realities of the economic moment—and it could cost them in the midterms.

www.thenation.com

 

[ttwtt78640]

I presume in the case of prices being increased well above any increase in the cost of inputs as is presently the case in many industries, particularly in the case of captive consumers with limited alternatives, either because of monopoly/oligopoly and excess pricing power (typically due to market consolidation), or explicit or implicit price fixing.

Define “well above”.

Revealed: top US corporations raising prices on Americans even as profits surge

A Guardian analysis uncovers how companies enriched themselves and their investors while boasting about jacking up prices

www.theguardian.com

Why use Q1 of 2020 (during pandemic) as the baseline?

The Dirty Secret of Inflation: Corporations Are Jacking Up Prices and Profits

Democrats are failing to speak to the realities of the economic moment—and it could cost them in the midterms.

www.thenation.com

Political spin with no specific examples of profit margin changes.

President Biden has called out that the prices for unfinished gasoline were down by 5%, where the prices at the gas station went up by 3%.

Hmm… how does Biden expect gas stations to sell “unfinished gasoline”?

Here is the “answer”:

MARTIN: Before we let you go, do you see a will to do that? I know that that's not strictly your area of expertise, but among the people that you talked to, your sort of peer economists, is there a consensus about the way forward here?

WEBER: Well, I'd say that we are in pretty uncharted waters because we are in this situation where specific prices are shooting up, which we haven't seen in a long time because we have had this global supply chain system that, yes, had always the vulnerabilities that we are seeing now but in stable times has been working pretty well. So in that sense, I think that economies are not terribly well-prepared to think about the problems that we are facing. So we need to think about a different kind of response, and this requires us to have a very open conversation instead of the kind of confrontations and often knee-jerk reactions that we have been observing in recent weeks.

 

[Surrealistik]

Define “well above”.

Sure, I'll play your gotcha game; margins that exceed recent norms would be a good start; y'know, the kind that would yield near doubling of profit margins from 2020 to 2021 and profit margins that haven't been seen since the 1950s:

Companies are pocketing their fattest profits in more than 70 years, even as they complain about inflation

Companies aren't just raising prices enough to cover rising costs from inflation, they're padding their margins on top.

www.businessinsider.com

Why use Q1 of 2020 (during pandemic) as the baseline?

Honestly profits are so excessive that it doesn't matter; they're historically high.

Political spin with no specific examples of profit margin changes.

There is literally a sourced link buttressing the assertion that profits are at a ~70 year high per the above article.

Here is the “answer”:

This economist is literally saying that action is required with respect to general gouging after explicating the fact earlier that prices overall (not specifically gasoline) have indeed well exceeded any increase in costs; however, she is cautioning against knee jerk responses.

Personally I would have to study the retail gasoline situation more to be confident that there is indeed systemic gouging going on with regards to that specifically, but more generalized gouging is pretty much a given.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Sure, I'll play your gotcha game; margins that exceed recent norms would be a good start; y'know, the kind that would yield near doubling of profit margins from 2020 to 2021 and profit margins that haven't been seen since the 1950s:

Companies are pocketing their fattest profits in more than 70 years, even as they complain about inflation

Companies aren't just raising prices enough to cover rising costs from inflation, they're padding their margins on top.

www.businessinsider.com

Honestly profits are so excessive that it doesn't matter; they're historically high.


There is literally a sourced link buttressing the assertion that profits are at a ~70 year high per the above article.


This economist is literally saying that action is required with respect to general gouging after explicating the fact earlier that prices overall (not specifically gasoline) have indeed well exceeded any increase in costs; however, she is cautioning against knee jerk responses.

Personally I would have to study the retail gasoline situation more to be confident that there is indeed systemic gouging going on with regards to that specifically, but more generalized gouging is pretty much a given.

OK, but as the BI link noted, over half of small businesses are (allegedly) doing this. The big picture, according to the linked BI article’s graph, is that (average?) profit margins are up from about 13% in 2010 to about 15% now (after the recent dip to about 8% in between).

 

[rahl]

Him (I think) like me lived through the 1970s.

BTW how about just drill more, be pro pipeline and stop the lefts 40 year war on coal?

There is nothing preventing oil companies from drilling more, other than their executives who are maximizing profits currently. There have no incentive to increase production, because they are currently making record profits. There isn't a supply shortage, that would require more production.

 

[American]

Ban on ‘Excessive’ Gas Prices Heading for House Vote | Transport Topics

The U.S. president would have the authority to declare an emergency that would make the sale of gasoline at “excessive” prices illegal under legislation House Democrats plan to bring to the floor next week.

www.ttnews.com

When this fails, next comes price controls and pretty soon you will be waiting in line for 4 hours to buy gas at a "fair" price.


View attachment 67390501

You do know it's part of the far-left Democrat plan to make that all happen, right? They don't want the US to be a superpower anymore.

 

[ttwtt78640]

There is nothing preventing oil companies from drilling more, other than their executives who are maximizing profits currently. There have no incentive to increase production, because they are currently making record profits. There isn't a supply shortage, that would require more production.

Hmm… if there is no supply shortage then why increase production?

 

[American]

Which means the free market created the problem.

Dude, you wouldn't have a clue about that in a million years, nor could you produce a qualified source to support your assertion.

 

[American]

Hmm… if there is no supply shortage then why increase production?

He doesn't understand that leases and licenses can be manipulated with rules; rules that only people in the business understand, and not lamebrained leftwingers. He really believes the Biden Admin talking points that there's plenty of land and licenses to produce all the oil we want. It's only coincidental that our oil problems started after Biden promised to shut down the oil industry.

 

[American]

My understanding is the problem stems
from continued supply chain problems and a massive recall. It’s not a problem the market can fix. Or the government for that matter.

The Democrats OWNED the House of Representatives and many times the Senate from 1954 through 1994 with upwards of 100 vote margins. So literally the Republicans couldn't do anything. The Democrats over decades on end taxed the shit out of businesses until they sought friendlier places to manufacture. You can lay the massive loss of manufacturing completely at the feet of the Democratic Party, and their braindead voters. China makes most of the formula. It's not supply chain for any good reason, it's an attitude in this country that government should make all the decisions about the economy and businesses through taxes, and most importantly massive regulations. When Trump deregulated, things BEGAN to change for the better, but you can not turn decades of idiocy around in one term. The market could eventually fix this if we straighten up our laws, and become a business friendly country. It's like the difference between California and Texas.

 

[ttwtt78640]

He doesn't understand that leases and licenses can be manipulated with rules; rules that only people in the business understand, and not lamebrained leftwingers. He really believes the Biden Admin talking points that there's plenty of land and licenses to produce all the oil we want. It's only coincidental that our oil problems started after Biden promised to shut down the oil industry.

Yep, and when public colleges raise their tuition prices by much greater ”margins” not a peep about government’s “price gouging” - the answer, in that case, is to make public college “free” (by shifting the costs to “the rich”).

 

[rahl]

Hmm… if there is no supply shortage then why increase production?

Exactly.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Exactly.

Yep, Biden (under pressure from the left) wants to ’freeze’ the US fossil fuel industry, yet also wants them to help keep US motor fuel pump (and natural gas meter) prices down. Biden is not too bright, but is very sure that his (going “green” very soon?) energy policy is perfect - it’s just that folks don’t understand it’s brilliance.

 

[AZRWinger]

Get a battery and don’t worry about gas

Right, the battery will be magically charged by Unicorn farts and fairy dust.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Get a battery and don’t worry about gas

That “battery” (and the vehicle which come with it) likely costs $55K to over $100K (if a suitable EV is even available) which will buy lots of gas.

 

[CaughtInThe]

Dude, you wouldn't have a clue about that in a million years, nor could you produce a qualified source to support your assertion.

You're probably right. Last time I was in DC I remember all the CentGov owned formula producing plants.

 

[highroller]

That “battery” (and the vehicle which come with it) likely costs $55K to over $100K (if a suitable EV is even available) which will buy lots of gas.

So does a new truck

 

[American]

Yep, and when public colleges raise their tuition prices by much greater ”margins” not a peep about government’s “price gouging” - the answer, in that case, is to make public college “free” (by shifting the costs to “the rich”).

The government talk about eliminating student debt, which I doubt they have the legal authority to do. I think that's why they haven't done it yet.

 

[ttwtt78640]

So does a new truck

Agreed, but I have an old (2002) truck. BTW, how many EV trucks (capable of towing 7000# GRVW trailers) are available?

 

[AZRWinger]

What makes the price a "gouge"?

Why ignorant Democrats needing to get reelected by making false promises is what makes it gouging.

Gas prices are largely determined by the price of oil futures contracts.

If a refinery is producing gasoline from oil it bought for $50 a barrel but the current futures contracts price is $110 per barrel are they supposed to pretend they can buy the oil they need at $50 per barrel? Of course the P&L shows they are making a huge profit but that doesn't account for the spike in oil prices when they have to buy more futures contracts.

Democrats desperately need someone else to blame for Biden’s war on conventional energy. So-called greedy energy companies are just a target of opportunity. The last thing we need is to put President Biden who bans exploration for new domestic sources of energy while groveling before OPEC dictators to pump more oil in charge of gasoline prices.