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Americans are lazy protestors.

Hypersonic

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Upon reading recent arguments of immigrant reform, I can't help but look at the comments of the various "anti-immigrant" opponents, many people often state: "send them back to Mexico," yet, many Americans often utilize immigrant help, eat immigrant cuisine, and use immigrant products. I have to ask (regarding the immigrant debate) if immigration is such a problem and if many immigrants fail to acclimate to American culture, how come Americans don't protest English being the official language? (Maybe because it's unconstitutional?) Or why don't Americans accept higher prices in produce, fire illegal employees and employ Americans? (Maybe Americans don't want to pay higher taxes on produce and everything else).

Similarly, the welfare issue can be noted in the same argument. Why is it that most Americans get mad at welfare recipients and those who continue to overuse government assistance, why aren't any protest done? Why arenz't Americans organizing themselves in groups to make their voices heard? Why is it that when we as Americans find something invasive to our way of life we cry foul yet do nothing until the problem because immediate to use (e.g terrorism 9/11, recycling, climate change).

In taking the line by Keanu Reeves in "The Earth Stood Still" Klaatu says:

"In the face of chaos (he uses another word similar to this) humans do change"-Or something to that effect. But why do we wait for problems to be immediate to us? Just like immigration, welfare, national security, school shootings, Americans only act when the problem effects them directly.
 
Upon reading recent arguments of immigrant reform, I can't help but look at the comments of the various "anti-immigrant" opponents, many people often state: "send them back to Mexico," yet, many Americans often utilize immigrant help, eat immigrant cuisine, and use immigrant products. I have to ask (regarding the immigrant debate) if immigration is such a problem and if many immigrants fail to acclimate to American culture, how come Americans don't protest English being the official language? (Maybe because it's unconstitutional?) Or why don't Americans accept higher prices in produce, fire illegal employees and employ Americans? (Maybe Americans don't want to pay higher taxes on produce and everything else).

Similarly, the welfare issue can be noted in the same argument. Why is it that most Americans get mad at welfare recipients and those who continue to overuse government assistance, why aren't any protest done? Why arenz't Americans organizing themselves in groups to make their voices heard? Why is it that when we as Americans find something invasive to our way of life we cry foul yet do nothing until the problem because immediate to use (e.g terrorism 9/11, recycling, climate change).

In taking the line by Keanu Reeves in "The Earth Stood Still" Klaatu says:

"In the face of chaos (he uses another word similar to this) humans do change"-Or something to that effect. But why do we wait for problems to be immediate to us? Just like immigration, welfare, national security, school shootings, Americans only act when the problem effects them directly.

In the day and age of the Internet and modern media, there are A LOT of gungho moral crusaders advocating changes to what ever problem they perceive. Those tendencies typically are restricted to the Internet, where they can hide behind the facade and visage that is their usernames.

As for reaping the rewards of what they denounce, all of the people who protest against immigration fail to realise how deeply ingrained it is into American, and in fact every other Western country, culture and daily process. People read things on the Internet and are instantly convinced, or they had bigots for parents perpetuate it on the Web.

tl;dr The Internet is a powerful force my friend.
 
Upon reading recent arguments of immigrant reform, I can't help but look at the comments of the various "anti-immigrant" opponents, many people often state: "send them back to Mexico," yet, many Americans often utilize immigrant help, eat immigrant cuisine, and use immigrant products. I have to ask (regarding the immigrant debate) if immigration is such a problem and if many immigrants fail to acclimate to American culture, how come Americans don't protest English being the official language? (Maybe because it's unconstitutional?) Or why don't Americans accept higher prices in produce, fire illegal employees and employ Americans? (Maybe Americans don't want to pay higher taxes on produce and everything else).

Similarly, the welfare issue can be noted in the same argument. Why is it that most Americans get mad at welfare recipients and those who continue to overuse government assistance, why aren't any protest done? Why arenz't Americans organizing themselves in groups to make their voices heard? Why is it that when we as Americans find something invasive to our way of life we cry foul yet do nothing until the problem because immediate to use (e.g terrorism 9/11, recycling, climate change).

In taking the line by Keanu Reeves in "The Earth Stood Still" Klaatu says:

"In the face of chaos (he uses another word similar to this) humans do change"-Or something to that effect. But why do we wait for problems to be immediate to us? Just like immigration, welfare, national security, school shootings, Americans only act when the problem effects them directly.

Protesting usually amounts to people making lots of noise wanting the gov't to "do/change something", so the cases that you have mentioned (immigration and welfare reform) one must honestly assess just what the gov't (specifically your own represetatives)would be willing to do. The gov't (your congress critters for example) does what is seen as being in their "best interest", which I define as allowing them to keep their jobs (win re-election).

Obviously most can "protest" until their face turns blue and their feet/arms get tired but only in their district or state. If you live in a district/state that already has a representative that shares your view that is a waste of time, if your representative does not share your view you must honestly assess whether your opposing view has enough following to actually sway their opinion (i.e. can you actually get them unseated if they do not change their postition). I feel that, generally, our politicians respond to polls (and campaign cash) and tend to ignore "the loud"; so simply being loud has little merit or beneficial effect in the big political picture.
 
Protesting usually amounts to people making lots of noise wanting the gov't to "do/change something", so the cases that you have mentioned (immigration and welfare reform) one must honestly assess just what the gov't (specifically your own represetatives)would be willing to do. The gov't (your congress critters for example) does what is seen as being in their "best interest", which I define as allowing them to keep their jobs (win re-election).

Obviously most can "protest" until their face turns blue and their feet/arms get tired but only in their district or state. If you live in a district/state that already has a representative that shares your view that is a waste of time, if your representative does not share your view you must honestly assess whether your opposing view has enough following to actually sway their opinion (i.e. can you actually get them unseated if they do not change their postition). I feel that, generally, our politicians respond to polls (and campaign cash) and tend to ignore "the loud"; so simply being loud has little merit or beneficial effect in the big political picture.


Well the civil rights leaders were loud and active in a time where nobody would listen and they were able to effectively make change. Ghandi staged a hunger strike, and was able to effectively change India. The aforementioned issues are a national issue, not local. It would be different if we were discussing traffic lights, and wrong turn signs but this is an issue that effects many Americans. If protesting has no merit then Americans shouldn't complain.
 
Upon reading recent arguments of immigrant reform, I can't help but look at the comments of the various "anti-immigrant" opponents, many people often state: "send them back to Mexico," yet, many Americans often utilize immigrant help, eat immigrant cuisine, and use immigrant products. I have to ask (regarding the immigrant debate) if immigration is such a problem and if many immigrants fail to acclimate to American culture, how come Americans don't protest English being the official language? (Maybe because it's unconstitutional?) Or why don't Americans accept higher prices in produce, fire illegal employees and employ Americans? (Maybe Americans don't want to pay higher taxes on produce and everything else).

Similarly, the welfare issue can be noted in the same argument. Why is it that most Americans get mad at welfare recipients and those who continue to overuse government assistance, why aren't any protest done? Why arenz't Americans organizing themselves in groups to make their voices heard? Why is it that when we as Americans find something invasive to our way of life we cry foul yet do nothing until the problem because immediate to use (e.g terrorism 9/11, recycling, climate change).

In taking the line by Keanu Reeves in "The Earth Stood Still" Klaatu says:

"In the face of chaos (he uses another word similar to this) humans do change"-Or something to that effect. But why do we wait for problems to be immediate to us? Just like immigration, welfare, national security, school shootings, Americans only act when the problem effects them directly.

Trouble is.... with the MSM propaganda machine telling everyone who will listen, that everything is OK,
AMERICA is the greatest country on the face of this earth and WE THE PEOPLE actually run things because
as we all know AMERICA is a "DEMOCRACY" .... right & I'm the Easter Bunny!
 
Well the civil rights leaders were loud and active in a time where nobody would listen and they were able to effectively make change. Ghandi staged a hunger strike, and was able to effectively change India. The aforementioned issues are a national issue, not local. It would be different if we were discussing traffic lights, and wrong turn signs but this is an issue that effects many Americans. If protesting has no merit then Americans shouldn't complain.

Nonsnese. If the politicians (or at least most of them) that voted for the changes were not re-elected but instead replaced by their opposition it would have been reversed in short order. I believe that you have the tail wagging the dog here. It was other members of the voting public, not just the politicians, that changed their minds on these matters.
 
Nonsnese. If the politicians (or at least most of them) that voted for the changes were not re-elected but instead replaced by their opposition it would have been reversed in short order. I believe that you have the tail wagging the dog here. It was other members of the voting public, not just the politicians, that changed their minds on these matters.

Really. So the civil rights leaders didn't live in a time where racism was prevalent and that there were segregated restrooms? Are you saying there were politicians who fought for civil rights and that from 1896 to 1954 was just a fluke in American rights? That was about 58 years for U.S citizens who fought for civil rights. My point is, it makes no sense for Americans to remain armchair warriors complaining about national issues when they do nothing. If Americans care about illegal immigrants taking their jobs then Americans should demand for our taxes to be raised to compensate for the federal minimum wage, kick undocumented immigrants out of the fields, employ Americans with health benefits. Also keep strict rules on grass cutters, housekeepers and construction workers. Make sure every single born American citizen has a social security number and has documents proving their citizenship. But of course, the average American will not do that, just like armchair warriors wont argue to Congress regarding Welfare reform, its all about blowing smoke.
 
Really. So the civil rights leaders didn't live in a time where racism was prevalent and that there were segregated restrooms? Are you saying there were politicians who fought for civil rights and that from 1896 to 1954 was just a fluke in American rights? That was about 58 years for U.S citizens who fought for civil rights. My point is, it makes no sense for Americans to remain armchair warriors complaining about national issues when they do nothing. If Americans care about illegal immigrants taking their jobs then Americans should demand for our taxes to be raised to compensate for the federal minimum wage, kick undocumented immigrants out of the fields, employ Americans with health benefits. Also keep strict rules on grass cutters, housekeepers and construction workers. Make sure every single born American citizen has a social security number and has documents proving their citizenship. But of course, the average American will not do that, just like armchair warriors wont argue to Congress regarding Welfare reform, its all about blowing smoke.

No, its all about electing morons beholden to those that supply them campaign cash and making the same failed promises of "better things lie ahead" if you re-elect me. How is all of that hope and change, coupled with a completely transparent gov't, going line by line through the federal "budget" and removing any waste working out for us?
 
No, its all about electing morons beholden to those that supply them campaign cash and making the same failed promises of "better things lie ahead" if you re-elect me. How is all of that hope and change, coupled with a completely transparent gov't, going line by line through the federal "budget" and removing any waste working out for us?

I am not making this about elected officials who make false promises this is about the average citizen complaining about issues from afar, but do nothing about it except blogging and venting.
 
Why wouldn't Americans be a reflection of their politicians, when a USA Senate filibuster is really not a filibuster?
 
Upon reading recent arguments of immigrant reform, I can't help but look at the comments of the various "anti-immigrant" opponents, many people often state: "send them back to Mexico," yet, many Americans often utilize immigrant help, eat immigrant cuisine, and use immigrant products. I have to ask (regarding the immigrant debate) if immigration is such a problem and if many immigrants fail to acclimate to American culture, how come Americans don't protest English being the official language? (Maybe because it's unconstitutional?) Or why don't Americans accept higher prices in produce, fire illegal employees and employ Americans? (Maybe Americans don't want to pay higher taxes on produce and everything else).

What makes you think those who hire immigrants and eat Mexican food are the same ones who protest?
 
Upon reading recent arguments of immigrant reform, I can't help but look at the comments of the various "anti-immigrant" opponents, many people often state: "send them back to Mexico," yet, many Americans often utilize immigrant help, eat immigrant cuisine, and use immigrant products. I have to ask (regarding the immigrant debate) if immigration is such a problem and if many immigrants fail to acclimate to American culture, how come Americans don't protest English being the official language? (Maybe because it's unconstitutional?) Or why don't Americans accept higher prices in produce, fire illegal employees and employ Americans? (Maybe Americans don't want to pay higher taxes on produce and everything else).

Similarly, the welfare issue can be noted in the same argument. Why is it that most Americans get mad at welfare recipients and those who continue to overuse government assistance, why aren't any protest done? Why arenz't Americans organizing themselves in groups to make their voices heard? Why is it that when we as Americans find something invasive to our way of life we cry foul yet do nothing until the problem because immediate to use (e.g terrorism 9/11, recycling, climate change).

In taking the line by Keanu Reeves in "The Earth Stood Still" Klaatu says:

"In the face of chaos (he uses another word similar to this) humans do change"-Or something to that effect. But why do we wait for problems to be immediate to us? Just like immigration, welfare, national security, school shootings, Americans only act when the problem effects them directly.

In what sense are the protesters - those who oppose - the same ones who 'eat immigrant cuisine'?

What is immigrant cuisine, by the way? Do you mean eating at a Chinese restaurant or Taco Bell? . . . Or are you talking about places that hire illegal immigrants to work there (stores, factories, etc - not just food places)

If this 2nd is the case: yes - I know people avoid eating food prepared by Chinese or Mexicans...and when it's done that way - it's racist. Why? Because they don't know if someone is here legally. No one can tell just by looking at another person. THAT is why it must be dealt with on a higher level, rules, regulations, government laws, etc. . . and there are groups that are organized, which go about things respectfully rather than randomly being assholes.

It's not my place, or anyone's place, to boycott 'a people' based on that they 'might' be here illegally. . . and if you're wondering why more people don't do it then that's a good sign - we're not a bunch of dicks.
 
What makes you think those who hire immigrants and eat Mexican food are the same ones who protest?

It was said tongue in cheek. However there have been politicians of the past who were very critical of illegal immigration and who had hired an undocumented worker themselves. America is a very paradoxical country. My point in that regard (The one you quoted) was that Americans enjoy the luxury of housekeepers, fruit pickers, or any other worker who is willing to work for low wage to keep cost down yet in the same breathe want to criticize the immigrants lack of acclimation into this country. The same can be said of those who use government assistance. We say "government assistance recipients are lazy" yet we have no qualms with accepting social security checks. This is what I'm saying.

If Americans truly care about change why aren't Americans protesting? Hell, the Egyptian people are doing better than the average America when it comes to being in the streets and voices being heard.
 
In what sense are the protesters - those who oppose - the same ones who 'eat immigrant cuisine'?

What is immigrant cuisine, by the way? Do you mean eating at a Chinese restaurant or Taco Bell? . . . Or are you talking about places that hire illegal immigrants to work there (stores, factories, etc - not just food places)

If this 2nd is the case: yes - I know people avoid eating food prepared by Chinese or Mexicans...and when it's done that way - it's racist. Why? Because they don't know if someone is here legally. No one can tell just by looking at another person. THAT is why it must be dealt with on a higher level, rules, regulations, government laws, etc. . . and there are groups that are organized, which go about things respectfully rather than randomly being assholes.

It's not my place, or anyone's place, to boycott 'a people' based on that they 'might' be here illegally. . . and if you're wondering why more people don't do it then that's a good sign - we're not a bunch of dicks.

See my post #13
 
Upon reading recent arguments of immigrant reform, I can't help but look at the comments of the various "anti-immigrant" opponents, many people often state: "send them back to Mexico," yet, many Americans often utilize immigrant help, eat immigrant cuisine, and use immigrant products. I have to ask (regarding the immigrant debate) if immigration is such a problem

Your issue is with lazy protesters. Mine is with lazy debaters; the kind that don't worry about facts and just say stuff. The problem people are having isn't with immigrants. It's with ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION. The problem is people coming here and staying here ILLEGALLY. So if you can make an argument out of that, please go ahead and try again and maybe there will be hope for a sensible discussion.
 
Americans only act when the problem effects them directly.
Because americans are selfish people. (in the good way)
they live good, they will die one day, they don't care a lot for the global warming, if a guy was shoot on his street or if their neighborhood is a mexican or african.
As long as their life is secure, they do not really care even if their politicians abuse or if their taxes goes to egypt. Of course they are there to criticize to bring better ideas and solutions.
Even if world fall in economic crisis, the americans will eat the same food and have the same satisfaction for their life.
Some other countries will lack the basic food on crisis times.

They are not lazy, they just do not have a cause to protest.
 
See my post #13

Yes - which doesn't quite explain things, but it seems you want us to die over our views regarding immigration . . . even though it's not worth the bloodshed.

Egyptians are dying without a plan . . . it's not a protest or a war, it's an all out slaughter. What will come of it? Nothing in their favor.
 
Trouble is.... with the MSM propaganda machine telling everyone who will listen, that everything is OK,
AMERICA is the greatest country on the face of this earth and WE THE PEOPLE actually run things because
as we all know AMERICA is a "DEMOCRACY" .... right & I'm the Easter Bunny!

Wow. I didn't know that. Cool.
 
We say "government assistance recipients are lazy" yet we have no qualms with accepting social security checks. This is what I'm saying.

Why are saying it? We accept social security checks because we paid into all our lives.
 
Your issue is with lazy protesters. Mine is with lazy debaters; the kind that don't worry about facts and just say stuff. The problem people are having isn't with immigrants. It's with ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION. The problem is people coming here and staying here ILLEGALLY. So if you can make an argument out of that, please go ahead and try again and maybe there will be hope for a sensible discussion.

I am way hell of a better debator than you but that is a brief non sequitor. The issue with people and illegal immigration extends beyond whether immigrants are here legally or illegally as people often interchangably consider anyone non english speaking Latino, an illegal (ig I am wtong demonstrate proof). Second, the argument for illegal immigration reform is not just about people coming here and staying here but about the lack of acclimating to American culture (whatever that is, but typically referring to those who don't speak english and those who represent both their former homeland as well as America). In addition, illegal immigration reform opponents argue illegal immigrants utilize the welfare system thus putting a drain of society (facts show whites and blacks predominantly utilize welfare the most).

Illegal immigrant opponents argue "They take our jobs" well if the average American is prepared to pay $2.00 for an apple (I am exaggerating that figure) then protest companoes to be accountable, fire non documented workers, give jobs to Americans but grocery shoppers must be aware of inflated cost due to farms compensating on paying for not just federal minimum wage, but healthcare.


Most Americans simply vent on social issues. This thread isn't about posting numbers on one specific issue, it about Americans complaining without taking action. I mean FFS how many Americans don't know that making English an official U.S language contradictory to the U.S constitution?
 
Because americans are selfish people. (in the good way)
they live good, they will die one day, they don't care a lot for the global warming, if a guy was shoot on his street or if their neighborhood is a mexican or african.
As long as their life is secure, they do not really care even if their politicians abuse or if their taxes goes to egypt. Of course they are there to criticize to bring better ideas and solutions.
Even if world fall in economic crisis, the americans will eat the same food and have the same satisfaction for their life.
Some other countries will lack the basic food on crisis times.

They are not lazy, they just do not have a cause to protest.

That is the problem with society, it's selfish and that is where I question the integrity of Americans. It's funny most Americans didn't care about recycling until recycling plants offered financial incentives then everyone started recycling, not because they sincerely care for the environment, but because it's money. The same with immigration. Nobody cared when pedro was cleaning your hotel room, but as soon as pedro, jose, Guadalupe, Jesus, started moving into "white areas" now we have to care abouy about illegal immigration.

Same with global warming. These issues are only a problem when its a direct threat to our communities. I mean hell, look at the Sandy Hook shooting. Things like that happened back in the 90's in L.A but why does it take that incident to start discussing guns? That is my point.
 
Looks to me like the lazy ones are the ones who cross the border illegally instead of fighting to change their corrupt country.
 
Yes - which doesn't quite explain things, but it seems you want us to die over our views regarding immigration . . . even though it's not worth the bloodshed.

Egyptians are dying without a plan . . . it's not a protest or a war, it's an all out slaughter. What will come of it? Nothing in their favor.

No I am not asking any American to die over issues that doesn't require innocent human life. I was merely referring to passion of the Egyptian people who believe in something so fiercely that they are willing to lay down their lives for that passion. Again, I am not saying Americans ought to die over the aforementioned issues, but I am saying if Americans feel welfare needs reformed, why aren't tax payers in the streets or arguing to the pre president that hardworking Americans protesting on reform?

I mean if one of you guys started a petition I'd sign it. All I am saying is instead of going to yahoo, msn, or even DP, folks need to act.
 
I am way hell of a better debator than you but that is a brief non sequitor. The issue with people and illegal immigration extends beyond whether immigrants are here legally or illegally as people often interchangably consider anyone non english speaking Latino, an illegal (ig I am wtong demonstrate proof). Second, the argument for illegal immigration reform is not just about people coming here and staying here but about the lack of acclimating to American culture (whatever that is, but typically referring to those who don't speak english and those who represent both their former homeland as well as America). In addition, illegal immigration reform opponents argue illegal immigrants utilize the welfare system thus putting a drain of society (facts show whites and blacks predominantly utilize welfare the most).

Illegal immigrant opponents argue "They take our jobs" well if the average American is prepared to pay $2.00 for an apple (I am exaggerating that figure) then protest companoes to be accountable, fire non documented workers, give jobs to Americans but grocery shoppers must be aware of inflated cost due to farms compensating on paying for not just federal minimum wage, but healthcare.


Most Americans simply vent on social issues. This thread isn't about posting numbers on one specific issue, it about Americans complaining without taking action. I mean FFS how many Americans don't know that making English an official U.S language contradictory to the U.S constitution?

A rather odd argument to make by a person that participates on a site that requires all posts to be in English, but to each their own. ;)

From "Forum Rules":

7. English - All threads will be in the English language. Threads and posts which are not in English may be edited or deleted at the discretion of a Moderator. Please include translations with any posts that are not in English.
 
Upon reading recent arguments of immigrant reform, I can't help but look at the comments of the various "anti-immigrant" opponents, many people often state: "send them back to Mexico," yet, many Americans often utilize immigrant help, eat immigrant cuisine, and use immigrant products. I have to ask (regarding the immigrant debate) if immigration is such a problem and if many immigrants fail to acclimate to American culture, how come Americans don't protest English being the official language? (Maybe because it's unconstitutional?) Or why don't Americans accept higher prices in produce, fire illegal employees and employ Americans? (Maybe Americans don't want to pay higher taxes on produce and everything else).

Similarly, the welfare issue can be noted in the same argument. Why is it that most Americans get mad at welfare recipients and those who continue to overuse government assistance, why aren't any protest done? Why arenz't Americans organizing themselves in groups to make their voices heard? Why is it that when we as Americans find something invasive to our way of life we cry foul yet do nothing until the problem because immediate to use (e.g terrorism 9/11, recycling, climate change).

In taking the line by Keanu Reeves in "The Earth Stood Still" Klaatu says:

"In the face of chaos (he uses another word similar to this) humans do change"-Or something to that effect. But why do we wait for problems to be immediate to us? Just like immigration, welfare, national security, school shootings, Americans only act when the problem effects them directly.
We're not anti immigrant we're anti illegal imagrant there is a big difference there.
 
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