Pacridge said:
I'm no fan of abortion- but how does emotion justify abortion?
Doesn't the arguement basically fall to when you believe life begins? From what I can see you have some saying life begins at conception and others who seem to think it begins at birth. Isn't that the real arguement here? And if life begins prior to birth- what about birth control? Is that wrong as well?
Birth control, while somewhat related, is a separate subject and is better discussed without references to abortion.
My statement relative to emotion is simply this. Since no one has ever provided scientific or medical factual information that justifies abortion, the only reason for having one is emotion. The two most popular reasons, both of which are emotional, are:
To avoid embarrassment,
The pregnancy has occurred at an inconvenient time.
Perhaps it helps if one looks at it this way.
In the past, learned people were convinced that the earth was the center of the solar system. They were convinced that the sun revolved around the earth. As knowledge and understanding advanced, the truth became known.
In the past, learned people were convinced that the earth was flat and that ships sailing too close to the edge would fall off. As knowledge and understanding advanced, the truth became known.
In the past, learned people were convinced that man could never fly; that the automobile would never replace the horse; that automation would never work; and on; and on; and on.
Things that were not known became known. And, so it continues.
In 1973, learned people, justices of the Supreme Court, openly confessed their ignorance of the answer to the question of when human life begins. They did not have the benefit of the technological advances that came later in the fields of science, obstetrics, and genetics. They based their decision solely on what was known.
On the off-chance that you did not see my response to an earlier post, I have copied it below. I believe that it provides answers to those who wish to have answers. I am mindful, of course, that there are those who don't wish to know the truth because truth can often be painful.
If there are points with which you disagree, please state your factual reasons.
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say, “…. we’re talking about people’s lives here …” and I agree with you. However, each abortion involves two lives, doesn’t it? One that survives, one that does not.
In an earlier part of your post, you wrote, “…you need to join us here in the 21st century.” I would like to extend the same invitation to all those who continue to adhere to the 1973 thinking of Justice Harry Blackmun, who, in writing the Roe v Wade decision included these words in Section IX B:
“Texas urges that, apart from the Fourteenth Amendment, life begins at conception and is present throughout pregnancy, and that, therefore, the State has a compelling interest in protecting that life from and after conception. We need not resolve the difficult question of when life begins. When those trained in the respective disciplines of medicine, philosophy, and theology are unable to arrive at any consensus, the judiciary, at this point in the development of man's knowledge, is not in a position to speculate as to the answer."
Mr. Justice Blackmun was making a simple observation. He was saying that, since this court, in 1973, doesn’t don’t know the calendar of events that take place in the womb, we will pass the buck to some future court that will have the understanding that this court lacks.
Now, here in the 21st century, what do we understand, as a result of research in science, obstetrics, and genetic research?
• Day 1 - conception takes place.
• 7 days - tiny human implants in mother’s uterus.
• 10 days - mother’s menses stop.
• 18 days - heart begins to beat.
• 21 days - pumps own blood through separate closed circulatory system with own blood type.
• 28 days - eye, ear and respiratory system begin to form.
• 42 days - brain waves recorded, skeleton complete, reflexes present.
• 7 weeks - thumbsucking.
• 8 weeks - all body systems present.
• 9 weeks - squints, swallows, moves tongue, makes fist.
• 11 weeks - spontaneous breathing movements, has fingernails, all body systems working.
• 12 weeks - weighs one ounce.
• 16 weeks - genital organs clearly differentiated, grasps with hands, swims, kicks, turns, somersaults, (still not felt by the mother.)
• 18 weeks - vocal cords work – can cry.
• 20 weeks - has hair on head, weighs one pound, 12 inches long.
• 23 weeks - 15% chance of viability outside of womb if birth premature.*
• 24 weeks - 56% of babies survive premature birth.*
• 25 weeks - 79% of babies survive premature birth.*
(*Source: M. Allen et. al., "The Limits of Viability." New England Journal
of Medicine. 11/25/93: Vol. 329, No. 22, p. 1597.)
Genetic research has enabled doctors to work back to the point where the 23 chromosomes from the sperm unite with the 23 chromosomes from the egg to form a new life which is unique. This new life is different from that of both parents and entirely separate from that of the mother whose role in the development of the child will continue unchanged for some years. From the moment of conception the role of the mother is to furnish shelter, nourishment, and protection to the child until such time as the child has grown to point of self-sufficiency. This is an indeterminate period. The first nine months are pre-natal, but the post-natal period runs into many years.
Ultra-sound motion images, now a routine part of pre-natal care, clearly show the infant in real time living color doing all of the things inside the womb that he will be doing outside the womb a few months hence. Few who are present at one of these sessions are able to hold back the tears. None can deny that they are watching the antics of a living human child.
You say that those who opt for abortion don’t feel the same about abortion as I do. I question the validity of that premise. It is not at all a matter of feelings. In an enlightened society, whether a human lives or dies can never be a matter of feelings.
Please be mindful that everything I have written is factual and completely secular. The question of abortion should never be discussed on religious grounds. And, it doesn’t have to be. There are indisputable sufficient scientific, medical, and genetic grounds which make the case that abortion takes a human life.
The sole question remaining is whether one should have the power to take the life of the human occupant of a womb.
However that is no longer an ethical question. It has become a question of money -- and everyone knows what happens when big money is at stake. The sheer economics of the industry which has grown since 1973 demands that a steady stream of ‘patients’ be fed to the cash cow that provides many jobs, sells much equipment, rents much space, and has created many millionaires.
Since economics and politics go hand in hand, it is understandable that the sizable political contributions flowing from the proponents of the status quo have rendered their targeted political supporters deaf, dumb, and blind to the truth.
I acknowledge that there are additional points in your post which I have not yet addressed. I believe that it’s better to settle this point first:
Abortion takes a human life. There are no medical or scientific facts that justify the nearly 50 million abortions which have occurred in the US since Roe v Wade.