Would death penalty in OBL's case be justifiable?

[jamesrage]

No doubt! Of course not. However, to become as zealotous and murderous as they are does us no good either, and in fact feeds into their objectives. Also consider that behaviors such as this very mentality are the ones that perpetuate the cycle; creating situations like we have now where new terrorists are bred by the hundreds of thousands, and without the "bad guys" having to do anything to make it happen.

So... We do ourselves no favors by becoming blood-crazed maniacs.

While I acknowledged your point on killing Bin-Ladin, James, you failed to acknowledge any of mine on why we shouldn't.

I understand your point that terrorist will just do terrorist attacks to mark the day he was executed.However it comes down to will they eventually tire of trying to avenge a dead terrorist or will they keep trying to free a terrorist who more than likely could survive many decades behind bars and how many people will die as a either result.

In response to suicide bombers being bred from the martyrdom we would create by killing Bin-Ladin, you wrote:

And you're lying to yourself too. You're living in a wet dream. That's not reality. They don't see him the way we see him, and they're not going to until we engage them (intellecutally and emotionally) and give them good reason to do so.

Regular Joe Smoe muslims are starting to realize that their ass is on the line and they are being caught in the cross fire.

True. What's your point?

The jew haters out in the world will always find a reason to bomb and blame Israel for something.

Really? How has that worked for us so far? How about Israel who has been doing it for over 60 years? Worked well for them, no? No; it hasn't. See... there's the problem... what you and I and many others want to do or would like to do... doesn't work. And it's been proven many many times

Arresting someone and sticking them behind bars will no one will see them does not make examples out of people.

And calling you a WASP is probably accurate as well. That doesn't make it right, intelligent for me to do so, productive for me to do so, or very worth listening to, does it?

White Anglo-Saxon Protestant?If that is what it means then I really have no idea if I am a anglo saxon decendant since I am not familiar with my ancestry.I do whine like a sissy because someone lables me what I am.Pollitically correct notions are for men in skirts and other sissys.

As for the Islamo-nazi comment refering to the Muslim terrorist and extreamist ,it is very acurate.They preach death to the infidel,death to jews and roughly all their problems are blamed on jews or infidels and they wish to exterminate both.Sounds like a nazi to me.

 

[jamesrage]

No it isn't. Should heterosexuals who practice sodomy not be able to get married? Should heterosexuals who practice oral sex not be able to get married? It isn't the Governments business at all where anyone sticks anything unless there is a violation of rights by way of inadequate moral agency.

If you recieve a discount,a benifit or special privilage from the government then what you do is their business.Some of these universities that recieve government money have to let recruiters on campuses,almost any religious and or non-profit orginization that recieves tax except status has to meet certian requirements in order to keep their tax except status.

The Government should encourage monogamy. Period.

The government should encourage monogamous relationships that encourage procreation to maintain population growth.Homosexual can not pro-create on their own and therefor such behavior should be discouraged.

Is everything you do in your life in for God? Have you submitted your entire life, your words, your actions, to God?

No but I am working on it.

This is what Islam requires. Submission to God, totally and completely.

SO flying a planes into a buildings, honor killings,suicide bombings and other terrorist and animal acts is a submission to God?

Does your Qur'an have the original Arabic text? Does your Qur'an have essays and information regarding conflicting beliefs of certain passages? I recieved this book as a Christmas present (I know, I know, AWKWARD) and I don't know how much was paid for it, but it was precisely what I wanted and needed.

Is this what you got?

 

[jamesrage]

We have seen Radical Islamists perform acts of violence and execute innocent civillians over "political prisoners." Whenever legal conditions permit, we should kill terrorists on the spot. We should not give them a chance to surrender if we can help it. Contrary to academic wisdon, the surest way to make a martyr of a terrorist is to capture, convict, and imprison him, leading to endless efforts by sympathizers to stage kidnappings, hijacking and other events intended to liberate the imprisoned terrorists. This is war, not law enforcement.

Many of you do not appreciate the nature of what we face. Many of you haven't an iota of insight to the study of terrorism, Radical Islam, or the Middle East. When spouting off "opinions," one should stop to think about what those opinions are based on. Are they based on intellect, study, or facts? Or are they based on emotion and fantasy? Our enemies in the "War on Terror" are men who believe, literally, that they are on a mission from God to destroy your civilization and, who regard death as a promotion, are not impressed by our morals and restrictions to remain civil. We must find them; no matter how long it takes, and then kill them. If they surrender, we must accord them their rights under the laws of war and international conventions. But, as we have learned so painfully from all the mindless, left-wing nonsense spouted about the prisoners at Guantanamo Bay, we are much better off killing them before they have a chance to surrender. This is not about diplomatic table manners. This is war.

No, the absolutely best thing the soldier or Marine in the field with Osama Bin Laden in his sights could do is pull the trigger before the "death penalty" or "martyrdom" even becomes an issue. Why do you think we haven't seen proof of life for over a year, yet attempts continue to be made by our enemies to show the Muslim world that he is still alive? He is a "living" martyr and our enemies need to keep him that way. He is proof that one can inflict great damage on the "great Satan" and get away with it.

Good post,I am glad someone besides me understands the situation and the nature of our enimies that our troops are dealing with.

 

[MSgt]

Good post,I am glad someone besides me understands the situation and the nature of our enimies that our troops are dealing with.

It's all in the study.

 

[Alastor]

I understand your point that terrorist will just do terrorist attacks to mark the day he was executed.However it comes down to will they eventually tire of trying to avenge a dead terrorist or will they keep trying to free a terrorist who more than likely could survive many decades behind bars and how many people will die as a either result.

But they still (to this very day) conduct bombings to commemorate the death of Muhammed, and the Crusades, and so forth. So ... No. They wouldn't ever tire of avenging someone they felt was murdered. That's not part of their culture the way it is here. In their culture letting go of "being wronged" isn't very well accepted. They see vengeance and redemption as a means of showing their own worth. No, it wouldn't go away. If we kill someone that they deem as a martyr, we're in for the long haul.

Didn't you ever wonder why Arafat was tolerated so long? Why it was so important to bring Saddam in alive, and why we never actually just invaded and killed Bin-Ladin many years ago when we knew where he was?

It's not in their culture to just "get over" things or "let go."

Regular Joe Smoe muslims are starting to realize that their ass is on the line and they are being caught in the cross fire.

I disagree with your assessment. I've actually been there and been submersed in their culture, and no... That's simply not the case. In order for that to be the case, we'd have to connect with them on a human and emotional level, and argue in a credible fashion what our points were and convince them of that. So far we haven't done that.

The only compelling reason any Arab people have for working with the West right now, is that they don't want to get bombed to crap, and even that doesn't deter most of them. It's not like we're "bringing them around to their senses" over there. If anything, we've lent credibility to our detractors; especially recently.

The jew haters out in the world will always find a reason to bomb and blame Israel for something.

True. And?

Arresting someone and sticking them behind bars will no one will see them does not make examples out of people.

You don't get it. They won't see it as an example. They'll see it as a motivation and a wrong to be avenged. You simply don't understand their culture or their minds. Their culture is not like ours. Stop thinking they think like you and I; they DON'T.

They are products of a different upbringing, a different mentality, and an entirely different ontology. Interpret things through their eyes, not your own.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

If you recieve a discount,a benifit or special privilage from the government then what you do is their business.Some of these universities that recieve government money have to let recruiters on campuses,almost any religious and or non-profit orginization that recieves tax except status has to meet certian requirements in order to keep their tax except status.

So would you say that a heterosexual couple that has consensual anal sex is at all the Government's business?

The answer is no.

The government should encourage monogamous relationships that encourage procreation to maintain population growth.Homosexual can not pro-create on their own and therefor such behavior should be discouraged.

The Government could utilize homosexual couples to care for the children given away to adoption, the ones that heterosexual couples decided not to care for. Me and you both are against abortion, so we're going to have to deal with a flooded adoption system.

No but I am working on it.

That's not the response I would get from a Muslim.

SO flying a planes into a buildings, honor killings,suicide bombings and other terrorist and animal acts is a submission to God?

I would say that it is not, but I can assure you that the man who was flying the plane, the man that killed his daughter, the man that straps a bomb to his chest, has convinced himself at the very least that this is what God wants. This is why people think Muslims are violent, because all violence has to be justified. Violence for any other reason is Shirq.

Is this what you got?

[/quote]

No, mine is 3-D and the cover is red with different decorations.

 

[jamesrage]

So would you say that a heterosexual couple that has consensual anal sex is at all the Government's business?.

Heterosexual couples qualify for marriage because they meet the requirements for marriage.



The Government could utilize homosex

ual couples to care for the children given away to adoption, the ones that heterosexual couples decided not to care for. Me and you both are against abortion, so we're going to have to deal with a flooded adoption system.

If our adoption system was so flooded then why are americans adopting foreigners?

That's not the response I would get from a Muslim.

Again I am not animal who supports harming innocent people over a cartoon like the alledged devout muslims.

This is why people think Muslims are violent, because all violence has to be justified. Violence for any other reason is Shirq.

So as long as they use their religion as a excuse for murder and genocide it is okay in Islam?

No, mine is 3-D and the cover is red with different decorations.

I thought you were not going to engage in a ******* match over who has the better Qur'an.

 

[Liberal Troll Life]

How dare you suggest a wonderful strategic diplomat and great man like Osama bin Laden be sentenced to death? Osama bin Laden is a brilliant Islamic Patriot who is fighting for peace, justice, and gay rights in the Middle East. Osama should be put in charge of the UN because his glorious political views could benefit the rest of the civilized world.

By the way Osama bin Laden had nothing to do with the 9/11 attacks. George Bush and Dick Cheney piloted the planes that struck the twin towers. George Bush was also responsible for the holocaust, the San Francisco earthquake of 1906, the Black Death, and the extinction of the dinosaurs.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

Heterosexual couples qualify for marriage because they meet the requirements for marriage.

A pee pee and a hoo hoo equals marriage requirements?

You didn't answer my question.

Is it the government's business that a heterosexual does anything with either party's rectum?

If our adoption system was so flooded then why are americans adopting foreigners?

Americans aren't adopting foriegners. Angelina Jolie is. There is a difference. All the same I didn't say that the system was flooded. I said if me and you got our way and through abortion out the window, it would be.

Also there is sperm donation and surrogate mother and other things of this nature.

Again I am not animal who supports harming innocent people over a cartoon like the alledged devout muslims.

Is this your definition of "Muslim" now?

So as long as they use their religion as a excuse for murder and genocide it is okay in Islam?

No, it's not. There are disagreements of course as to what is God's will, but to a Muslim, an individual, everything he does has to be for God.

I thought you were not going to engage in a ******* match over who has the better Qur'an.

I'm not. You asked me if my Qur'an looked like that, and I said that it didn't and went on to describe it.

 

[Liberal Troll Life]

I agree with Gandhi>Bush. Marriage is anything you want it to be. For example, me and my cat, Mr. Fuzzy, have been trying to get married for 6 months now, but our fascist government won't recognize me and my life partner as a union. I mean, sure, Mr. Fuzzy still "gets around" and all that (if you know what I mean), but he can never find anything CLOSE to what I can give him!

 

[jamesrage]

A pee pee and a hoo hoo equals marriage requirements?

You didn't answer my question.

Is it the government's business that a heterosexual does anything with either party's rectum?

If you recieve benifit,privalieges from unlce same then thye have a right to demand that certian requirements be met in order to recieve those benifits,exemptions and or privilages.

Americans aren't adopting foriegners.

Are you sure about that?Because I have known a few soldiers where Koreans adopted by American parents.
http://www.china.org.cn/english/2002/Jun/35579.htm
http://www.adoptkorea.com/
http://www.africanadoptions.org/
http://www.childrenshopeint.org/

All the same I didn't say that the system was flooded. I said if me and you got our way and through abortion out the window, it would be.

I seriously doubt that because people might think twice if they have to deal with cojsiquinces instead of murdering their unborn child.

Is this your definition of "Muslim" now?

My definition of muslim is a practitioner of Islam.If I had to describe what Islam is I would have to say it is a rip off and bastardization of Judiasm and Christianity. The people I am refering to as animals are those protesters/terrorist who cheared when terrorist flew planes into buildings,the same people who cheared when people blew themselves up to murder innocent people,the same people who cheared when other animals slaughtered Christians and other non-muslims who are now whining because someone drew Mohammed in a disrespectful manner.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

If you recieve benifit,privalieges from unlce same then thye have a right to demand that certian requirements be met in order to recieve those benifits,exemptions and or privilages.

Is it the government's business that they have sex in the form of "doggy style?" Is it the government's business if they cover each other in chocolate and/or "I Can't Believe it's Not Butter" and proceed to lick it off one another?

Is it the Government's business that a heterosexual couple have consensual anal sex inside of marriage? Yes, or no?

Are you sure about that?Because I have known a few soldiers where Koreans adopted by American parents.
http://www.china.org.cn/english/2002/Jun/35579.htm
http://www.adoptkorea.com/
http://www.africanadoptions.org/
http://www.childrenshopeint.org/

http://statistics.adoption.com/information/adoption-statistics-numbers-trends.html

120,000 children adopted every year. 13,000 + from other countries. That means it's a little over 10%. That's really not that much.

I seriously doubt that because people might think twice if they have to deal with cojsiquinces instead of murdering their unborn child.

People aren't going to stop having sex just because of an act of congress and/or the supreme court.

My definition of muslim is a practitioner of Islam.If I had to describe what Islam is I would have to say it is a rip off and bastardization of Judiasm and Christianity.

In that sense, Christianity is a bastardization of Judaism and Judaism a bastardization of various Pagan myths.

The people I am refering to as animals are those protesters/terrorist who cheared when terrorist flew planes into buildings,the same people who cheared when people blew themselves up to murder innocent people,the same people who cheared when other animals slaughtered Christians and other non-muslims who are now whining because someone drew Mohammed in a disrespectful manner.

Then why when I say "I would not get the same response from a Muslim" would you respond with a claim that you are not an animal?

 

[jamesrage]

People aren't going to stop having sex just because of an act of congress and/or the supreme court.

They may not stop having sex but you know those little rubber balloons things that usually have some kind of lubrication on them,it has been around for decades,those things help stop most deseases deseases and as a means of birth control,I beleave those things are called condums.

There is also this little pill that is taken in regular scheduled doses to control fertility,women usually take these pills,I beleave those pills are refered to as birth controll pills.I think those pills have also been around for decades.

Then why when I say "I would not get the same response from a Muslim" would you respond with a claim that you are not an animal?

Because most muslims who are rioting over a cartoon are animals the same muslims that you claim to be devout.

 

[superskippy]

I say execute him, public execution if need be after all his victims are in the thousands and those who knew the victems are in the hundreds of thousands.

If you keep him in prison he becomes a rallying cry for him to be freed, just like all the bombings for the captured sheiks.

If you execute him he becomes a martyr this is true, but only for a short while in the end he will be passed by as the conflict readjusts and his death becomes history.

 

[cherokee]

starve him to death...But toward the end place a tray of pork in the room with him..

 

[Vader]

I think OBL needs to be kept in prison for the rest of his life. If he isn't allowed to die for his cause, he cannot be called a martyr.

It's better to prevent martyrs then to execute them. Keep them in a cell and let them suffer for all eternity.

 

[jamesrage]

I think OBL needs to be kept in prison for the rest of his life. If he isn't allowed to die for his cause, he cannot be called a martyr.

The only problem with that is his fellow terrorist would be holding hostage after hostage trying to get him freed and some rat liberal journalist would be doing a interview several years from now.

It's better to prevent martyrs then to execute them. Keep them in a cell and let them suffer for all eternity.

I say coat him in bacon grease and fry him on the electric chair,then cremate him and mix his ashes with some pig **** and sell it on ebay.

 

[Vader]

The only problem with that is his fellow terrorist would be holding hostage after hostage trying to get him freed and some rat liberal journalist would be doing a interview several years from now.


I say coat him in bacon grease and fry him on the electric chair,then cremate him and mix his ashes with some pig **** and sell it on ebay.

Sick....yet so funny. :rofl

 

[Monkey Mind]

He should be killed on the battlefield. Regardless of whether or not he surrenders... put an end to him, just like Zarqawi. If by some stroke of bad luck he ends up alive in custody, then a quick trial followed by life in solitary confinement with no outside contact whatsoever.

 

[talloulou]

He should be killed on the battlefield. Regardless of whether or not he surrenders... put an end to him, just like Zarqawi. If by some stroke of bad luck he ends up alive in custody, then a quick trial followed by life in solitary confinement with no outside contact whatsoever.

:shock: hmm I would have thought that went against the anti-death penalty stand we have at my house! I guess "killed on the battlefield" sort of avoids the whole "Death Penalty" question? :mrgreen: Anotherwards even if they can capture him alive you favor blowing him to smithereens? I would think he might be a source of good intelligence. Plus while "just like Zarqawi" sounds good I'd personally like to request we blow him up when no 5 year olds are standing around. I think I heard once that he has fathered around 17 children!

 

[jamesrage]

He should be killed on the battlefield. Regardless of whether or not he surrenders... put an end to him, just like Zarqawi. If by some stroke of bad luck he ends up alive in custody, then a quick trial followed by life in solitary confinement with no outside contact whatsoever.

If Osama was killed in the battle field the liberal rats in the media will make accusations that some soldier murdered him in cold blood.

 

[Monkey Mind]

:shock: hmm I would have thought that went against the anti-death penalty stand we have at my house! I guess "killed on the battlefield" sort of avoids the whole "Death Penalty" question? :mrgreen: Anotherwards even if they can capture him alive you favor blowing him to smithereens? I would think he might be a source of good intelligence. Plus while "just like Zarqawi" sounds good I'd personally like to request we blow him up when no 5 year olds are standing around. I think I heard once that he has fathered around 17 children!

I am also against the death penalty in principle. I don't think it serves society to have long tortuous trials and appeals processes followed by an execution carried out by government employees. No matter how justified such executions may be, the killing still stains the souls of those tasked to carry it out. Another problem is that the criminal justice system is never perfect, and in many cases outright unfair. It is unacceptable to risk executing an innocent person.

Those are the reasons I generally don't support the death penalty. That said - I'm not one to cling to absolutes, and am willing to make exceptions for the Bin Ladens & Zarqawis of the world. Death on the battlefield is more honor than they deserve, but it is the most efficient way to get rid of them. Of course I would hope there are no children around like when Zarqawi got bombed, but these people are cowards and hide behind innocent civilians. In the end, those tragic deaths are the fault of the terrorists.

 

[talloulou]

I am also against the death penalty in principle. I don't think it serves society to have long tortuous trials and appeals processes followed by an execution carried out by government employees. No matter how justified such executions may be, the killing still stains the souls of those tasked to carry it out. Another problem is that the criminal justice system is never perfect, and in many cases outright unfair. It is unacceptable to risk executing an innocent person.

Those are the reasons I generally don't support the death penalty. That said - I'm not one to cling to absolutes, and am willing to make exceptions for the Bin Ladens & Zarqawis of the world. Death on the battlefield is more honor than they deserve, but it is the most efficient way to get rid of them. Of course I would hope there are no children around like when Zarqawi got bombed, but these people are cowards and hide behind innocent civilians. In the end, those tragic deaths are the fault of the terrorists.

:roll: Whatever I guess you still get dinner. :rofl