Why Exactly Can't Iran Have a Nuke?

[Craig234]

They do need nukes for their deterrent value.

The best answer is no one to have a nuke. The next best is regions to not have nukes. That means the rogue state not having them. The next best is for peaceful nations, like Iran, to have nukes for deterrence, but proliferation is dangerous. Worse than that is for warlike nations to have nukes and their victims not to have deterrence. That's what we have.

 

[MikePrime]

Post #46


Gaza is not "complicated". It doesn't belong to Israel. That's the long and the short of it.

This is what progressives do, they take the nuance out of things.

1) If you want to be technical, is it Israel. it has been under their military occupation for the greater part of the past 80 years and it wasn't ever in the history of man "Palestine", It was designated that as a regional name under different colonial powers.
2) If was agreed several times to be designated as the state of Palestine but was rejected every time.

Tell me these aren't true statements?

Not only has Israel appropriated the Strip over the decades, it has also imposed a crippling embargo on the territory - and that was BEFORE Oct 7th.

Like I said Israel has often been brutal, but this didn't just happen for no reason.

In 2005 Gaza was demilitarized, ( a positive development for their autonomy) and they decided to break from Palestine and embrace Hamas (an group that advocated for the destruction of Israel)

That you seem to believe Israel occupies some kind of moral high ground here re nukes is inexplicable. We're seeing what Israel does when it has the upper hand in the sense of conventional military ability.

I dont think anyone should have nukes.
They are on moral high ground, they have a more moral society by every definition of how the west perceives human rights.
Try to tell me that Iran has a for free society and more well constructed form of government than Israel? do it.

 

[MikePrime]

I will be happy if/when the/?your murderously retarded Republicrat-level assholes learn 'Peace, commerce and honest friendship with ALL nations, entangling alliances with NONE.'

pivoting is a fallacy that demonstrates that someone is wrong.

 

[Pyrite]

This is what progressives do, they take the nuance out of things.

1) If you want to be technical, is it Israel. it has under their military occupation for greater part of the past 80 years and it wasn't ever in the history of man "Palestine", It was designated that as a regional name under different colonial powers.
2) If was agreed several times to be designated as the state of Palestine but was rejected every time.

Tell me these aren't true statements?

Like I said Israel has often been brutal, but this didn't just happen for no reason.

In 2005 Gaza was demilitarized, ( a positive development for their autonomy) and they decided to break from Palestine and embrace Hamas (an group that advocated for the destruction of Israel)

I dont think anyone should have nukes.
They are on moral high ground, they have a more moral society by every definition of how the west perceives human rights.
Try to tell me that Iran has a for free society and more well constructed form of government than Israel? do it.

Post #52



Gaza is not Israel's territory.

BUT, if you want to concede that Israel is a nation that has forcibly taken over and held on to territory that doesn't belong to it (to Israel), I'll go with that.

You're also conceding that Israel "has often been brutal" to other people.

Your own description makes the case that Israel is an aggressor state that uses its military superiority to impose its will on others.

 

[Integrityrespec]

They have expressed the desire to annihilate the Jews and remove Israel from the ME. They have called for the annihilation of the U.S, Death to America is their cry.

 

[reflechissez]

Post #42


Prove this - that I "don't believe Israel has a right to exist as a nation" re my posts to this thread.

Every time I see someone quote this phrase as if it has power, I wonder why it's given so much power. I don't give a **** what you say. I'm black. Feel free to say "I don't believe black people have the right to be free." I will start giving a **** about that when you start rounding up free black people.

 

[Integrityrespec]

NY is heading for a remake of "Escape from New York".

 

[H. E. Panqui]

pivoting is a fallacy that demonstrates that someone is wrong.

Something is surely wrong with a $ystem that foist$ the/?your miserable Republicrat-level shit puppet$ into the highest government offices in the land... ugh..

 

[MikePrime]

Post #52



Gaza is not Israel's territory.

It literally is, like even right now as we speak.

BUT, if you want to concede that Israel is a nation that has forcibly taken over and held on to territory that doesn't belong to it (to Israel), I'll go with that.

So now you are even admitting that they don't belong their. What did i say earlier?

Lets clarify if you can.
Does Israel have the right to have a state in the levant?

You're also conceding that Israel "has often been brutal" to other people.

Its called nuance.

Your own description makes the case that Israel is an aggressor state that uses its military superiority to impose its will on others.

Actually i typed alot of things that you chose to ignore and your own take was that. bad response.

 

[Pyrite]

They have expressed the desire to annihilate the Jews and remove Israel from the ME. They have called for the annihilation of the U.S, Death to America is their cry.

Some Israelis have chanted, "Kill the Arabs!"

Rhetoric is cheap. Actions, on the other hand, can and sometimes do provide a picture into what a nation's leaders/people will do, will tolerate.

 

[MikePrime]

Something is surely wrong with a $ystem that foist$ the/?your miserable Republicrat-level shit puppet$ into the highest government offices in the land... ugh..

pivoting is a fallacy that demonstrates someone is wrong

 

[Pyrite]

It literally is like even right now as we speak.

So now you are even admitting that they don't belong their. What did i say earlier?

Lets clarify if you can.
Does Israel have the right to have a state in the levant?

Its called nuance.

Actually i typed alot of things that you chose to ignore and your own take was that. bad response.

Post #59


Israel has the legal right to exist in the borders approved by the United Nations.

I want Israel to survive and to thrive - but not at the expense of remaining an aggressor state that not only steals others' territory, but is also a state that treats "others" as subhumans. That commits war crimes in its treatment of "others".

 

[H. E. Panqui]

Some Israelis have chanted, "Kill the Arabs!"

Rhetoric is cheap. Actions, on the other hand, can and sometimes do provide a picture into what a nation's leaders/people will do, will tolerate.

Ime, these hyper-murderous followers of Moses have taken at least 100 eyes for one historically..

 

[MikePrime]

Israel has the legal right to exist in the borders approved by the United Nations.

I want Israel to survive and to thrive - but not at the expense of remaining an aggressor state that not only steals others' territory, but is also a state that treats "others" as subhumans.

And what happened when they tried to retain those lands upon the United Nations approving them?

 

[Pyrite]

And what happened when they tried to retain those lands upon the United Nations approving them?

Post #64


Last century? Nothing that happened then excuses the horrific treatment the Government of Israel has been and is meting out to trapped and helpless civilians in the Gaza Strip.

If you think it does, there's nothing I can say to persuade you otherwise.

 

[CLAX1911]

Again because we say no.

 

[MikePrime]

Last century? Nothing that happened then excuses the horrific treatment the Government of Israel is now meting out to trapped and helpless civilians in the Gaza Strip.

My point is to demonstrate why their borders are past the United Nations approved borders. But you cant answer that question so youre bringing up the present.

 

[Pyrite]

My point is to demonstrate why their borders are past the United Nations approved borders. But you cant answer that question so youre bring up the present.

Post #67


I'm discussing the Israeli state of the here and now.

That you want to deflect from the fact that the Gaza Strip does not belong to Israel and also from the fact that the Government of Israel has been oppressing and maltreating trapped and helpless civilians in the Strip is obvious.

That you acknowledge but also refuse to hold accountable the Netanyahu Government's horrific treatment of 2.2 PALESTINIAN civilians is on you.

 

[Tigerace117]

Because we say no.

And Iran says tough shit.

America should get over it instead of throwing endless tantrums.

 

[Tigerace117]

Why can't Iran have a nuke?

"Death to Israel! Death to America!"

Nuff said.

So slogans.

Who cares?

America has gleefully helped carry out multiple genocides since 1945, yet it is allowed to have nukes.

 

[Pyrite]

Post #67


I'm discussing the Israeli state of the here and now.

That you want to deflect from the fact that the Gaza Strip does not belong to Israel and also from the fact that the Government of Israel has been oppressing and maltreating trapped and helpless civilians in the Strip is obvious.

That you acknowledge but also refuse to hold accountable the Netanyahu Government's horrific treatment of 2.2 PALESTINIAN civilians is on you.

The larger point, which I've already made:

That the Government of Israel is willing to use its superiority re conventional military weapons as a cudgel to hold on to territory it has no right to AND to mistreat the civilians caught in that territory is a window, perhaps, in how future Governments of Israel might wield its nukes.

Another larger point: that the US accepts Israel's continuing mistreatment of captive civilians is bad. That the US recently acted like a hired gun on behalf of the Israeli Government is bad.

That anyone believes Israel somehow has moral superiority over Iran re possession of nukes is....astonishing, given Israel's predatory actions against Palestinians in Gaza.

 

[multivita-man]

The first unveiling of an Iranian ICBM had a "Death to Israel" banner on it.

They don't get to have nukes, ever.

Beyond that, it wouldn't be long before Gulf countries would want nukes of their own, and we don't need that. Yes, we're hypocrites. No, we're not giving them up. I do agree, however, we could significantly reduce global stockpiles, but it's not politically feasible as long as we are rivals with Russia and China.

 

[MikePrime]

Post #67


I'm discussing the Israeli state of the here and now.

That you want to deflect from the fact that the Gaza Strip does not belong to Israel and also from the fact that the Government of Israel has been oppressing and maltreating trapped and helpless civilians in the Strip is obvious.

That you acknowledge but also refuse to hold accountable the Netanyahu Government's horrific treatment of 2.2 PALESTINIAN civilians is on you.

Im literally just going through your own claims but you're spiraling because your ideas are falling apart.

Ill try again.

Your were taking about Israel taking land past their borders and said that you agree to the 40s UN borders.

Im asking why did they occupy land past these borders.

Was perhaps a multi country war launched on them???

 

[CLAX1911]

And Iran says tough shit.

Our bunker busters say otherwise.

America should get over it instead of throwing endless tantrums.

 

[Tigerace117]

Our bunker busters say otherwise.

Given they apparently failed to bust any bunkers, no, they don’t.