Why Exactly Can't Iran Have a Nuke?

[Tigerace117]

This topic - reasons why Iran should not be permitted to acquire nuclear weapons - certainly does evoke strong reactions.

The US spent decades going “hurr durr our embassies are full of elite spies” and somehow got offended the one time somebody decided to occupy the freaking embassy,

 

[Tettsuo]

This topic - reasons why Iran should not be permitted to acquire nuclear weapons - certainly does evoke strong reactions.

Very true.

I find it very interesting the inability for people to think beyond the propaganda they're fed. They say that they don't want the US to be the world's police, but they want to US to dictate the actions of other sovereign nations. If they don't comply, MURDER! And still feel they're not the baddies. Amazing.

 

[Diving Mullah]

For most of my adult life, Israel has been working their asses off to drag the US into a war with Iran. On numerous occasions, Israel, with American weapons, has attacked and killed Iranians under the guise of self-preservation. Even after these unprovoked attacks, Iran has maintained a cool head and has taken every possible step to avoid war.

Now, in 2025, we have multiple attacks from the US and Israel against Iran, murdering civilians with the claim that Iran must never get their hands on a nuke. Why not? They haven't shown themselves to be warmongering in any way whatsoever. In fact, it's been the US and Israel who have shown themselves to be unworthy of having nukes, all the while telling us to fear the country that's been the victim of their aggression.

It seems like the only way the Middle East will be at peace is if they DO have a nuke. At least that'll discourage the West's attacks on their people.

Because if they have nukes then we can't bomb them!
same as North Korea and Pakistan!

And we love to bomb people! Especially Muslim and brown color folks! So that is no good!

And also that means we actually then have to deal with internal problems, which we are fresh out of ideas! Bombing others keeps us distracted and scared!

That is why!

Diving Mullah

 

[braindrain]

Post #4


If rhetoric is the determinant:

A Palestinian Doctor in Israel Helps People on Both Sides

Lina Qasem Hassan treated victims of October 7th. She also publicly condemned the war in Gaza—a stance that imperilled her job.

www.newyorker.com

...To earn money, she worked at a restaurant in a mall where fans of the soccer team Beitar Jerusalem, who are notorious for their anti-Arab racism, sometimes celebrated after games. Qasem Hassan would hear them chant “Mavet la’aravim!”—“Death to Arabs!”...

Pretending like you think an anecdotal story that may or may not have happened about some individuals is the same thing as an official statement by a countries government shows the just how dishonest you are willing to be to peddle your propaganda.

 

[braindrain]

Talk is one thing, actions are another.

Israel has BEGGED for Iranian blood for decades, wielding American weapons. Yeah, they have a good reason to hate America and Israel. AND STILL, they haven't attacked first.

They haven't shown themselves to be the problem.

Yeah they haven’t attacked first as long as you don’t count the countless numbers of attacks Iran has had their proxies carry out.

I am not surprised you have no problem with people funding terrorist who murder Jews.

 

[Cameron]

Post #117


So, you cannot copy and paste particular sentences in the OP that support your belief that some "progressive lunatics" "hate Israel".

The troll-like OP minimizing Iran's support of terrorism, consistent threats to Israel, and its suggestion that the Middle East would be better of with a nuclear Iran, supports my believe that some progressive lunatics hate Israel. It indicates that OP doesn't give AF about anyone in the country.

This type of cross-examination certainly is not persuading me that you, and the OP, don't. Why don't you do or say anything that indicates that you don't in fact hate Israel? Because the posting history speaks for itself.

 

[Bodi]

How interesting that you've not actually addressed the point of the thread.

I almost always do... until the one I talking to decides to avoid the point of the thread.

In any case, Iran providing aid to HAMAs is bad, but they don't direct what HAMAs does.

This alone shows such a level of ignorance, or dishonesty, that any functional debate is no longer viable.

The US used Iraq, an entire country, to attack Iran. In fact, the US and Israel have done horrible acts of terrorism against Iran, directly.

There's no comparison.

Finally, would any of this have occurred if Iran had nukes?

Got it. You blame Jews for getting attacked by terrorists...

Was it also the Jews fault that the Nazi's killed Jews in the Holocaust?

Just save myself some time and recognize it early.

 

[braindrain]

Israel can stop committing ethnic cleansing and maybe Iran will consider ceasing funding for Hezbollah and Hamas.

Seeing as Iran has been funding them for a very long time I think it is pretty obvious that the only thing Israel can do to have that funding stop is just go ahead and die.

But please key making excuses for terrorist scum bags.
It’s almost like there is zero filth you won’t take the side of as long as on the other side is the country run by Jews. Very strange.

 

[VanceMack]

What in that post was incorrect?

"They haven't shown themselves to be warmongering in any way whatsoever."

That is so sickeningly wrong.

 

[P_T]

TERRORISM HAS A FOOT UP THE ARSS AND GETS A HARD BITE HERE.
IRAN IS A MOTHER OF KILLING MACHINE; IS A NOT RELIGIOUS REGIME.

 

[Variant]

Is this really what we've come to? MAGA lunatics defending Russia's invasion of eastern europe because Zelensky refused to make up shit about the Bidens, and progressive lunatics defending Iran's acquisition of nuclear weapons because they hate Israel? This country is mentally ill.

When countries don't have nuclear weapons, other countries that do seem to feel free to bomb and invade them.

See: Ukraine and Iran.

 

[Pyrite]

TERRORISM HAS A FOOT UP THE ARSS AND GETS A HARD BITE HERE.
IRAN IS A MOTHER OF KILLING MACHINE; IS A NOT RELIGIOUS REGIME.

Post #136

So what if someone doesn't consider the leadership in Iran to be a "religious regime"?

Are you of the opinion that Israel and the USA should decide whether or not Iran acquires nuclear weapons? If so, are you willing for the USA to continue to support Israel in that country's current war against Iran?

 

[Integrityrespec]

Post #52



Gaza is not Israel's territory.

BUT, if you want to concede that Israel is a nation that has forcibly taken over and held on to territory that doesn't belong to it (to Israel), I'll go with that.

You're also conceding that Israel "has often been brutal" to other people.

Your own description makes the case that Israel is an aggressor state that uses its military superiority to impose its will on others.

Hamas, which governs Gaza, attacked Israel. Israel defended itself.

 

[Pyrite]

Hamas, which governs Gaza, attacked Israel. Israel defended itself.

Post #138


No, that's not what the Israeli Government has done during the last year and a half.

In return for almost 1,500 casualties (most them dead) in Israel, the Netanyahu Government has killed more than 57,000 Palestinians in Gaza.

This isn't "defense". It's slaughter of trapped and helpless civilians.

`````````````````````````

Now, back to the topic of this thread: If you believe it's imperative to prevent Iran from acquiring nuclear weapons, tell us why you hold this view. Be specific.

 

[cAPSLOCK]

So slogans.

Who cares?

America has gleefully helped carry out multiple genocides since 1945, yet it is allowed to have nukes.

There is no logic in this. It's the argument of a child: "But Joey has one!"

Of course the US has them. They were invented in the US.

And once a nation has them the game theory changes. And your line of "reasoning" necessarily goes out the window. If we could travel back in time and keep NKorea from getting them we would.

 

[uptower]

The “logic” is apparently they’ll preemptively use it, causing their own inevitable destruction, because they’re religious zealots.

Which nobody has done, ever.

We hear this from the Christian fundamentalists who believe the Jews should own all of Israel so the end of the world will come sooner.

Thanks guys.

The real danger is, like any country getting nukes, it will cause all the neighbors to want them as well and proliferation is not preferable. First, more nukes means greater potential for misuse or accidents, second the club wants to keep its membership exclusive if it can.


Will a nuclear armed Iran be reckless with the bomb? Probably not, the risks are too great. Like North Korea it would serve as a deterrent. But it could also trigger a regional arms race including Turkiye and Saudi Arabia; Israel would almost certainly get more; maybe the UAE and Egypt would want some too?

Slogans? Meh. Those are not policy

 

[anatta]

the Mahdi will unite Muslims and non-Muslims under Islam, bringing about a golden age of righteousness and filling the Earth with justice and equity.

• According to Shi'a traditions, certain signs, both general and specific, will herald the reappearance of the Mahdi.
• A major general sign is the widespread prevalence of evil, injustice, and moral decay on Earth.
• Specific signs include the rise of figures like Sufyani, the divine cry calling people to the Mahdi, and supernatural events.

 

[anatta]

Lol no. No chance.

Just as with Iraq, if Iran had nukes, the West wouldn’t have dared attack.

add Libya to that mix. Bolton scared off li'l Kim when he brought up the "Libyan example".
Qadaffi got ripped to shreds as a reward for de-nuclearizing

 

[Tigerace117]

There is no logic in this. It's the argument of a child: "But Joey has one!"

Of course the US has them. They were invented in the US.

And once a nation has them the game theory changes. And your line of "reasoning" necessarily goes out the window. If we could travel back in time and keep NKorea from getting them we would.

Complaining about Iran having a slogan when the US has actually engaged in significantly worse behavior is utterly laughable.

 

[cAPSLOCK]

Complaining about Iran having a slogan when the US has actually engaged in significantly worse behavior is utterly laughable.

So you think Iran is more righteous nation than the United States? What difference does any of this make to the point of this thread?

Therefore, Iran should be allowed to have a Nuke?

Or the United States has no right or stand on which to decide who should or shouldn't have one?

I think that last sentence is the most compelling one, the one that seems to make the most sense, but it's utter foolishness because of the stakes.

Whether you view the United States' use of nuclear weapons as horrible or a victory or whatever else, it doesn't matter anymore. What matters now is that cat is out of the bag and It is in the best interest of the United States and the world, frankly, to make sure that Iran doesn't have a nuke.

It's that simple.

 

[Simon W. Moon]

For most of my adult life, Israel has been working their asses off to drag the US into a war with Iran. On numerous occasions, Israel, with American weapons, has attacked and killed Iranians under the guise of self-preservation. Even after these unprovoked attacks, Iran has maintained a cool head and has taken every possible step to avoid war.

Now, in 2025, we have multiple attacks from the US and Israel against Iran, murdering civilians with the claim that Iran must never get their hands on a nuke. Why not? They haven't shown themselves to be warmongering in any way whatsoever. In fact, it's been the US and Israel who have shown themselves to be unworthy of having nukes, all the while telling us to fear the country that's been the victim of their aggression.

It seems like the only way the Middle East will be at peace is if they DO have a nuke. At least that'll discourage the West's attacks on their people.

1st of all NO ONE should have nukes.
they are an awful risk and humans are error prone.
but here we are.


the only answer to why not Iran in particular is some variation on, "Blah, blah, UNDETERRABLE, blah, blah"

 

[Tettsuo]

add Libya to that mix. Bolton scared off li'l Kim when he brought up the "Libyan example".
Qadaffi got ripped to shreds as a reward for de-nuclearizing

Exactly. Getting rid of its WMDs didn't bring peace to Libya. Instead, it's now considered a rogue state with open-air slave markets. No one brought them "democracy". The West killed Qadaffi and left the country in shambles. This was not the case when Libya had its weapons.

The problem isn't Iran. Sure, their governing body sux, but at least they're not bombing Israel and assassinating their citizens. The problem is Israel's want for power and control, and the US's willingness to empower them. And, lest not forget that Israel empowered HAMAs as well.

Israeli support for Hamas

During the 1970s, Israel began providing support to Ahmed Yassin, a Muslim Brotherhood leader in the Gaza Strip, who controlled a network of Islamic schools, mosques, and clubs, in order to weaken the secular nationalist Palestine Liberation Organization. It continued to encourage the expansion of Yassin's network during the first year and a half of the First Intifada, as the network re-organised into Hamas. Support lasted until 1989, when Hamas launched its first attacks on Israelis, leading to a significant crackdown against the organisation.[7] Multiple Israeli officials have acknowledged Israel's role in strengthening Yassin's network.

In the late 2010s and early 2020s, Israeli officials encouraged Qatar to give aid to Hamas,[8] and approved the transfer of money from Qatar to the organization.[9] Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has said that the aid transfers were allowed for humanitarian reasons;[10] Israeli intelligence officials believe that the Qatari money contributed to the success of the October 7 attacks.

So the argument about proxies is pure trash.

 

[Tettsuo]

So you think Iran is more righteous nation than the United States? What difference does any of this make to the point of this thread?

Who's attacking and murdering whom?

Therefore, Iran should be allowed to have a Nuke?

Allowed? No. Discouraged, yes. Murdering citizens, assassinating scientists, threatening regime change, and starting a war for Iran trying to get nukes, HELL NO.

Or the United States has no right or stand on which to decide who should or shouldn't have one?

Nope. Make it untenable to have a nuke by using all possible means outside of war. Which we had and Trump decided to screw it up.

I think that last sentence is the most compelling one, the one that seems to make the most sense, but it's utter foolishness because of the stakes.

Whether you view the United States' use of nuclear weapons as horrible or a victory or whatever else, it doesn't matter anymore. What matters now is that cat is out of the bag and It is in the best interest of the United States and the world, frankly, to make sure that Iran doesn't have a nuke.

It's that simple.

Why? Iran has NEVER shown itself to be suicidal. Using a nuke would be just that for them, and they know it. Even when provoked, they've held themselves from acting in such a manner to invite greater conflict. It has been Israel and the US who've been acting like warmongers and doing so for decades.

 

[Tettsuo]

1st of all NO ONE should have nukes.

I agree, but that's not our reality.

they are an awful risk and humans are error prone.
but here we are.

the only answer to why not Iran in particular is some variation on, "Blah, blah, UNDETERRABLE, blah, blah"

We are on the verge of war because Iran doesn't have nukes. Even when they're NOT trying to get them, Israel and the US have spent decades murdering their people.

 

[Simon W. Moon]

I agree, but that's not our reality.

We are on the verge of war because Iran doesn't have nukes. Even when they're NOT trying to get them, Israel and the US have spent decades murdering their people.

You asked. I gave the answer there is.

I never said it was a good answer.

I do not believe that Iran is undeterrable.
History does not support the notion.

but the PRO-WAR party only knows the one tune — "The THEY are coming to kill you!"​

​

Because we outclass Iran militarily,​

the PRO-WAR party must tell us that the THEY will attack us anyway.​

​

therefore​

​

The THEY are undeterrable and will come to kill us no matter how powerful we are.​

​

therefore​

​

The WE MUST go kill the THEY​