Why are socialism and Communism hated?

[presluc]

First, there must be someone controlling wealth in this world, regardless. If you feel intolerable, find a society in which no one controls wealth. If you feel you are not the one controlling, too bad, and sorry. If this gives you reason to set up socialism, unless you are in the family like Kim in North Korea, you are even further barred from wealth controlling.

Second, you are extremely intolerable to bailouts, then, make sure you can get rid of all those bailout system of food coupons, the system of bastard raising guarantee, the possible Obamacare... including the affirmative action which is heavily oriented by racial discrimination and capability discrimination but in reversed direction. In one of your argument, you emphasized "RESPONSIBILITY". Embolden this sense to your mentality.

Third, show me one example in human history that socialism brought prosperity to the society. Everyone knows that Socialism's task is to destroy rich. This answers your "Destroying the rich?" If you do not kow this nature of Socialism, you need to read more before you argue.

I don't argue I debate .

First of all in a democracy the word equality has been used on more than one occasion.
Would you say all Americans have the equal oppurtunity of the rich in America today?
With College grads facing a 40% unemployment plus a huge student loan ,don't thing so

Second of all these rich CEOS are always bitching about food stamps and bastard raising and resposibility .
The American labor organization has ask for more jobs, the American people has ask for more jobs .
The rich outsource more everyday they create 600,000 jobs , we have 800,000 illegals plus the American unemployment witch is above 2 million, and they ask how come everybody doesn't have a job?
Come on we know the party that votes for pro live over abortion., we all know what party supports the rich the most
Americans are not that stupid

China is a socialist country America owes China 93 million plus interest.

It is not the American people nor I that wish any harm to come to the rich of America.

It is the rich that are destroying the fabric of the American workers of America.

American corporations hired Americans and made a profit before to say they can not again would be a flat out lie.eace

 

[presluc]

Have to wonder what? That workers have absolutely no rights there and get paid pennies on the dollars they produce and that money is sucked up by the government? That they artifically deflate their own currency <-- stealing more pennies from the meager pennies they got paid to begin with, to increase exports /decrease imports.

America ... 15 trillion in debt, owes the Chinese 93 million+

More outsourcing is going on each day .

Less people working, less paychecks . less paychecks , less tax revenue.

Less tax revenue , time for America to print more money that deflates a system held together with tax cuts bailouts and promices of more jobs.and lower taxes.eace

 

[crebigsol]

I don't argue I debate .

You do neither argue nor debate, you are whining. You just keep complaining with circular argument.

As to the China situation, you have put up one million times and someone else and me have explained one million times, but you just don’t’ want to let go but keep saying that China is a socialist country but we, as a capitalist country, borrow money from them. I’ll say once more, and whether you want to dwell in your obsession or not, I let go and will do it no more:

China as a socialist country would have been economically dead but then it found capitalist program can save it beginning 1978. Now, she holds money not because it is a socialist country but as a country in which capitalist operation is allowed to function to some extent. However, holding absolute power by one party is the typical political characters of a socialist country. Chinese Communist Party will not allow this to be challenged. So long as power is in this party’s hand, it can kill any or the entire capitalist program anytime as needed. One political storm happened in Feb this year fully proves this. But this is too involved and I am not go into it. If you show so much interest about China’s affair, I assume you must have known it.

That America as a capitalist country has to borrow money from China is not because it is a capitalist country but because a big sector of its capitalist operation has been eroded and stifled by various socialist programs, and the situation is even getting worse every day. In some way you can even say that China and America is gradually reversing the political playing court. Check history: Why the borrowing did not happen before 1978 but after 1978?

Typical socialist political character is: absolute monopolization on political power, in which, of course, capital monopolization is only a tiny item in the list of monopolization of the political party that has grabbed the power. China realizes that absolute monopolization can only lead to economical death, and that is why it is willing to release the grab to some extent.

Typical capitalist political character is: competition, survival the fittest in contribution. Yes, in the competition, certain monopolization may sooner or later appear, but the capitalist government is willing to enact this kind or that kind of law to limit the appearance of the monopolization. Unfortunately, all these anti-trust laws so far are limited to and focus on capital monopolization but not even slightly touch the monopolization of labor force. Experience has told us that monopolization of labor force is the greenhouse of socialism, which must be directed by this principle: lowest cost (minimum work) for maximum benefit (pay). This principle can only kill wealth accumulation in a society. This is how America is overwhelmingly facing today.

 

[presluc]

You do neither argue nor debate, you are whining. You just keep complaining with circular argument.

As to the China situation, you have put up one million times and someone else and me have explained one million times, but you just don’t’ want to let go but keep saying that China is a socialist country but we, as a capitalist country, borrow money from them. I’ll say once more, and whether you want to dwell in your obsession or not, I let go and will do it no more:

China as a socialist country would have been economically dead but then it found capitalist program can save it beginning 1978. Now, she holds money not because it is a socialist country but as a country in which capitalist operation is allowed to function to some extent. However, holding absolute power by one party is the typical political characters of a socialist country. Chinese Communist Party will not allow this to be challenged. So long as power is in this party’s hand, it can kill any or the entire capitalist program anytime as needed. One political storm happened in Feb this year fully proves this. But this is too involved and I am not go into it. If you show so much interest about China’s affair, I assume you must have known it.

That America as a capitalist country has to borrow money from China is not because it is a capitalist country but because a big sector of its capitalist operation has been eroded and stifled by various socialist programs, and the situation is even getting worse every day. In some way you can even say that China and America is gradually reversing the political playing court. Check history: Why the borrowing did not happen before 1978 but after 1978?

Typical socialist political character is: absolute monopolization on political power, in which, of course, capital monopolization is only a tiny item in the list of monopolization of the political party that has grabbed the power. China realizes that absolute monopolization can only lead to economical death, and that is why it is willing to release the grab to some extent.

Typical capitalist political character is: competition, survival the fittest in contribution. Yes, in the competition, certain monopolization may sooner or later appear, but the capitalist government is willing to enact this kind or that kind of law to limit the appearance of the monopolization. Unfortunately, all these anti-trust laws so far are limited to and focus on capital monopolization but not even slightly touch the monopolization of labor force. Experience has told us that monopolization of labor force is the greenhouse of socialism, which must be directed by this principle: lowest cost (minimum work) for maximum benefit (pay). This principle can only kill wealth accumulation in a society. This is how America is overwhelmingly facing today.

You go to China tell them they are not a socialist country have them say on any news channel that China is no longer a socialist country,.
Then I will believe that China is not a socialist country .
However a couple of posters on a political forum making that statement just isn't enough confirmation for me.

As far as your "competition" in the Capitalist global market the fact that America has more imports than exports should tell you something.The fact that America is 15 trillion dollars in debt should tell you something.
Bottom line if this is a "competition" America is loosing .eace

 

[Slartibartfast]

You go to China tell them they are not a socialist country have them say on any news channel that China is no longer a socialist country,.
Then I will believe that China is not a socialist country .
However a couple of posters on a political forum making that statement just isn't enough confirmation for me.

As far as your "competition" in the Capitalist global market the fact that America has more imports than exports should tell you something.The fact that America is 15 trillion dollars in debt should tell you something.
Bottom line if this is a "competition" America is loosing .eace

Its sad. People living well enough to not live in their own filth due to being able to afford things like modern plumbing means we are too affluent to compete globally, its such a depressing thought with the idea that america is going to have to be gutted of its greatness and fall down to the terrible standards of the rest of the world.

 

[presluc]

Its sad. People living well enough to not live in their own filth due to being able to afford things like modern plumbing means we are too affluent to compete globally, its such a depressing thought with the idea that america is going to have to be gutted of its greatness and fall down to the terrible standards of the rest of the world.

Not to burst your bubble there but if you look in Forbes Magazine you will find that the #2 wealthist business in America is Walmart.
Walmart sells about 75% of imports from China
The #1 that would be Exxon who gets their product from the mideast.
Well there goes 1 and 2.
If I was in a competition I would compete for first place or second place at least.

I shouldn't have to bring up the imports xxxx vs exports x?eace

 

[crebigsol]

You go to China tell them they are not a socialist country have them say on any news channel that China is no longer a socialist country,.
Then I will believe that China is not a socialist country .

So, do you agree with me or disagree with me that China is a socialist country? It seems you agree. My take for China being a socialist country is that it keeps the essential political characteristic: Absolute power monopolization by some oligarchy. However, grabbing this monopolization, that country allows limited capitalist operation since 1978 and therefore enables the rapid wealth accumulation of the society. In doing so, China has lost some degree of genuineness of socialism but also has proven the invigoration of capitalism to a society. Without capitalism, China would have die economically. Contrasting to China’s introducing capitalist operation in her country, America is forced to allow more and more socialist operation infested in the society, losing more and more the genuineness of capitalism. America is dying, and dying too quickly!
In short, expanding capitalism has allowed China to become a creditor; at the same time when this happens, flooding socialism has more and more deadly sunk America into a debtor. If you do not want to look at the reason and face the reason but whine at a socialist country havng become your creditor, you can only see your debt growing ever bigger. Stupidity in politics deserves only punishment.

As far as your "competition" in the Capitalist global market the fact that America has more imports than exports should tell you something.The fact that America is 15 trillion dollars in debt should tell you something.

It does tell me something: People like you don’t want to deal with the real reason but keep complaining that somebody else has controlled their wealth. Well, if you think the cooperates having been too greed by declining paying the workers more and it is why America’s economy goes to hell, you must think that escalating the worker’s pay by triple fold or quadruple fold overnight will cure the problem and after that America’s competition capability can also be vigorously elevated overnight following the pay increment. Please just give me some math to justify that reasoning.

Bottom line if this is a "competition" America is loosing

Yes, you are right: America is losing, but not because she competes, but exactly because she is more and more unable to compete. It is not those big cooperates that don’t want to compete, it is that the law and the laborers together make them more and more unable to hire people who what to compete but to wait for government check.

 

[YoungConserv]

Well we're one step closer to socialism now comrades

 

[crebigsol]

Yes, neighbor! The only two choices left in America now:

1. A coffin with honey coated on the inner surface of its cover. The more a person licks away the honey, the more this person needs to have the cover move closer to tightly shut over him.
2. The Bible that teaches people to honor their parents, and not to kill, not to commit adultery, not to covet, not to bear false witness.

Unfortunately, Americans are far more fanatical to lick the honey coated coffin lid other than reading the Bible that teaches self-discipline and requires self-restraining hardship.

Those who laid down the great pieces of Declaration of Independence, the Articles of Confederation, and The US Constitution must regret that they have done a poor job in educating their future generations. Their blood descendants can have only become prodigals and been marching on the way toward extinction with frozen smile tweaked by “high”.

 

[presluc]

So, do you agree with me or disagree with me that China is a socialist country? It seems you agree. My take for China being a socialist country is that it keeps the essential political characteristic: Absolute power monopolization by some oligarchy. However, grabbing this monopolization, that country allows limited capitalist operation since 1978 and therefore enables the rapid wealth accumulation of the society. In doing so, China has lost some degree of genuineness of socialism but also has proven the invigoration of capitalism to a society. Without capitalism, China would have die economically. Contrasting to China’s introducing capitalist operation in her country, America is forced to allow more and more socialist operation infested in the society, losing more and more the genuineness of capitalism. America is dying, and dying too quickly!
In short, expanding capitalism has allowed China to become a creditor; at the same time when this happens, flooding socialism has more and more deadly sunk America into a debtor. If you do not want to look at the reason and face the reason but whine at a socialist country havng become your creditor, you can only see your debt growing ever bigger. Stupidity in politics deserves only punishment.

It does tell me something: People like you don’t want to deal with the real reason but keep complaining that somebody else has controlled their wealth. Well, if you think the cooperates having been too greed by declining paying the workers more and it is why America’s economy goes to hell, you must think that escalating the worker’s pay by triple fold or quadruple fold overnight will cure the problem and after that America’s competition capability can also be vigorously elevated overnight following the pay increment. Please just give me some math to justify that reasoning.

Yes, you are right: America is losing, but not because she competes, but exactly because she is more and more unable to compete. It is not those big cooperates that don’t want to compete, it is that the law and the laborers together make them more and more unable to hire people who what to compete but to wait for government check.

First of all China is a socialist country.

People like me???
Ask any American about jobs? ask any American about education, ask any American about the budget of the United States, ask any American about the products made in America by Americans., ask any American about tax revenue that comes from paychecks.

Let me get this straight you are saying that the law and the laborers are stopping corporations from hiring Americans???

First of all there's the campaign contributions to get a politician elected therefore to change the law.
Second of all I never heard of anybody on unemployment filling out an application with the words "DON'T HIRE ME".
I'm sure the American laborers that have had their home foreclosed was happy to give it up just so corporations wouldn't hire them.
Come on, man you have to come with something better than that.eace

 

[crebigsol]

First of all China is a socialist country.

Good, you agree with me, but please answer me the following questions:
(1) Is China a socialist country in your perception because it has the essential socialist political characteristic of absolute power monopolization by a party or because it pursues capitalist operation?
(2) What has made China economically different before 1978 and after 1978 with so much contrasting magnitude?

Ask any American about jobs? ask any American about education, ask any American about the budget of the United States, ask any American about the products made in America by Americans., ask any American about tax revenue that comes from paychecks.

You just continue to whine without the courage to investigating the reason

Let me get this straight you are saying that the law and the laborers are stopping corporations from hiring Americans??? First of all there's the campaign contributions to get a politician elected therefore to change the law… Come on, man you have to come with something better than that

Who contribute? You mean unions of laborers have never contributed? You mean gay people, liberal people, socialist people, anti-Christian people, people favoring illegal immigrants, Obamacare…never contributed? All these contributors sure can combine with ballots far outnumbering what the big cooperates can come up with. “Come on, man you have to come with something better than that”.

 

[presluc]

Good, you agree with me, but please answer me the following questions:
(1) Is China a socialist country in your perception because it has the essential socialist political characteristic of absolute power monopolization by a party or because it pursues capitalist operation?
(2) What has made China economically different before 1978 and after 1978 with so much contrasting magnitude?

You just continue to whine without the courage to investigating the reason

Who contribute? You mean unions of laborers have never contributed? You mean gay people, liberal people, socialist people, anti-Christian people, people favoring illegal immigrants, Obamacare…never contributed? All these contributors sure can combine with ballots far outnumbering what the big cooperates can come up with. “Come on, man you have to come with something better than that”.

That's easy absolute power monopolization.


I need no reason to investigate the economy of my own country.

Unions? lol,lol 2unions are strong in America today longshoremen and teamsters the rest all have either sold out or caved in.

Obama care? you mean the insurance ad I thought we were talking about socialism?

Maybe you have missed my post , for I have said time and again socialism will not work in America cause America is a capitalist country, the more socialist America becomes the worst shape America will be.

That being said I ask a question what is socialism?
It is a state where the government takes care of people sort of one big family everybody works for the STATE or Government if you choose in return the government takes care of the people kinda?

In 2000 outsourcing was increased it has increased every year since.
The people that lost their jobs turned to the government for help, the government is responsible so they helped.

This has been going on for 12 years where was America in 1999 financial wise where are they now?
More jobs are outsourced more people who's unemployment extentions have run out go to the government for help.
Does this sound familiar it should cause it is border line socialism.

1 out of 7 people in America are on food stamps, the amount that lost their house after their job too high to count.
The credit card debt, wwe are talking 9 0's+ here, the IOU'S TRILLION THATS WITH A T NOT A M.
Meanwhile more outsourceing and more people going to the government for help.

You talk of the great distain for socialism, without jobs America will become a socialist countryeace

 

[crebigsol]

That's easy absolute power monopolization.

Why couldn’t you answer my other questions? Of course you can say you are not obliged to do so. But what you answer satisfies me already.
Concluded from all your whining, you obviously tell people that a country having no power monopolization is losing to a country that has power monopolization and that you wish so much that the table between the creditor and debtor can be changed. The only logical deduction from what is concluded for the table to change is that socialism is the only way for America to persue. Then, why do you contradict yourself by putting up the statement as shown in the following?

Maybe you have missed my post , for I have said time and again socialism will not work in America cause America is a capitalist country, the more socialist America becomes the worst shape America will be.

You keep whining on job availability. The job can be found either in a capitalist market or a socialist “market”. Make your pick.

I need no reason to investigate the economy of my own country.

I did not ask you to investigate the economy of the country, I ask you to investigate the reason what brought America’s economy to hell. Whining but refusing to investigate is a sign of a loser. If you are happy with what makes you whine, why whine at all?

Unions? lol,lol 2unions are strong in America today longshoremen and teamsters the rest all have either sold out or caved in.

Do you live in America at all? Do you know the political storm that the union agitated in Wisconsin few weeks ago? Do you know who caused the bankruptcy of Stockton, Calif lately? The true victims that must suffer from the bankruptcy are those corporations you hate so much: they cannot get back what they loan to the city. Now, you whine that those victimized corporations are not providing more jobs? How can they do that? Waive your magic wand: ready, get set, and go! But all I mention here is only the tip of an iceberg of damage done by laborer monopolization to the country.

Obama care? you mean the insurance ad I thought we were talking about socialism?

If you do not think it is socialist agenda, I must say you are not ready in this debate forum. Obamacare synchronizes so well with all what Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Che used as slogan to recruit followers: “The poor is suffering, ask the rich to pay the fair share”. Of course, the manner of paying fair share is somewhat different in each different country according to different situation. Pol Pot needed to wipe out one quarter of the population in three years for the fair share to be arrested, Obama needed to escalated the tax of the rich and increase the national debt to procure the fair share. Watch out, when he runs out money so procured, another fair share will be imposed, then another fair share, another fair share…until no more fair share can be found but all we are in hell.

That being said I ask a question what is socialism?
It is a state where the government takes care of people sort of one big family everybody works for the STATE or Government if you choose in return the government takes care of the people kinda?

Hahahaha….These heavens were once found in Soviet Union, Poland, East Germany, Albania, china before 1978, today’s N Korea, Cuba; but now look back, this is what you said: “I have said time and again socialism will not work in America cause America is a capitalist country, the more socialist America becomes the worst shape America will be.”
I must suspect that when you write a second paragraph, do you have a trace idea of what you talked about in the first paragraph?

In 2000 outsourcing was increased it has increased every year since.The people that lost their jobs turned to the government for help, the government is responsible so they helped.
This has been going on for 12 years where was America in 1999 financial wise where are they now?More jobs are outsourced more people who's unemployment extentions have run out go to the government for help.
Does this sound familiar it should cause it is border line socialism.
1 out of 7 people in America are on food stamps, the amount that lost their house after their job too high to count.
The credit card debt, wwe are talking 9 0's+ here, the IOU'S TRILLION THATS WITH A T NOT A M.
Meanwhile more outsourceing and more people going to the government for help.

These are all your repetitive whining, and I have put up too many explanation and I get sick of it.

You talk of the great distain for socialism, without jobs America will become a socialist country

The reason America will be more and more unable to provide job is the increase of population of people like you: fanatically waiting for Obamacare, waiting for government rescue with the part of “if you choose in return”(your word, remember) to be placed at a position of blank check. I have seen too many cases that people cash out benefit on a loan basis will most likely fail to return unless proper force is following. You have no need to tell me you are diffferent, at least you cannot guarantee others are different. On the other hand, those who form the government are not stupid people. They possess the same mentality but with power. So, the far higher possibility is that they force you to put up benifit first and return you a rescue promise with a blank check. Contribute all your dilligencey to give them the power, baby!

 

[MoSurveyor]

All these contributors sure can combine with ballots far outnumbering what the big cooperates can come up with. “Come on, man you have to come with something better than that”.

There are only 536 votes that really count in America - 545 if you count the courts. MegaCorp is in a much better position that any other entity on the planet to buy those votes, the votes that count.

 

[presluc]

Why couldn’t you answer my other questions? Of course you can say you are not obliged to do so. But what you answer satisfies me already.
Concluded from all your whining, you obviously tell people that a country having no power monopolization is losing to a country that has power monopolization and that you wish so much that the table between the creditor and debtor can be changed. The only logical deduction from what is concluded for the table to change is that socialism is the only way for America to persue. Then, why do you contradict yourself by putting up the statement as shown in the following?

You keep whining on job availability. The job can be found either in a capitalist market or a socialist “market”. Make your pick.

I did not ask you to investigate the economy of the country, I ask you to investigate the reason what brought America’s economy to hell. Whining but refusing to investigate is a sign of a loser. If you are happy with what makes you whine, why whine at all?

Do you live in America at all? Do you know the political storm that the union agitated in Wisconsin few weeks ago? Do you know who caused the bankruptcy of Stockton, Calif lately? The true victims that must suffer from the bankruptcy are those corporations you hate so much: they cannot get back what they loan to the city. Now, you whine that those victimized corporations are not providing more jobs? How can they do that? Waive your magic wand: ready, get set, and go! But all I mention here is only the tip of an iceberg of damage done by laborer monopolization to the country.

If you do not think it is socialist agenda, I must say you are not ready in this debate forum. Obamacare synchronizes so well with all what Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Che used as slogan to recruit followers: “The poor is suffering, ask the rich to pay the fair share”. Of course, the manner of paying fair share is somewhat different in each different country according to different situation. Pol Pot needed to wipe out one quarter of the population in three years for the fair share to be arrested, Obama needed to escalated the tax of the rich and increase the national debt to procure the fair share. Watch out, when he runs out money so procured, another fair share will be imposed, then another fair share, another fair share…until no more fair share can be found but all we are in hell.

Hahahaha….These heavens were once found in Soviet Union, Poland, East Germany, Albania, china before 1978, today’s N Korea, Cuba; but now look back, this is what you said: “I have said time and again socialism will not work in America cause America is a capitalist country, the more socialist America becomes the worst shape America will be.”
I must suspect that when you write a second paragraph, do you have a trace idea of what you talked about in the first paragraph?

These are all your repetitive whining, and I have put up too many explanation and I get sick of it.

The reason America will be more and more unable to provide job is the increase of population of people like you: fanatically waiting for Obamacare, waiting for government rescue with the part of “if you choose in return”(your word, remember) to be placed at a position of blank check. I have seen too many cases that people cash out benefit on a loan basis will most likely fail to return unless proper force is following. You have no need to tell me you are diffferent, at least you cannot guarantee others are different. On the other hand, those who form the government are not stupid people. They possess the same mentality but with power. So, the far higher possibility is that they force you to put up benifit first and return you a rescue promise with a blank check. Contribute all your dilligencey to give them the power, baby!

I stand by my statements.
Socialism will not work in America look at the jobs going out look at the economy/debt coming in.
In a Capitalist country a nation is driven by money , money comes from customers, customers with jobs.

Fact ; your statement A job can be found in a socialist market or a or a capitalist market take your pick, your words right?
Fact 80% of manufacturing unskilled labor is outsourced
Fact a majority of American workers are unskilled labor
So take your pick if you live in a third world country or a socialist country, that's where the jobs are being outsourced to are they not?

Obama care is not a socialist agenda it is a bad deal it is an insurance ad it is a scam to get more money for insurance companies.
There is an old saying you want to find a crook follow the money.
Who does Obamacare benefit?
The government ?don't think so
The taxpayer? don't think so
The insurance campanies ? yes.
Are insurance companies a socialist organization or a Capitalist organization?
Think hard now, remember the difference between capitalism and socialism.

People like me ? you mean average people that want no hand outs , that want no Obama care , that want no government assistence.
THE AMERICAN PEOPLE /WORKERS/CUSTOMERS ONLY WANT TO WORK FOR A DECENT WAGE PAY TAXES, PAY BILLS AND LIVE AN AVERAGE LIFE.

If you wish to talk more about the power monopolization fine.
I ask some questions
With money comes power true or false?
Where can the bulk of America's wealth be found ?eace

 

[crebigsol]

I stand by my statements.
Socialism will not work in America….

Thank you for telling me you stand by your nonsense whining so that I can stop wasting my time in this topic: nothing can clear you up.
To sum up, your whining is: (1) Socialism will not work in America, and Capitalism dooms America; Socialism has made China win over America, but it can only make America as a capitalist country a loser. (2) As the later part of your post says, you want no socialism, but just want entitlement of the poor.
All of a sudden I realize how stupid I have been to dwell in a debate with a person with the above mentality and ignorant quality.

Obama care is not a socialist agenda it is a bad deal it is an insurance ad it is a scam to get more money for insurance companies.

You are the first person ever from whom I heard of that Obamacare is not a socialist agenda. No, you are not stupid, but I am stupid to have engaged you with a debate. After returning this post, I will shut up.

There is an old saying you want to find a crook follow the money.
Who does Obamacare benefit?
The government ?don't think so
The taxpayer? don't think so
The insurance campanies ? yes.
Are insurance companies a socialist organization or a Capitalist organization?
Think hard now, remember the difference between capitalism and socialism.

Socialism can be promoted by all kind of people, some rich people can be even more fanatical about it. Engels, Lenin, Mao, Pol Pot, Che, Castro…were all from rich families. The American media are controlled by rich people, but most of them today promote socialism in America. The key point is how to grab more power besides money. One of the efficient trick is to lure the poor with entitlement so that the rich can gather more power to launch the next wave of money grabbing.

People like me ? you mean average people that want no hand outs , that want no Obama care , that want no government assistence.
THE AMERICAN PEOPLE /WORKERS/CUSTOMERS ONLY WANT TO WORK FOR A DECENT WAGE PAY TAXES, PAY BILLS AND LIVE AN AVERAGE LIFE.

The portion with capitalization and the portion without capitalization are so contradicting each other! Want no hand out but want to work for a decent wage? Can a janitor whine that his wage is not decent when looking at what a physician gets? Anything that you want and get through no competition is to be given through only entitlement; entitlement is absolutely socialist appropriation in wealth. Hand out or not, why is Obamacare not part of the decent wage that the poor "entitles"?

If you wish to talk more about the power monopolization fine.
I ask some questions
With money comes power true or false?

True but incomplete. Money can bring one some power; Bill Gate does have certain power in this country, but very limited. However, power can enable someone to control nearly all wealth within a country, look at the Kim’s family in North Korea.

Where can the bulk of America's wealth be found?

Certainly it is capitalism that has brought the bulk to existence, but socialism has been scattering it with unprecedented speed.
Bye!

 

[presluc]

Thank you for telling me you stand by your nonsense whining so that I can stop wasting my time in this topic: nothing can clear you up.
To sum up, your whining is: (1) Socialism will not work in America, and Capitalism dooms America; Socialism has made China win over America, but it can only make America as a capitalist country a loser. (2) As the later part of your post says, you want no socialism, but just want entitlement of the poor.
All of a sudden I realize how stupid I have been to dwell in a debate with a person with the above mentality and ignorant quality.


You are the first person ever from whom I heard of that Obamacare is not a socialist agenda. No, you are not stupid, but I am stupid to have engaged you with a debate. After returning this post, I will shut up.

Socialism can be promoted by all kind of people, some rich people can be even more fanatical about it. Engels, Lenin, Mao, Pol Pot, Che, Castro…were all from rich families. The American media are controlled by rich people, but most of them today promote socialism in America. The key point is how to grab more power besides money. One of the efficient trick is to lure the poor with entitlement so that the rich can gather more power to launch the next wave of money grabbing.


The portion with capitalization and the portion without capitalization are so contradicting each other! Want no hand out but want to work for a decent wage? Can a janitor whine that his wage is not decent when looking at what a physician gets? Anything that you want and get through no competition is to be given through only entitlement; entitlement is absolutely socialist appropriation in wealth. Hand out or not, why is Obamacare not part of the decent wage that the poor "entitles"?

True but incomplete. Money can bring one some power; Bill Gate does have certain power in this country, but very limited. However, power can enable someone to control nearly all wealth within a country, look at the Kim’s family in North Korea.

Certainly it is capitalism that has brought the bulk to existence, but socialism has been scattering it with unprecedented speed.
Bye!

Who's doing the whining here?
I ask for no entitlements for poor people I ask for more jobs for American people.
This was ask for before in 2007 it was called whining then.
However when the customers that lost their jobs stopped spending money on American products
It was American corporations IN 2008 that went whining like a bitch to the government taxpayers for bailouts cause their company was losing money.

CALLING AN INSURANCE COMPANY A SOCIALIST ORGANIZATION?
NOW THAT'S STUPID.

EVEN THE UNEMPLOYMENT DON'T WHINE THEY LOOK FOR WORK.
Check out any Walmart store in America you will find people waiting to get hired.
Walmart only hires part time workers..
They ain't whining..
Obamacare is not part of the decent wage that the poor entitles cause one way or another insurance companies get paid .

I don't live in North Korea so the Kim family is of no use to me except the imports from Korea American pay for.

I'm more interested in the 10% that control the wealth in America.
I'm more interested in why a billionare desperately needs a tax cut from the federal government for paying income taxes
I'm more interested in the Real Estate that has had more than a few foreclosings and the property taxes on bulidings being left.
I'm more interested in Walmart who has an inventory of more than half products from China being #2 in Forbes magazine , while Exxon oil is #1.
So first and second most financial organization in America are from outside of America.
Is America a Capitalist country or a BARTER NATION.eace

 

[crebigsol]

“The poor is suffering, make the rich pay the fair share!” shouted Marx, Engels, then Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Castro, Che, Pol Pot, most of them being rich men in their time…, then shouted many leaders in the recent western European countries, then, finally, the AMERICAN president.

Without irresistible power, no one can be made sharing with someone else; in front of irresistible power, anyone must show “willingness” to share in any appointed magnitude with anyone else.

Sharing enforced by power is a process of robbery. How will Socialism realize sharing without power?

“But the robbery is for the poor”, so does Socialism gain its most dazzling cloak of moral in human history. To test this cloak, just let the poor be robbed by the poorer.

Eventually, after the robbery is done, where will those who control the power to complete the robbery place themselves? To make them more powerful than before, therefore at the top of the society, or poorer than before, therefore at the bottom of the society? Therefore, is the robbery for the poor, or for the rich to get far richer with far more highly monopolized power?

Someone comes to rob you, and you are not allowed to hate him! This is a society that modern people feel fanatical to pursue.

 

[presluc]

“The poor is suffering, make the rich pay the fair share!” shouted Marx, Engels, then Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Castro, Che, Pol Pot, most of them being rich men in their time…, then shouted many leaders in the recent western European countries, then, finally, the AMERICAN president.

Without irresistible power, no one can be made sharing with someone else; in front of irresistible power, anyone must show “willingness” to share in any appointed magnitude with anyone else.

Sharing enforced by power is a process of robbery. How will Socialism realize sharing without power?

“But the robbery is for the poor”, so does Socialism gain its most dazzling cloak of moral in human history. To test this cloak, just let the poor be robbed by the poorer.

Eventually, after the robbery is done, where will those who control the power to complete the robbery place themselves? To make them more powerful than before, therefore at the top of the society, or poorer than before, therefore at the bottom of the society? Therefore, is the robbery for the poor, or for the rich to get far richer with far more highly monopolized power?

Someone comes to rob you, and you are not allowed to hate him! This is a society that modern people feel fanatical to pursue.

First of all I don't live in the past , Stalin, Lenin, Marx . Mao and the rest are dead.

That's like comparing the old plantation owners with slaves in early America to today.

Second of all sharing is a two way street , the American corporations hire Americans the American workers buy American products.
Now you could say what has been said before .
The American corporations are in no way obligated to furnish work for American labor.
However, the American customer "which happens to be the American worker" is no way obligated to buy American products or invest in American products. maybe that's what you call "sharing?


As for the uhh... "ROBBERY"?

Let's talk about robbery shall we.
How much tax payer money went to private organizations in 2008?
How much taxpayer money went to oil companies for research grants before and after the price at the pump went up?
How much was taken out of SS fund ,which was paid in as a retirement fund.
{Hoffa went to jail for stealing retirement funds} , some presidents got reelected.

Usually after a robbery is commited you have two left the ones that got robbed who have no or little money and those that commited the robbery who has most of the money.
Who has most of the money in America.
Hint; they don't live on Main Street.eace

 

[American]

 

[hazlnut]

I am curious as to why people despise socialism and Communism so much. I have my own reasons, but I would rather not post them until I hear from others, lest I corrupt their thought process with the power of suggestion.

Why?

I'll tell you why?

 

[crebigsol]

First of all I don't live in the past , Stalin, Lenin, Marx . Mao and the rest are dead.

Woah, innumerous generations of our ancestor died, you live on the earth they left behind. All the signers of the Constitution and the First Amendment died even earlier than Marx, Engels…, you live by the law documents those signers left behind. (Tell me you do not want freedom of speech they insisted!) Your statement has certainly told people that you want others to leave those socialist criminals alone, enthusiastically declining even to send them to the historical trial stand. Why do you need to reveal yourself that principle has no value in your whining, but opportunity, whichever fits?

Second of all sharing is a two way street , the American corporations hire Americans the American workers buy American products.
Now you could say what has been said before .
The American corporations are in no way obligated to furnish work for American labor.
However, the American customer "which happens to be the American worker" is no way obligated to buy American products or invest in American products.

I did not ask you to support my view, it is so unnecessary. But, thanks. Exactly, “the American customer ‘which happens to be the American worker’ is no way obligated to buy American products or invest in American products.” Under the same principle, what makes you think that the American corporation cannot shop for labor at wherever it is at lower price? Still whining about corporations’ outsourcing? Survival of the lowest price, either product or labor! A janitor whines on not having a “decent” wage as a doctor can only force his employer outsourcing the job to someone else. You make your bed, lie on it.

Let's talk about robbery shall we.
How much tax payer money went to private organizations in 2008?

You mean private organizations like ACRON, NAARP, SEIU, Gay & Lesbian Alliance…? Absolutely too much!

How much taxpayer money went to oil companies for research grants before and after the price at the pump went up?

Tax money going to oil companies did not go to personal account, but brings oil to our pump.
Tax money going to food coupon goes to personal accounts, but ends up only something in the toilet.

How much was taken out of SS fund ,which was paid in as a retirement fund.

Why do you need to support my view again? I told you that people from any background can rob, or promote socialism, depending on how much the social system will legitimize the robbing. Tell me that none of the SS fund has been used in promoting socialist programs, tell me that Mao even needs to set up any SS fund for the country after his robbing.

{Hoffa went to jail for stealing retirement funds} , some presidents got reelected.

Tell people that those presidents had taken tax money to their personal account if you have evidence. But for sure I know all those tax money for food coupons, section 8, Medicaid, homeless fund (for drug abuse), tuition for illegal immigrants… go to personal accounts. Oh, I forget, those chairmen, presidents…in socialist countries do not waste the tax payer’s money to get election or re-election, they just assume the responsibilities to “serve” the people again and again, saving a lot of the tax payers’ money.

Usually after a robbery is commited you have two left the ones that got robbed who have no or little money and those that commited the robbery who has most of the money.
Who has most of the money in America.

Tell me Bill Gate has robbed you, Steve Jobs has robbed you, Mark Zuckerberg has robber you; and tell me Kim in N. Korea did not rob his country, Ceaușescu did not rob his country, Castro did not rob his country…

 

[presluc]

Woah, innumerous generations of our ancestor died, you live on the earth they left behind. All the signers of the Constitution and the First Amendment died even earlier than Marx, Engels…, you live by the law documents those signers left behind. (Tell me you do not want freedom of speech they insisted!) Your statement has certainly told people that you want others to leave those socialist criminals alone, enthusiastically declining even to send them to the historical trial stand. Why do you need to reveal yourself that principle has no value in your whining, but opportunity, whichever fits?





I did not ask you to support my view, it is so unnecessary. But, thanks. Exactly, “the American customer ‘which happens to be the American worker’ is no way obligated to buy American products or invest in American products.” Under the same principle, what makes you think that the American corporation cannot shop for labor at wherever it is at lower price? Still whining about corporations’ outsourcing? Survival of the lowest price, either product or labor! A janitor whines on not having a “decent” wage as a doctor can only force his employer outsourcing the job to someone else. You make your bed, lie on it.



You mean private organizations like ACRON, NAARP, SEIU, Gay & Lesbian Alliance…? Absolutely too much!


Tax money going to oil companies did not go to personal account, but brings oil to our pump.
Tax money going to food coupon goes to personal accounts, but ends up only something in the toilet.

Why do you need to support my view again? I told you that people from any background can rob, or promote socialism, depending on how much the social system will legitimize the robbing. Tell me that none of the SS fund has been used in promoting socialist programs, tell me that Mao even needs to set up any SS fund for the country after his robbing.

Tell people that those presidents had taken tax money to their personal account if you have evidence. But for sure I know all those tax money for food coupons, section 8, Medicaid, homeless fund (for drug abuse), tuition for illegal immigrants… go to personal accounts. Oh, I forget, those chairmen, presidents…in socialist countries do not waste the tax payer’s money to get election or re-election, they just assume the responsibilities to “serve” the people again and again, saving a lot of the tax payers’ money.

Tell me Bill Gate has robbed you, Steve Jobs has robbed you, Mark Zuckerberg has robber you; and tell me Kim in N. Korea did not rob his country, Ceaușescu did not rob his country, Castro did not rob his country…

Well, first of all did those signers of the Constitution were they for a stronger America with American people working for a better, stronger America, or was it their dream to order out, for labor, to order out for products , to order out for energy from foreign nations.
Was it the founders of America to have American people depend on other nations??

Freedom can be tossed around easy by the right wing and left wing of politics but if your idea does not match theirs well it's different then,. If you agree you are intelligent and "free" , if you disagree you are a socialist, commie, pinko and ignorant of "freedom", kinda like organized religion.,

Yeah. right outsource to a cheaper labor. which is ok I guess.
The increased outsourcing started to increase in 2000 .
Remember,1999 before America was counting the debt with millions instead of trillions?

Today Americans ask for more jobs the corporations call this whining .
Very well is the Real estate business whining cause it never recovered?
Is Chrysler whining after they sold the majority of their stocks to FIAT?
Is Best Buy whining?
I have more American business that are in trouble need I go on?

Without retail sales corporations can use cheap foreign labor till Hell freezes over if American customers stop buying they will need to invest in a lot of warehouses.

Private organizations like GMC, EXXON, AIG, FREDDY MAC, FANNY MAE,

Money is Money, how can you be sure that money going to oil companies did not go into a personal accounts, or even a campaign contribution? oil companies make money
A food coupon would not be needed if this person had a job

Sure I can tell you none of the money taken from SS was used to promote socialism , if you can tell me none of the money taken from SS wasn't used for research money for oil companies or tax cuts for the rich?
Of course I'll need the serial numbers of the money taken out of SS to confirm your .. shall we say allegation.

Aren't you forgetting the 6 million that came up missing in Iraq , and the ever so popular MISSION ACCOMPLISHED BANNER, or the HALIBURTIAN SQUEEZE , I could go on.
No bid contract? YEAH RIGHT.
For the record I don't think taxpayer money should go to private companies or corporations unless they are hiring American workers, after all that is where taxes come from is it not?

Why is it somebody always ask if Bill Gates is robbing me or Steve Zuckerberg is or has robbed me?
Right after there's the old communist ploy that are actually robbing countries?

To this I ask a few questions .
1. What is considered a White Collar crime in America?
2 Is it possible to be a rich Capitalist and a crook?
3, To rob someone is to take something that is not yours is this true?
4. To rob someone you usually have a motive.
The main motive is one actually needs money so they rob
Question SINCE WHEN DOES A BILLIONAIRE NEED MONEY IN THE FORM OF A TAX CUT.
Question, Where does this money in the form of a tax cut for the rich come from?eace

 

[SOBE]

By whom, where and in comparison with what? I shall be voting in the May local elections and will vote, once again, for our local Communist/Green candidate for Mayor. We have communists in parliament, our government is socialist, as it is currently in around a third of European countries. Seven out of 12 South American countries are socialist run, as is New Zealand and Australia. Clearly not everyone despises socialism. If you're referring to the US, don't assume everyone here is making the same loose assumption.

Seems to me the US likes both communism and socialism very much. 95% of voters have been electing these big government warmongering liberal Dembos and Repugs for decades.

 

[presluc]

Seems to me the US likes both communism and socialism very much. 95% of voters have been electing these big government warmongering liberal Dembos and Repugs for decades.

If there was an Independent candidate with no ties to the Right or Left wing and if he won it would be a great day for Americans.

For the American voter today is between a hard place {Republicans} and a rock {Democrats}.

Of course you could add the .. uh Libertarians and Tea Party {right wing in drag}.eace