Who did wrong? "Maga hat Catholic school teens", "Black Israelites" and or Native Americans"

[MrPeanut]

Re: Who did wrong? "Maga hat Catholic school teens", "Black Israelites" and or Native American"

This story was released before the other video footage had circulated. This is what happens when news outlets care more about being first than accurate.

This here is what it's REALLY about.:Haaland, who is also Catholic, told AP she was particularly saddened to see the boys mocking an elder, who is revered in Native American culture. She placed some of the blame on President Donald Trump, who has used Indian names like Pocahontas as an insult.
“It is sad that we have a president who uses Native American women’s names as racial slurs, and that’s an example that these kids are clearly following considering the fact that they had their ‘Make America Great Again’ hats on,” Haaland said. “He’s really brought out the worst in people.”

I would blame the parents before Trump. Trump might normalize some of this behavior, but I think most people learn how to treat others from their parents first.

 

[mrdeltoid]

Re: Who did wrong? "Maga hat Catholic school teens", "Black Israelites" and or Native American"

I would blame the parents before Trump. Trump might normalize some of this behavior, but I think most people learn how to treat others from their parents first.

Bingo. Agree completely.

 

[TTB]

Re: Who did wrong? "Maga hat Catholic school teens", "Black Israelites" and or Native American"

I voted that they all did something wrong, but I'll put their actions in order of severity based on my reading and understanding of the case and watching of the extended video. From most severe to least severe using my formal training for administering discipline based on various factors.

Nathan Phillips - Deliberately created a photo-op and spun lies to inflame a non-issue with the media while misrepresenting his military service to exacerbate the issue. Some articles still label him as a "Vietnam Vet" and he encouraged that with the self descriptor 'Vietnam era vet'. He is politically savvy for a ACR tech with multiple AWOL issues. He is a resistance/protest veteran though, and very aware of what he was trying to do. He is also in a leadership position of his organization which carries additional weight and responsibility.

BHI - These guys are full grown adults shouting degrading and bigoted statements meant to provoke and dehumanize. They were acting as a group with a goal and focus in mind. They spread hatred and bigotry with intent and forethought.

The Kids - Young idiots caught in a situation beyond their control. They lacked the cohesion of a lot of the other groups with their behavior. (Except when specifically doing their spirit chants to drown out the BHI... and trying to do a positive activity to drown out and shrug off a negative one is at least normally well intentioned.) Some of their members as individuals acted poorly towards other protesters and people and they acted with ignorance of the political landscape they were in. Hopefully they'll all learn and grow from this, but their unacceptable behavior lacked the coordination of others, and it seemed more like a few ignorant teenagers being ignorant teenagers. The chaperones should have kept this stuff under wraps...but stopping teenagers from acting like teenagers is a rough thing to do either way.

 

[Keridan]

Re: Who did wrong? "Maga hat Catholic school teens", "Black Israelites" and or Native American"

Amazing to me how many people are still desperately trying to pretend the teens did something wrong.

 

[Integrityrespec]

Re: Who did wrong? "Maga hat Catholic school teens", "Black Israelites" and or Native American"

The confrontation begins with the Black Israelites, the kids are just victims of a brutal verbal attack. The Native American got involved and should have stayed out of the situation. He escalated the problem by walking all the way up into the kids face, never would have been seen the same if were reversed. If any of the kids did any wrong, it's minor and was mostly in reaction to the verbal assault and the physical presence of the Native American after he wrongfully invades their space.

 

[AGENT J]

Re: Who did wrong? "Maga hat Catholic school teens", "Black Israelites" and or Native American"

I voted that they all did something wrong, but I'll put their actions in order of severity based on my reading and understanding of the case and watching of the extended video. From most severe to least severe using my formal training for administering discipline based on various factors.

Nathan Phillips - Deliberately created a photo-op and spun lies to inflame a non-issue with the media while misrepresenting his military service to exacerbate the issue. Some articles still label him as a "Vietnam Vet" and he encouraged that with the self descriptor 'Vietnam era vet'. He is politically savvy for a ACR tech with multiple AWOL issues. He is a resistance/protest veteran though, and very aware of what he was trying to do. He is also in a leadership position of his organization which carries additional weight and responsibility.

BHI - These guys are full grown adults shouting degrading and bigoted statements meant to provoke and dehumanize. They were acting as a group with a goal and focus in mind. They spread hatred and bigotry with intent and forethought.

The Kids - Young idiots caught in a situation beyond their control. They lacked the cohesion of a lot of the other groups with their behavior. (Except when specifically doing their spirit chants to drown out the BHI... and trying to do a positive activity to drown out and shrug off a negative one is at least normally well intentioned.) Some of their members as individuals acted poorly towards other protesters and people and they acted with ignorance of the political landscape they were in. Hopefully they'll all learn and grow from this, but their unacceptable behavior lacked the coordination of others, and it seemed more like a few ignorant teenagers being ignorant teenagers. The chaperones should have kept this stuff under wraps...but stopping teenagers from acting like teenagers is a rough thing to do either way.

Of course thats really the only ratioanl way to see it . . theres debate on who was most/less wrong at the time etc of course but they all did wrong if you simply watch all the videos. :shrug:

 

[Unolewaya]

Re: Who did wrong? "Maga hat Catholic school teens", "Black Israelites" and or Native Americans"

I put them in quotations because many people/articles/media outlets have called them many things and these seem to be the most common.

I know theres a bunch of threads on this but this is different.
So many people quick to judge and make assumptions im honestly curious that when in a format like this who admits to all the wrong doing, none of the wrong doing or still just sticks to their guns and defends/condemns what ever group they clung on too!

Anyway since tons of info and video has come out that we can all watch for ourselves, what are your honest feelings on the situation? With all the info we have whats your honest verdict?
THIS IS NOT ABOUT THE MEDIA SUCKING OR MEDIA BIASED OR WHO/WHAT GROUP MADE WHAT JUDGMENTS IN THE PAST

Who did wrong? "Maga hat Catholic school teens", "Black Israelites" and or Native American"

One or more maga hat teens did wrong
One or more native americans did wrong
One or more Black israelites did wrong
All of the above did wrong
None of the maga hat teens did wrong
None of the Indians did wrong
None of the Black israelites did wrong
None of the above did wrong

thanks!!!

From a legal stand point, the First Nations group were the only ones who had a permit for a group gathering at that specific location.
The Black Israelites were antagonists with no permit.
They were committing a criminal offense of both 18 uscode 246 and 247.

The students had no permit to gather as a group in that location.
Their involvement in my opinion was initially the fault of ineffective adult supervision and misinformation.
Nathan did what we are taught to do as Traditional elders. He started a prayer song and placed himself between the young people and the antagonists.
Had the young people had training that is standard for religious groups, they would have been aware of what was happening, again adult supervision error.
The boys however were responsible for the disrespectful things they took it upon themselves to do. I "tomahawk chop"
There were some things done by the some of the Native marchers as well.
Vulgar and incite full language specifically.

That was on both the adults and organizers in that group.

A traditional native American group should have had several adult warriors that would be responsible for stopping any such actions from our people.

In reality, the only way that people can learn tolerance for others is to be tolerant. That,is on everyone.

We can not overcome hate with anger.
No matter what our religious beliefs are. To live at peace with others we must be peaceful ourselves as much as it is up to us.

No one though in my belief should be peaceful to the point of taking a beating.


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[Unolewaya]

Re: Who did wrong? "Maga hat Catholic school teens", "Black Israelites" and or Native Americans"

When you mean mocking you mean by standing and saying nothing?

That's not mocking.

No, he means the encircling of an elder,the tomahawk chop and the Atlanta Braves phony war chant. All of those elements have been matters of contention for years. Lol since I was a young man and that was decades ago.

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[Unolewaya]

Re: Who did wrong? "Maga hat Catholic school teens", "Black Israelites" and or Native American"

All of the Above!

From all that I have gleaned of the incident, that is the only conclusion.

I still want to know if that was a school sanctioned trip then where were the chaperones?

Still. It would have been more constructive and instructive if the MAGA Hat wearing students had gone to the Capitol to find their State Senator Mitch McConnell to ask him why he was hiding from performing his Senate duties?

It was a sanctioned event. The chaperones sent the students to the wrong place to catch the buses.
Why they were not all with the students during this time is unclear.
In fairness, some the Indian videos did show one female chaperone trying to move the students towards the proper spot.

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[Unolewaya]

Re: Who did wrong? "Maga hat Catholic school teens", "Black Israelites" and or Native Americans"

So...
Either "One or more native americans did wrong" or None of the Indians did wrong?"

I pick using "Native Americans," beginning with capital letters, but never saw using the word "Indians" as necessarily bigoted or offensive.

Lol I guess it would depend on if you were an indigenous person or not.
Since we predate America, most do not consider ourselves American.

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[LouC]

Re: Who did wrong? "Maga hat Catholic school teens", "Black Israelites" and or Native American"

It was a sanctioned event. The chaperones sent the students to the wrong place to catch the buses.
Why they were not all with the students during this time is unclear.
In fairness, some the Indian videos did show one female chaperone trying to move the students towards the proper spot.

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Thanks!

Still seems to be bad form by many involved, sadly.