• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every persons position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Trump puts Bannon on security council, dropping joint chiefs

Kobie

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Sep 17, 2013
Messages
48,281
Reaction score
25,273
Location
Western NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
Trump puts Bannon on security council, dropping joint chiefs - BBC News

President Donald Trump is reshuffling the US National Security Council (NSC), downgrading the military chiefs of staff and giving a regular seat to his chief strategist Steve Bannon.

Mr Bannon, formerly the head of the populist right-wing, Breitbart News website, will join high-level discussions about national security.

The order was signed on Saturday.

The director of national intelligence and the joint chiefs will attend when discussions pertain to their areas.

Under previous administrations, the director and joint chiefs attended all meetings of the NSC's inner circle, the principals' committee.

The National Security Council (NSC) is the main group advising the president on national security and foreign affairs.

It is led by retired lieutenant-general Mike Flynn, who was one of Mr Trump's closest advisers and most ardent supporters during the campaign.

"The security threats facing the United States in the 21st century transcend international boundaries," Mr Trump's executive order said.

"Accordingly, the United States Government's decision-making structures and processes to address these challenges must remain equally adaptive and transformative."
This is the most terrifying thing I've read so far about the travesty that has thus far been the Trump presidency.
 

CriticalThought

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 11, 2009
Messages
19,568
Reaction score
8,354
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Libertarian
My level of certainty that we will engage in a future war has risen significantly.
 

Helix

Administrator
Moderator
DP Veteran
Joined
Jul 1, 2011
Messages
70,806
Reaction score
53,279
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
My level of certainty that we will engage in a future war has risen significantly.
that's a concern of mine, as well. it currently feels like certain politicians are playing with matches outside of the dynamite shed, and it's fairly unnerving.
 

sanman

DP Veteran
Joined
Nov 22, 2015
Messages
5,597
Reaction score
1,945
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Conservative
This is the most terrifying thing I've read so far about the travesty that has thus far been the Trump presidency.
Give me a break - suddenly you lifelong Lefty Libs are now all national security experts, huh? Don't make me laugh.

You may imagine that Google can make you a plausible armchair expert on anything in 5 minutes - or at least give you enough info to churn out some quips as needed - but you're not fooling anybody.

Your need to ridicule Trump's national security structure is driven by your slavish partisan loyalty to an obsolete political order.

The US national security structure has been critically underperforming and is in dire need of reform. That reform won't happen on its own and won't happen from within. It has to be brought in from above.
 

Kobie

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Sep 17, 2013
Messages
48,281
Reaction score
25,273
Location
Western NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
Give me a break - suddenly you lifelong Lefty Libs are now all national security experts, huh? Don't make me laugh.

You may imagine that Google can make you a plausible armchair expert on anything in 5 minutes - or at least give you enough info to churn out some quips as needed - but you're not fooling anybody.

Your need to ridicule Trump's national security structure is driven by your slavish partisan loyalty to an obsolete political order.

The US national security structure has been critically underperforming and is in dire need of reform. That reform won't happen on its own and won't happen from within. It has to be brought in from above.
While this is an entertaining little narrative you've built for yourself, dismissing "lefty libs" as know-nothings, I'd LOVE for you to explain to me how demoting the Joint Chiefs of Staff from the National Security Council and replacing them with the former head of Breitbart "News" somehow improves the state of American intelligence. Go. Try to use your own words, but I can imagine you don't have any.

What, in Steve Bannon's background, qualifies him for this position in a way that the JCOS are not? Indulge me. Please take me down that road of reason.
 

sanman

DP Veteran
Joined
Nov 22, 2015
Messages
5,597
Reaction score
1,945
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Conservative
My level of certainty that we will engage in a future war has risen significantly.
that's a concern of mine, as well. it currently feels like certain politicians are playing with matches outside of the dynamite shed, and it's fairly unnerving.
Please give your exact prediction for calamity - otherwise you're no better than these horoscope writers, whose vaguely-worded rubbish is designed to make them look like they've got special insight into things they're totally clueless on.
 

Kobie

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Sep 17, 2013
Messages
48,281
Reaction score
25,273
Location
Western NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
What's bad about that?
What's bad about removing military brass from the NSC and replacing them with Steve Bannon? Is that a serious question?

Tell me what's GOOD about it.
 

Helix

Administrator
Moderator
DP Veteran
Joined
Jul 1, 2011
Messages
70,806
Reaction score
53,279
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
Please give your exact prediction for calamity - otherwise you're no better than these horoscope writers, whose vaguely-worded rubbish is designed to make them look like they've got special insight into things they're totally clueless on.
gladly.

we live in a volatile world in which annihilation due to what often boils down to tribal disagreements is a real possibility. our response to that was to elect a twelve year old who can't even civilly navigate a twitter exchange with another celebrity and to give him control of the most powerful military that mankind has ever known. you'll forgive me if i find that strategy to be flawed.
 

donsutherland1

DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 17, 2007
Messages
11,819
Reaction score
10,220
Location
New York
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Centrist
Trump puts Bannon on security council, dropping joint chiefs - BBC News



This is the most terrifying thing I've read so far about the travesty that has thus far been the Trump presidency.
This seems to be a logical move consistent with the current Administration's [lack of] thinking. After all, if Bannon > DHS (Inside the confusion of the Trump executive order and travel ban - CNNPolitics.com), Bannon is also > Joint Chiefs. Perhaps he'll bring a similar level of "competence" to national security discussions as he did with the disruptive and extreme Executive Order currently under court challenge.
 

Arcana XV

DP Veteran
Joined
May 31, 2007
Messages
6,405
Reaction score
4,811
Location
Geneva, Switzerland and Rochester, NY
Gender
Female
Political Leaning
Independent

sanman

DP Veteran
Joined
Nov 22, 2015
Messages
5,597
Reaction score
1,945
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Conservative
While this is an entertaining little narrative you've built for yourself, dismissing "lefty libs" as know-nothings, I'd LOVE for you to explain to me how demoting the Joint Chiefs of Staff from the National Security Council and replacing them with the former head of Breitbart "News" somehow improves the state of American intelligence. Go. Try to use your own words, but I can imagine you don't have any.

What, in Steve Bannon's background, qualifies him for this position in a way that the JCOS are not? Indulge me. Please take me down that road of reason.
Kobie, go back to pimping hiring quotas and race-baiting, because that's your only utility in the Coalition Of Special Interests that is the American Left. It's the White Europhiles in the Coalition who get to hash out foreign policy, while you should be content with redistributionism as the Soma that gets thrown to you.

Bannon is a former Naval Intelligence officer, and not a career brass bureaucrat. He's given various lectures for domestic and foreign audiences on the rising challenges facing the US. Unlike a lot of brass, he's not hanging around waiting to cash in his pension. He has the intellect and the motivation to re-shape the national security establishment to meet current and future needs.
 

Kobie

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Sep 17, 2013
Messages
48,281
Reaction score
25,273
Location
Western NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
This seems to be a logical move consistent with the current Administration's [lack of] thinking. After all, if Bannon > DHS (Inside the confusion of the Trump executive order and travel ban - CNNPolitics.com), Bannon is also > Joint Chiefs. Perhaps he'll bring a similar level of "competence" to national security discussions as he did with the disruptive and extreme Executive Order currently under court challenge.
Ah, the visa ban EO that apparently airport personnel had no idea how to deal with.

I always respect your opinion, don. Give me your unvarnished take on the immigration EO.
 

Kobie

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Sep 17, 2013
Messages
48,281
Reaction score
25,273
Location
Western NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
Kobie, go back to pimping hiring quotas and race-baiting, because that's your only utility in the Coalition Of Special Interests that is the American Left. It's the White Europhiles in the Coalition who get to hash out foreign policy, while you should be content with redistributionism as the Soma that gets thrown to you.
Well, THAT escalated quickly. When have I ever "pimped hiring quotas and race-baiting"? Or is this when you just, as per usual, start making stuff up? You've been completely full of brown stuff since you got here, so there's no sense in asking you to change your stripes, much less answer a simple goddamn question. Which you won't, and can't, because you know you can't.

Bannon is a former Naval Intelligence officer, and not a career brass bureaucrat. He's given various lectures for domestic and foreign audiences on the rising challenges facing the US. Unlike a lot of brass, he's not hanging around waiting to cash in his pension. He has the intellect and the motivation to re-shape the national security establishment to meet current and future needs.
Yes, that's why he spent the vast majority of his "professional' career wading in the right-wing sewer.
 

sanman

DP Veteran
Joined
Nov 22, 2015
Messages
5,597
Reaction score
1,945
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Conservative
What's bad about removing military brass from the NSC and replacing them with Steve Bannon? Is that a serious question?

Tell me what's GOOD about it.

Still in quip mode - can't give a substantive answer, huh?

China are already talking about the inevitability!
So let's compare that with the hyperaggressive confrontationalist rhetoric against Russia that's coming from the Left - and meanwhile even the slightest concern about China's alarming land grabs in the ocean is derided as war-mongering from the Whitehouse.

gladly.

we live in a volatile world in which annihilation due to what often boils down to tribal disagreements is a real possibility. our response to that was to elect a twelve year old who can't even civilly navigate a twitter exchange with another celebrity and to give him control of the most powerful military that mankind has ever known. you'll forgive me if i find that strategy to be flawed.
You just wrote a horoscope prediction. Nothing useful or specific at all.
 

JANFU

Not quite there yet, but getting close
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Dec 27, 2014
Messages
33,910
Reaction score
12,298
Location
Best Coast Canada
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Well, THAT escalated quickly. When have I ever "pimped hiring quotas and race-baiting"? Or is this when you just, as per usual, start making stuff up? You've been completely full of brown stuff since you got here, so there's no sense in asking you to change your stripes, much less answer a simple goddamn question. Which you won't, and can't, because you know you can't.



Yes, that's why he spent the vast majority of his "professional' career wading in the right-wing sewer.
Deleted
 

JANFU

Not quite there yet, but getting close
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Dec 27, 2014
Messages
33,910
Reaction score
12,298
Location
Best Coast Canada
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Kobie, go back to pimping hiring quotas and race-baiting, because that's your only utility in the Coalition Of Special Interests that is the American Left. It's the White Europhiles in the Coalition who get to hash out foreign policy, while you should be content with redistributionism as the Soma that gets thrown to you.

Bannon is a former Naval Intelligence officer, and not a career brass bureaucrat. He's given various lectures for domestic and foreign audiences on the rising challenges facing the US. Unlike a lot of brass, he's not hanging around waiting to cash in his pension. He has the intellect and the motivation to re-shape the national security establishment to meet current and future needs.
You consider him qualified??
Imagine if he had to appear before the Senate for confirmation in anything to do with National Security.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Bannon#Service_in_U.S._Navy
Service in U.S. Navy
Bannon was an officer in the United States Navy for seven years in the late 1970s and early 1980s, serving on the destroyer USS Paul F. Foster as a Surface Warfare Officer in the Pacific Fleet and stateside as a special assistant to the Chief of Naval Operations at the Pentagon.[32]
 

calamity

Privileged
Supporting Member
Monthly Subscriber
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 12, 2013
Messages
143,719
Reaction score
47,037
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Centrist

Kobie

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Sep 17, 2013
Messages
48,281
Reaction score
25,273
Location
Western NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Liberal
Still in quip mode - can't give a substantive answer, huh?
And yet you can't give one. C'mon, sanman, tell me why Steve Bannon is a better person to have on the NSC than:

Gen. Joseph F. Dunford
Gen. Paul J. Selva
Gen. Mark A. Milley
Gen. Robert B. Neller
Adm. John M. Richardson
Gen. David L. Goldfein
Gen. Joseph L. Lengyel

Now, I don't trust the military with everything, but I sure as hell trust these guys more than I trust a guy whose most recent job was running a wingnut rag.
 

sanman

DP Veteran
Joined
Nov 22, 2015
Messages
5,597
Reaction score
1,945
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Conservative
Yes, that's why he spent the vast majority of his "professional' career wading in the right-wing sewer.
Breitbart isn't a "right-wing sewer" (and for you that's redundant anyway, since anything from the right is a sewer to you)

It's a news site with a wide variety of opinions, and he doesn't personally endorse every one of them.
 

SenorXm/Sirius

DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 23, 2015
Messages
14,685
Reaction score
10,577
Location
New York State, USA
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Liberal
If been a looooong time since the GOP has put country before party.

So there's no guarantee things will change now, but it would be nice is someone from the GOP, ANYONE spoke up about what's been going on this past week. Trump puts a rightwing lunatic reporter on the Security Council? WTF?

And again.. Another EO? Where's all the outrage from the so called lovers of the Constitution and people who want to limit the powers of the President so they criticized Obama every single time he wrote an EO?

The Republican Party is a disgrace. I just hope we survive this nightmare they have caused.
 

sanman

DP Veteran
Joined
Nov 22, 2015
Messages
5,597
Reaction score
1,945
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Conservative
And yet you can't give one. C'mon, sanman, tell me why Steve Bannon is a better person to have on the NSC than:

Gen. Joseph F. Dunford
Gen. Paul J. Selva
Gen. Mark A. Milley
Gen. Robert B. Neller
Adm. John M. Richardson
Gen. David L. Goldfein
Gen. Joseph L. Lengyel

Now, I don't trust the military with everything, but I sure as hell trust these guys more than I trust a guy whose most recent job was running a wingnut rag.
Haha- surrre you do. You Googled up a list of names of people you'd never previously heard of - and now you're giving me your "expert" endorsement of them.:roll:

That could have been the list of senior officers at Starfleet Command and I doubt you'd have known the difference.

"Admiral Cartwright - yup, looks solid to me. What do you think of his solution to the Kobie-yashi Maru test?"

Bannon is certainly more competent on military and strategic affairs than Obama, that's for sure.
 

Mithros

DP Veteran
Joined
May 19, 2011
Messages
3,942
Reaction score
1,809
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Please give your exact prediction for calamity - otherwise you're no better than these horoscope writers, whose vaguely-worded rubbish is designed to make them look like they've got special insight into things they're totally clueless on.
We are the largest nuclear power on earth and you don't see anything wrong with removing two actual national security experts from the national security council and replacing them with a ****ing neo nazi click bait guru?

The partisanship and the koolaide is on one side. I think behavioral scientists refer to this phenomenon as not being intelligent enough to have the capability of understanding how much you don't know.
 
Top Bottom