Trump Pardons Michael Flynn, Who Pleaded Guilty To Lying About Russia Contact

[RAMOSS]

He avoided a trial. There was no conviction by a jury. Plus the prosecution wants to void the plea. A hack political activist judge is acting as the prosecutor. He should be impeached.

And? Do you have a point? He was given the plea for a lesser charge in return for cooperation that was not done. The evidence does not merit the partisan and dishonest comment 'A hack political blah blah blah'

 

[Tahuyaman]

And? Do you have a point? He was given the plea for a lesser charge in return for cooperation that was not done. The evidence does not merit the partisan and dishonest comment 'A hack political blah blah blah'

The point? The point is that he was not convicted in a court of law.

 

[Tahuyaman]

The fact is that either out of ignorance or deliberately, you misled or lied when you claimed that

Tahuyaman said:
... No court found him guilty of anything

That claim is different from the trivial one you make now that " Flynn was not convicted through a trial by jury in a court of law."
And as I already explained, that claim is wrong.

How is it a lie to say that he was not convicted by a jury in a court of law? It’s a fact. He wasn’t.

 

[Atomic Kid]

Let me remind you of a fact. Flynn was not convicted through a trial by jury in a court of law.

Let me remind you that guilty by plea is just as guilty as guilty by verdict. Either way he's guilty. Period.

 

[RAMOSS]

The point? The point is that he was not convicted in a court of law.

And what kind of point is that, considering he plead guilty? Pleading guilty is the same thing as being convicted. They are the SAME THING... so your point is no point at all

 

[GummyVitamins]

Pardons have consequences. First, accepting one is a full admission of guilt.



...but, I like "second" the best.

The fact that you think Flynn has any dirt on Trump when the FBI set him up prior to Trump starting his administration just goes to show how brain washed people are.

And, who is this Bateman, why are you following him, and why does he look homeless?

 

[ecofarm]

I find it difficult to believe Americans are so willing to bend over and take it for a politician. That wasn't the American way. Trumpers have made America third world.

And, who is this Bateman, why are you following him, and why does he look homeless?

No comma before the end of a list. You've created a false conjunction. That grammar is homeless.

 

[Athanasius68]

And then in early January there was evidence. And that by itself was basis enough. Add to that the Deputy National Security Adviser Mcfarland, White House Press Secretary Priebus, and Vice President Pence, all giving statements and narrations about the nature of the calls to the national media that the FBI knew not be true and now you have the makings for a potential full blown national security crisis. Not to mention Flynn and others on the Transition team were already lying to cover up those calls in real time weeks before the FBI came calling.

Comey saw nothing wrong with the conversation.

 

[Athanasius68]

Yeah he did.

He undermined the policy towards Russia and got Russia to veto a resolution about Israeli Settlement in the UN.

He was conducting foreign policy before he should have been and then he lied about it.

If what he was doing was all well and good.... then why did he lie?

He didn't undermine anything toward Russia.

 

[Athanasius68]

The only legal impact that the Steele dossier had was on the Carter Page FISA warrant.

I know that people want to make a big bugaboo about it, but in reality it was only used in that instance. So a dude who in the past has been up to eyeballs in Russian Intelligence who had already left the campaign and was traveling to Russia.... I would be surprised if they didn’t look into stuff like that seeing as what was going on in 2016.

We already know that the FBI knew that Mr. Page had been asset of the USA, not some Russian agent.

 

[Jezcoe]

We already know that the FBI knew that Mr. Page had been asset of the USA, not some Russian agent.

Page has been both things.

Hence the confusion

 

[Athanasius68]

Page has been both things.

Hence the confusion

He was never an agent of Russia. That is what Clinesmith pled guilty-- altering documents to imply that he had been a Russian agent.

 

[Jezcoe]

He was never an agent of Russia. That is what Clinesmith pled guilty-- altering documents to imply that he had been a Russian agent.

Page has described himself as an “informal adviser” to Russia.

He had been a useful idiot for Russia for quite a while before he joined the Trump team and continued to be after he left.

Knowing what we know was going on in 2016, it is not a surprise that he was under surveillance. That investigation simply showed that Page is an idiot, not a criminal

 

[dixon01767]

The plea has been accepted... twice.

Why are they trying to call backsies?

The exculpatory evidence hidden and withheld by the prosecution was discovered.

 

[dixon01767]

Imagine if people from the Biden team were contacting foreign adversaries and making policy that was antithetical to President Trump.

??? They already have.

 

[Tangmo]

*******



********

@PalmerReport

- Judge Sullivan can issue the opinion that Trump's pardon of a co-conspirator is invalid, sentence Flynn to prison, and dare Flynn to appeal. - Even if Flynn skates, he'll have no 5th Amendment protection, and he'll be required to testify against Trump:

Donald Trump just pardoned Michael Flynn – but it could blow up in both their faces
...
palmerreport.com
5:44 AM · Nov 26, 2020·Twitter Web App

********​

The pardon is only the beginning for Trump and Flynn starting after January 20th. And for Judge Sullivan who said the word "treason" to Flynn in open court. Sullivan is a lawman through and through so five will get you ten Sullivan proceeds.

Here's how Marcy Wheeler puts it who publishes anonymously as the Emptywheel.com blog that was spot on consistently during these years of the Flynn saga of treason. She has made every call on what Judge Sullivan will do. There's more on this bonfire at the link/cite.


Make Trump name Flynn’s crimes
While whoever wrote this pardon tried (but failed) to make it comprehensive, it only names one of Flynn’s crimes: false statements (indeed, that’s the only crime that DOJ lists for the pardon on its website).



But by moving to withdraw his plea, Flynn put his other crimes before Judge Sullivan. So Sullivan has every right to inquire whether this pardon includes all of Flynn’s crimes. He could issue an order for Trump to come before him to answer whether the pardon forgives Flynn for:

• His lies about what he said to Sergey Kislyak during the transition
• Serving as an undisclosed Foreign Agent for Turkey
• Lying about serving as an undisclosed Foreign Agent for Turkey
• Conspiring with others to hide that he was an undisclosed Foreign Agent of Turkey
• Lying about his own guilt and the circumstances surrounding his guilty pleas
• Lying about lying to Flynn’s Covington lawyers

The answer to all those questions is yes. Trump does mean to pardon Mike Flynn for secretly working for Turkey while getting classified briefings. Trump does mean to pardon Flynn for lying to Sullivan (and he does know that Flynn did lie to Sullivan). Sullivan has a need to know that explicitly and he should get Trump on the record.

Four Things Judge Emmet Sullivan Should Do in the Wake of Flynn’s Pardon - emptywheel

www.emptywheel.net

Trump won’t show, of course. Until he is made to, after January 20th.

Judge Sullivan can also require disclosure of who wrote the pardon, under what guidelines and instructions, to what purposes and to what ends -- intended ends as in plural. Etc.

Sullivan is not a guy to throw in the towel. Barr should be very nervous too about Judge Emmitt Sullivan. Beginning January 20th and after Covid shots beginning Jan. 26th.

 

[Tangmo]

Of course they won't. That's how the game is played in Trump-era Washington. Democrats have an opportunity to play by those rules and attempt to curb stomp the opposition party, or attempt to reset them and try to build unity. While I understand the desire for the justice of the former, I believe the latter is better for the country. It is up to the Democratic Party to decide if it will play the "party over country" game that Republicans have established. If Joe Biden truly leads them down the "country over party" path that he is telegraphing and chooses to sacrifice the justice of fighting dirty for the unity of compromise, then I suppose it will be up to the American people to decide if taking this path was better for the Democratic Party. If they turn on him for being 'weak' then we can expect another Republican mess in four to eight years.

Joe wants 100 dayze to see if he can get anything significant done or going in the Congress.

If a Potus Biden can get legislation accomplished or moving forward then we'll want to see it all through to its successful conclusion the rest of the year.

If a Potus Biden is blocked, sabotaged or his programs mugged by Republicans-Conservatives then I'll go with blindfolds and cigarettes at Trump's Wall for the whole bunch of 'em because the system will be totally and permanently wrecked otherwise.

 

[Atomic Kid]

Comey saw nothing wrong with the conversation.

Really? Who was it that sent those FBI agents to the White House?

 

[Atomic Kid]

The exculpatory evidence hidden and withheld by the prosecution was discovered.

There was no exculpatory evidence withheld by the prosecution. All of Sidney Powell's so called 'new evidence' wasn't new at all. All of it had been either previously submitted to Flynn's defense teams, or put before Judge Sullivan, or had been in the possession of the DOJ. But somebody in DOJ however did package up and send to Sidney Powell altered documents to support a Trump attack on Biden and I would expect that at some point that someone is going have to answer for that to the court. But I can tell you what was withheld by the DOJ yesterday in Buzzfeed's FOIA suit release. Flynn's 302s. Interesting, huh?

 

[dixon01767]

It sucks that this judge can't do the right thing and drop this case like he should have as soon as he found out about the prosecutorial misconduct that occurred.


this travesty of justice should never happen to another american ever. what is worse the people that did it will never be punished and one of them was just elected president.

it is scary what biden is capable of since he broke the law as VP.

From the notes on the Jan. 5, 2016 meeting at the whitehouse

comments made by VP (Biden), P (Obama) and D (FBI Director Comey):

VP: “Logan Act”
P: These are unusual times
VP: I have been on the intel committee for ten years and I never.
P: Make sure you look at things - have the right people on it.
P: Is there anything I shouldn’t be telling transition team?
D: Flynn —> Kilysak calls but appear legit

And Biden in an interview saying they were "asking for an investigation" of Flynn

Joe Biden denies he was involved in Michael Flynn probe

WASHINGTON — Joe Biden has denied allegations he was part of an anti-Trump operation to frame former national security adviser Michael Flynn, playing down his presence at a key Oval Office meeting …

nypost.com

With one of the orchestrators of the witch hunt about to move into the Whitehouse, Trump had to pardon Flynn.

 

[dixon01767]

There was no exculpatory evidence withheld by the prosecution.

Sure there was. The fact that the FBI agents who interviewed Flynn didn't believe he was lying. The guy is charged with lying to the FBI and the only guys he is alleged to have lied to within the FBI recorded that they didn't believe he had lied. AND the fact that they were recommending the investigation of Flynn being closed.

 

[Tangmo]

The exculpatory evidence hidden and withheld by the prosecution was discovered.

PutinTrumpRowers have said the same things a thousand times for four years while adding new stuff as you go along all of which are repeated endlessly despite being shot down every time.

You've got thousands of posts in dozens of threads in this forum and that forum that say the same things all the time no matter.

PutinTrumpFlynn are your Big Three all the way and no matter what -- from the getgo. Meanwhile Judge Sullivan and the government are far from done with Flynn and Trump knows he has a very tough time coming up. I commend Judge Sullivan for inter alia saying the word "treason" to Flynn in open court. It makes all of it perfectly clear.

 

[uptower]

 

[Tahuyaman]

And what kind of point is that, considering he plead guilty? Pleading guilty is the same thing as being convicted. They are the SAME THING... so your point is no point at all

It’s not the same as being convicted by a jury.

 

[pamak]

How is it a lie to say that he was not convicted by a jury in a court of law? It’s a fact. He wasn’t.

It is a lie by ommission to defend Flynn's innocence by hiding the fact that he was found guilty by a judge in a court of law the moment the judge ruled that the guilty plea was legitimate and not a result of goverment coercion.