Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts"

[haymarket]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

Sorry, but this is just too much BS. Any claim that any of the major players in the race-pimp community put anything more than lip-service on black on black crime is hogwash. We all know how Bill Cosby's comments went over. He got a real warm embrace, didn't he. Had the whole crowd chanting "No Justice, No Peace" ...... oh wait :roll:

There's no faster way to be labeled an Uncle Tom then to get off the "its someone else's fault" bandwagon. One would have to be deliberately ignorant to claim that the race-pimps and liberal politicians give anywhere near the effort to what kills over 90% of all murdered blacks than they do a chance to play the race card and boost victimhood. That doesn't win votes.

You badly need to learn two things:
1) there was no meeting where Al Sharpton was elected the Grand Poobah of African Americans
2) lots of other people are doing much more than just jawing about black on black crime

The Detroit 300

I believe you would find this encouraging.

 

[Risky Thicket]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

Somewhere in around here is where the truth lies, I strongly suspect.

But may never get to know.

One thing I think some may not have picked up on is I'm not "anti-Zim". Haven't been for some time. "DAMMIT, ZIMMERMAN" is about all I can muster.

He ****ed up and somebody died. If only that bringing the gun into the situation resulted in somebody who wasn't doing anything wrong dying.

Don't get me wrong. I have NO problem with people carrying PER SE. But if you're going to carry death around with you everywhere you go, I by damned want you to have your ****ing **** together and NOT get yourself into situations you wouldn't if you didn't have the fools courage that guns give some people.

You MUST at ALL TIMES make the world a safer place for the innocent.

Jedi, yes. Barney Fife, no.

Exactly. The thing that stays in my mind is Zim seems to be connected to violence and he always gets off.

 

[Phoenix]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

It was a situation entirely of Zimmerman's own making - if he had stayed in his car as directed by the police dispatcher, instead of tracking Martin, there never would have been a confrontaion and an innocent teenager would have been allowed to finish his walk to his father's home!

That doesn't amount to criminal actions. and though semantics, the dispatcher never told Z to stay in his car. And how do you know M was going home? and {semantics} it wasn't his father's home.

 

[OscarB63]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

You struggle with word meaning.

Without a doubt, the incident does not happen if Z decides not to be as a Community Watch person that night, or possibly getting out of his car. But that does not equate to "the siuation was entirely of his making". At some point, someone violated the Law. That is where your "situation" gets made.

Your post reminds me of those who blame the girl who is raped because she dressed in a short skirt.

Also, without a doubt, had trayvon not had drugs at school he wouldn't have been suspended and he would not have been there that night for Zimmerman to see and follow him. Point being none of that matters. What happened when zimm and martin met face to face? Who started the fight?

 

[Boo Radley]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

Also, without a doubt, had trayvon not had drugs at school he wouldn't have been suspended and he would not have been there that night for Zimmerman to see and follow him. Point being none of that matters. What happened when zimm and martin met face to face? Who started the fight?

As I keep saying, the blame is likely shared. How much each owns likely depends on what happened concerning the who started the confrontation. We don't really know. What disturbs me are the efforts to demonize both. I see nothing in either of their histories that justifies such demonization. Marin was a young man, likely with all the growing pains young men have in our society, but hardly a hard case to be written off. Zimmerman appears to have been overzealous, but at this point, this is most we can throw at him barring new information. And neither family should have to deal with garbage a lot of those taking a side are throwing out. There are reasons this type of thing makes news. I don't think we can control that. But we'd help a lot if we quit participating in the silliness. Attention has been brought to it, let's hope, and maybe even trust to a certain that professionals will do their jobs and give a reasonable, true, and supportable explanation to the families (not the rest of us).

 

[Grim17]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

"Next thing I hear is somebody pushing, and somebody pushed Trayvon because the head set just fell.
I called him again, and he didn't answer the phone."

Hey! Wait a ding dang minute.
Apparently Zimmerman was still on the phone with the Dispatcher when she says she tried to call Trayvon again and received no answer.​

Maybe I'm misreading this, so please correct me if I'm wrong, but it would seem that according to the time line of the calls, his headset didn't fall off because he was pushed, but rather because he started running.

Am I correct on that?​

 

[joko104]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

It was a situation entirely of Zimmerman's own making - if he had stayed in his car as directed by the police dispatcher, instead of tracking Martin, there never would have been a confrontaion and an innocent teenager would have been allowed to finish his walk to his father's home!

If "ifs' and "buts" were candy and nuts, what a Merry Christmas we'd all have.

If Martin had gone home this wouldn't have happened. Maybe we should blame the maker of Skittles. But for Skittles...

 

[johnny_rebson]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

It was a situation entirely of Zimmerman's own making - if he had stayed in his car as directed by the police dispatcher, instead of tracking Martin, there never would have been a confrontaion and an innocent teenager would have been allowed to finish his walk to his father's home!

So when Zimmerman sees a burglar he's supposed to let him get away?

 

[What if...?]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

Beats me.
Maybe they did contact her and she told them the following the first time, but only later changed her story.

"Next thing I hear is somebody pushing, and somebody pushed Trayvon because the head set just fell.
I called him again, and he didn't answer the phone."
Trayvon Martin Arrest Now After ABC Reveals Crucial Phone Call - ABC News​

OMG. She was talking to him, lost contact, and tried to call him again but he didn't answer.


The article provided the following image to verify that what she said about being on the phone with Trayvon is accurate.

02/26/2012 07:04 PM Incoming

(First conversation)​

02/26/2012 07:12 PM Incoming

("I called him again, and he didn't answer the phone.")​

No further incoming calls fore that evening are listed.


Hey! Wait a ding dang minute.
Apparently Zimmerman was still on the phone with the Dispatcher when she says she tried to call Trayvon again and received no answer.

02/26/2012 07:13 PM Zimmerman requests LEO call before meeting.
(Hi-lighted on image in Red.)

"02/26/2012     19:13:41     COMPL NOW REQ LEO 1045 BEFORE 1056"

Actually, one of the cops on the board explained that the log reflects when entries are made by the dispatcher, so there's a lag involved.

Further, this is from a bill so would only reflect calls actually answered for billing purposes. He would theoretically have voicemail, but she may not have waited to leave a message.

 

[What if...?]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

Exactly. The thing that stays in my mind is Zim seems to be connected to violence and he always gets off.

I'm not sure whether he's getting some kind of "pass" or not. His dad wasn't a judge where this took place, right? So his influence wouldn't be that great due to any kind of "old boy" network.

But he would ttheoretically be able to provide advice and guidance to achieve the most favorable outcome. The mother as well.

My take is more "lawyer" dad than "judge" dad. More knowledge of the system than direct corruption. The fathers participation in the instant matter is somewhat suspect. It raises the question of "coaching".

 

[What if...?]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

Maybe I'm misreading this, so please correct me if I'm wrong, but it would seem that according to the time line of the calls, his headset didn't fall off because he was pushed, but rather because he started running.

Am I correct on that?

The conversation between the two related by the GF takes place after he had stopped running.

In both versions, the physical altercation is immediately antecedent to them speaking.

 

[Ometauru]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

So when Zimmerman sees a burglar he's supposed to let him get away?

I'm confused. Where did Zimmerman see a burglar?

 

[Excon]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

Actually, one of the cops on the board explained that the log reflects when entries are made by the dispatcher, so there's a lag involved.

The dispatcher is sitting there typing at the same time.
It isn't a report they later write-up like an Officer does.
Any lag is minimal.

Try again.
You can hear the dispatcher typing during the call.
Do you also see the seconds on the report? That is computer generated time as it was typed in. Not user generated approx. times.
Any lag is minimal.
Look at the time the call came in.
Then follow along with the 911 call.


00:39 Description ends

entered into computer 19:11:17​

02:19 Running towards back entrance

entered into computer 19:11:59​

03:43 Agrees to meet by mail boxes

entered into computer 19:13:12​

03:52 req. call before meet

entered into computer 19:13:41​

There is very little lag time, the largest amount being at the beginning, with the rest not being enough to make a difference.

Zimmerman was still on the horn with the dispatcher when she was trying to get a hold of Trayvon for a second time.
That is if Trayvon's call logs are accurate.

 

[Risky Thicket]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

So when Zimmerman sees a burglar he's supposed to let him get away?

Yes if he obeys the law.

 

[Born Free]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

I'm confused. Where did Zimmerman see a burglar?

Try "Suspected" as in this entire case is all subjective.

 

[buck]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

Yes if he obeys the law.

Theres a law that say he can't follow a burglar? Can you show me that law?

 

[Risky Thicket]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

I'm not sure whether he's getting some kind of "pass" or not. His dad wasn't a judge where this took place, right? So his influence wouldn't be that great due to any kind of "old boy" network.

But he would ttheoretically be able to provide advice and guidance to achieve the most favorable outcome. The mother as well.

My take is more "lawyer" dad than "judge" dad. More knowledge of the system than direct corruption. The fathers participation in the instant matter is somewhat suspect. It raises the question of "coaching".

Yep, me too. The "I used to sit on the bench" <wink, wink, nudge, nudge> may have opened a door or two, but I don't think the good old boy network came into play in not charging Zimmerman. I have not been able to find any source that validates the earlier statements that Zimmerman's dad was a magistrate in Orange County, Florida. I believe he was not and was thus not part of the good old boy network in Florida. But, the father was wise enough, fortunate enough, and/or savvy enough to have been able to meet with the State Attorney that night.

I do believe that his dad and mom (retired clerk of court) know the system well and THAT may have aided Z's dad in coaching during the questioning and beyond. I suspect that when all is said and done the state attorney will have looked closely at the father's involvement. We cannot ignore the fact that this wasn't the first time the father was involved with the Sanford PD on behalf of his son. He was not a stranger at the Sanford PD.

As to the initial questioning, if the father was present with his son, and I believe he was, then Zimmerman was fortunate again as the initial questioning was conducted by a narcotics detective. Why? A homicide detective was not available? That's possible. Why didn't they wait until one could come in?

A seasoned retired magistrate might just have had a bit of upper hand against a detective who was not a homicide detective. Thus questioning could have been guided somewhat by questions and objections and words of caution to the detective by the father while the father also coached Zimmerman.

 

[OscarB63]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

Theres a law that say he can't follow a burglar? Can you show me that law?

Apparently he's never heard of "citizen's arrest".

 

[Risky Thicket]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

Theres a law that say he can't follow a burglar? Can you show me that law?

The question was "let him get away". A citizen cannot detain a suspected burglar in most circumstances unless the person is on property under your control or responsibility.

Regarding the OP, however, the question not germane.

 

[buck]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

The question was "let him get away". You cannot detain a suspected burglar.

Based on your answer I assume then that you aren't aware of a law that prevents him from keeping an eye on a burglar for when cops arrive so that he doesn't "get away". Good, because I wasn't either, and was shocked that one might exist.

 

[Risky Thicket]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

The dispatcher is sitting there typing at the same time.
It isn't a report they later write-up like an Officer does.
Any lag is minimal.

Try again.
You can hear the dispatcher typing during the call.
Do you also see the seconds on the report? That is computer generated time as it was typed in. Not user generated approx. times.
Any lag is minimal.
Look at the time the call came in.
Then follow along with the 911 call.


00:39 Description ends

entered into computer 19:11:17​

02:19 Running towards back entrance

entered into computer 19:11:59​

03:43 Agrees to meet by mail boxes

entered into computer 19:13:12​

03:52 req. call before meet

entered into computer 19:13:41​

There is very little lag time, the largest amount being at the beginning, with the rest not being enough to make a difference.

Zimmerman was still on the horn with the dispatcher when she was trying to get a hold of Trayvon for a second time.
That is if Trayvon's call logs are accurate.

For clarification 911 centers are not law enforcement, not law enforcement directed and not funded with or through law enforcement. People who answer 911 calls are 911 operators, not dispatchers. I point out the distinction for a couple of reasons. They are not police and they have no authority to direct a caller to get back in the truck, as it were.

All calls to 911 centers are recorded. When I lived in Florida the calls were kept for 90 days. There were a few concerns that came up while I was living in Florida relating to the length of time the recorded calls were kept. I am not certain, but the calls are kept at least now for 6 months. No matter, in regard to OP the calls would have already been flagged at the 911 Center and will be kept indefinitely. The recording will provide the exact time of the calls, irrespective of what the 911 Operator may have entered.

 

[Grim17]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

Apparently he's never heard of "citizen's arrest".

 

[Excon]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

For clarification 911 centers are not law enforcement, not law enforcement directed and not funded with or through law enforcement. People who answer 911 calls are 911 operators, not dispatchers. I point out the distinction for a couple of reasons. They are not police and they have no authority to direct a caller to get back in the truck, as it were.

All calls to 911 centers are recorded. When I lived in Florida the calls were kept for 90 days. There were a few concerns that came up while I was living in Florida relating to the length of time the recorded calls were kept. I am not certain, but the calls are kept at least now for 6 months. No matter, in regard to OP the calls would have already been flagged at the 911 Center and will be kept indefinitely. The recording will provide the exact time of the calls, irrespective of what the 911 Operator may have entered.

I don't know where you have been.
From day one, I was calling them an operator until the following statement clarified it.

Lee, the police chief, said in a statement that the police dispatcher's "suggestion" to Zimmerman that he did not need to follow Martin "is not a lawful order that Mr. Zimmermann would be required to follow."

"Mr. Zimmerman's statement was that he had lost sight of Trayvon and was returning to his truck to meet the police officer when he says he was attacked by Trayvon," Lee said.
'Stand Your Ground Law' at center of Fla. shooting - Yahoo! News​

 

[Kal'Stang]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

Beats me.
Maybe they did contact her and she told them the following the first time, but only later changed her story.

"Next thing I hear is somebody pushing, and somebody pushed Trayvon because the head set just fell.
I called him again, and he didn't answer the phone."
Trayvon Martin Arrest Now After ABC Reveals Crucial Phone Call - ABC News​

OMG. She was talking to him, lost contact, and tried to call him again but he didn't answer.


The article provided the following image to verify that what she said about being on the phone with Trayvon is accurate.

02/26/2012 07:04 PM Incoming

(First conversation)​

02/26/2012 07:12 PM Incoming

("I called him again, and he didn't answer the phone.")​

No further incoming calls fore that evening are listed.


Hey! Wait a ding dang minute.
Apparently Zimmerman was still on the phone with the Dispatcher when she says she tried to call Trayvon again and received no answer.

02/26/2012 07:13 PM Zimmerman requests LEO call before meeting.
(Hi-lighted on image in Red.)

"02/26/2012     19:13:41     COMPL NOW REQ LEO 1045 BEFORE 1056"

Well now isn't this interesting....do you have a link for that second image there? If so and this is accurate then it totally blows Martins girlfriends story out of the water. As in she lied. And if she told the police what she has claimed (at least in the news) she could be charged with interfering with a criminal investigation.

 

[Excon]

Re: Trayvon Martin: ABC enhances George Zimmerman video .... "Pair of Gashes or Welts

do you have a link for that second image there?

It was originally provided by Simon W. Moon on 3/28 in the following post:
http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...in-attacked-zimmerman-164.html#post1060339289
Others also provided the same later.

Unfortunately the link that was provided in the post doesn't work anymore.
http://www.sanfordfl.gov/investigation/docs/911CallHistory.pdf