I see that...I really do...and it was hard for me to see that. I do now...in terms of understanding what you mean, if I agree or not..but at the same time I don't see how we invalidate reality...You're referring to the body, which again, doesn't relate automatically to the self. Even with a full SRS, no one is denying that the body is originally male or female (intersex conditions aside). The current language is drifting towards sex being the body and gender being the self. Transgenders are not changing their genders, but are recognizing that their gender doesn't conform to their sex, or physical body, in the same manner that the majority has their sex and gender match.
That is simple not true...But we are at the cusp of facism...Let us ar least in this Forum fight against it..Hormone blockers are only given for a few months to 2 years with estrogen, and then they have gender surgery.
Who told you that they are taken for longer? They are only given for a short time to suppress the natal hormones and they stop at surgery because they are not needed.That is simple not true...But we are at the cusp of facism...Let us ar least in this Forum fight against it..
Honestly i know from med Experts and commom sense that if you mess with a young Persons Hormons it is obviously hard to reverse it later on obviously...Who told you that they are taken for longer? They are only given for a short time to suppress the natal hormones and they stop at surgery because they are not needed.
But again none of that really matters...We live in a Time where adherence to ideology matters more...This harted has to endI have lost several relatives in war...this infighting should not contiue this way...I recognise this is a Contentious issue...I agree...BUT if we keep this hatred up... it seems quite Dark ... yes Contentious debate is wonderful..
Just Not such hatred
I know it Sounds like the dumbest clishe....Bur I really think that this hatred has to end...before ANYTHING elseBut again none of that really matters...We live in a Time where adherence to ideology matters more...This harted has to end
And by anything else i mean any other topicI know it Sounds like the dumbest clishe....Bur I really think that this hatred has to end...before ANYTHING else
Thank you for a concise summary which is close to my point(s). A 5 or 6 letter acronym for the labels those without positive experience (or no relevant experience at all) is stepwise, but in the real world of the actual participants in these 'communities' it is more like a probability distribution, with each letter concentrated around each peak. Some experience the spectrum of experiences (oops, almost wrote mental and physical again) as dynamic - like riding a rollercoaster - and some not, one labeled activity merging with others, or barely approaching them at all.I think the problem is that too many people are trying to blend too many factors into a single label. My sexual orientation is separate from my sexual/gender identity, as well as separate from my BDSM role, among a number of other factors. While we can look at trends, and see certain combinations come up often, such as being cis-gendered, heterosexual, right handed, we must never assume that variants are detrimental to the overall species.
A trans female is not a male and never was a male
Yes that's a woman and that's a guy. it doesn't matter that they change their physical appearance. That does not change their sex.It is only one of many determinative attributes. Our gender is more complicated than you or your argument wants to admit.
Transmen are born female, so are they women or men?
According to you, this is a woman,
You are also claiming that this is a guy.
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You're referring to the body, which again, doesn't relate automatically to the self. Even with a full SRS, no one is denying that the body is originally male or female (intersex conditions aside). The current language is drifting towards sex being the body and gender being the self. Transgenders are not changing their genders, but are recognizing that their gender doesn't conform to their sex, or physical body, in the same manner that the majority has their sex and gender match.
? No male can become a female and no female can become a male. That is scientific.The science simply doesnt back up your preschool understanding of gender and sex
True.Yes that's a woman and that's a guy.
It causes quite a bit of confusion — hence it shouldn't be done.it doesn't matter that they change their physical appearance.
True.That does not change their sex
True, but the definition of sex as per Merriam & Webster is "the sum of the structural, functional, and sometimes behavioral characteristics of organisms that distinguish males and females" and the "sum" with most transganders is that they are of the sex they were born as.Our outwards physical bodies are only part of the equation and are not determinative on their own.
It's a real issue.
Irrelevant. They were/are of the same sex.From a practical point, back in the 50s and 60s, black women using white women's toilets and changing rooms made many white women uncomfortable.
But we know much more about the sexual organs.We are complicated beings and have no idea how the brain actually works
That is putting words into my mouth. Nothing I have wrote has actually touched upon GD. In fact GD is not limited to transgenders. That said, trans people like Rose of Dawn, are more than likely working off the older definitions of the words, and by that standard, I can agree that she is not a woman. But that standard is quickly fading. Transgender people do not have a choice in being who and what they are. It doesn't mean that they will get GD, but it doesn't change the fact that they are transgendered. They may not even feel a need to do any kind of transitioning. What they do is a choice. Being transgendered is not a choice. But with that also comes discovery and self truth. As noted GD does not only stem from transgenderism, so if GD is present, the individual needs to ensure what the source is. Furthermore, if they are indeed transgendered, they have to determine what their gender actually is. Maybe they are more gender fluid, not really a man or a woman, but some blend of each. That also could be part of Rose's assertion that she is not a woman.
Heavyweight for men is 200#+ while for women it's 175#+. Basically what you are claiming is that there is no women who can match men for the weight class. For my example, I am first going to acknowledge the skill of boxing. A skilled welterweight boxer of 10 years experience, can easily whoop a heavyweight qualified non boxer anyday. So for this example, since we are talking about men vs women in boxing, we have to make an assumption of equal skill, or as equal as it ever gets in a ring. I would say that Nataliya Kuznetsova, assuming equal skill in boxing, would be more than a match for Anthony Joshua. I am not making any claims that there would be a large number of women who could reach to that standard, but if Nataliya wanted to box against men, I have no doubt that she could hold her own, skill level accounted for.
They can do what they wish.It causes quite a bit of confusion — hence it shouldn't be done.
They should do what is right.They can do what they wish.
Right for whom?They should do what is right.
For themRight for whom?
Meaningfulness is subjective. And given that we are developing language to accommodate more than one gender, the closer reality is that the meaning of the terms "man" and "woman" are no longer so broad.
Part of the problem arises from our predecessors insisting that X, Y, and Z characteristics can only be male or female or man or woman. For example, right now high heels is only a woman's fashion, despite the fact that when first invented, they were a men's only fashion. Furthermore, there is the insistence that certain physical looks must belong to one or the other. There are plenty of males, who identify as men, who look what we currently call feminine. And the same for female women looking "masculine". These assignments are completely arbitrary and artificial.
But let me ask you this question. Outside of the sex bit that you enjoy having when screwing or other similar activities, what significance is it which word applies to whom? How important is it actually that either "man" or "woman" is applied to a given individual? Outside of medical, how important is "male" or "female" as a label to a given individual?
Nope. Women can become men and men can become women. There are many who have completed the transition. You need to provide scientific studies.? No male can become a female and no female can become a male. That is scientific.
I shall be the decider of what is right!!!!! LolThey should do what is right.
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