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The war on Christmas

Donkey1499 said:
Did I say what, exactly, your agenda WAS? No. All I said was that EVERYONE has an agenda.
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No, as usual you make claims that you can't, or won't back up. You said: "But YOU don't want it to be a free speech issue because it doesn't fit YOUR agenda." Here, try something new. Instead of emotional outbursts, try using facts in a debate. You were trying to imply something and backed off when I challenged you. If you don't believe me ask around.
 
I had to sing Jewish songs in school, and there was not one single Jewish person in my class. We also had to sing 'Silent Night' and others, and we also had to read Greek Mythology. I equate these, because I am an atheist, and I feel like I am in a position to be a little more neutral to other religions (there are more than one). I will celebrate Christmas this year, with my children, who believe that Santa is coming with presents. We have a tree, and lights on our house, but we are not recognizing a god here. It is an American holiday (every element other than the birth of Jesus comes from other cultures), and we enjoy it. I do not agree personally with gov. sponsored with nativities or menorahs, but I do think Christmas is something we should all be able to agree on. Fundamentalists may want to ruin it for some, but I would hope we could at least call a truce on this one instead of being so divisive.
 
independent_thinker2002 said:
No, as usual you make claims that you can't, or won't back up. You said: "But YOU don't want it to be a free speech issue because it doesn't fit YOUR agenda." Here, try something new. Instead of emotional outbursts, try using facts in a debate. You were trying to imply something and backed off when I challenged you. If you don't believe me ask around.
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I backed off cuz I knew I was going over the edge alittle. What do you want? An apology?
 
headforspace said:
I had to sing Jewish songs in school, and there was not one single Jewish person in my class. We also had to sing 'Silent Night' and others, and we also had to read Greek Mythology. I equate these, because I am an atheist, and I feel like I am in a position to be a little more neutral to other religions (there are more than one). I will celebrate Christmas this year, with my children, who believe that Santa is coming with presents. We have a tree, and lights on our house, but we are not recognizing a god here. It is an American holiday (every element other than the birth of Jesus comes from other cultures), and we enjoy it. I do not agree personally with gov. sponsored with nativities or menorahs, but I do think Christmas is something we should all be able to agree on. Fundamentalists may want to ruin it for some, but I would hope we could at least call a truce on this one instead of being so divisive.
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So.....I don't get it.....
Your saying we should all celebrate Christmas?
 
headforspace said:
I had to sing Jewish songs in school, and there was not one single Jewish person in my class. We also had to sing 'Silent Night' and others, and we also had to read Greek Mythology. I equate these, because I am an atheist, and I feel like I am in a position to be a little more neutral to other religions (there are more than one). I will celebrate Christmas this year, with my children, who believe that Santa is coming with presents. We have a tree, and lights on our house, but we are not recognizing a god here. It is an American holiday (every element other than the birth of Jesus comes from other cultures), and we enjoy it. I do not agree personally with gov. sponsored with nativities or menorahs, but I do think Christmas is something we should all be able to agree on. Fundamentalists may want to ruin it for some, but I would hope we could at least call a truce on this one instead of being so divisive.
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You're that breed of atheist that has some smarts in their skull. And I'm glad you celebrate Christmas, not that you have to.
 
Donkey1499 said:
I backed off cuz I knew I was going over the edge alittle. What do you want? An apology?
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Don't apologize if you don't feel you need to. How about you buy me something nice for Christmas. lol. Merry Christmas!!!
 
Have a Happy St. Nicholas Day!
Happy Kris Kringle Day!
Happy December 25th!
Happy Santa Day!
 
headforspace said:
I had to sing Jewish songs in school, and there was not one single Jewish person in my class. We also had to sing 'Silent Night' and others, and we also had to read Greek Mythology. I equate these, because I am an atheist, and I feel like I am in a position to be a little more neutral to other religions (there are more than one). I will celebrate Christmas this year, with my children, who believe that Santa is coming with presents. We have a tree, and lights on our house, but we are not recognizing a god here. It is an American holiday (every element other than the birth of Jesus comes from other cultures), and we enjoy it. I do not agree personally with gov. sponsored with nativities or menorahs, but I do think Christmas is something we should all be able to agree on. Fundamentalists may want to ruin it for some, but I would hope we could at least call a truce on this one instead of being so divisive.
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Bravo. I celebrate Christmas, but not as a religious holiday...it has never been about religion in my house. It has always been about being with family. I said something in a previous post about how everything about Christmas is borrowed from other celebrations aside from Jesus, and many people in this day and age, including so called Christians, forget the Jesus aspect, possibly because he wasn't the main purpose for the holiday to begin with, it was about the church trying to compete with the pagan celebrations for Yule and the Winter Solstice.
 
Caine said:
Have a Happy St. Nicholas Day!
Happy Kris Kringle Day!
Happy December 25th!
Happy Santa Day!
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Hey, you forgot Happy December! :2razz:
 
independent_thinker2002 said:
Don't apologize if you don't feel you need to. How about you buy me something nice for Christmas. lol. Merry Christmas!!!
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I admitted that I "went over the edge a little". Is that not a good enough apology?

How about I get you "The War on Christmas" by John Gibson for ya? Would you even read it, or use it as toilet paper? lol
 
Stace said:
Bravo. I celebrate Christmas, but not as a religious holiday...it has never been about religion in my house. It has always been about being with family. I said something in a previous post about how everything about Christmas is borrowed from other celebrations aside from Jesus, and many people in this day and age, including so called Christians, forget the Jesus aspect, possibly because he wasn't the main purpose for the holiday to begin with, it was about the church trying to compete with the pagan celebrations for Yule and the Winter Solstice.
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CHRISTmas. I celebrate the religious and no-religious parts of christmas. And I still go to church year round, unlike the hypocrites who only go on Christmas and Easter. But then again, I don't represent all Christians either.
 
I celebrate christmas, the commercial holiday. The funny thing is that my in-laws used to be C-E christians(i don't think that they even go those days now). But they are all upset because fox news told them to be upset. they would seriously jump off of a cliff if fox news told them to.
 
Donkey1499 said:
I admitted that I "went over the edge a little". Is that not a good enough apology?

How about I get you "The War on Christmas" by John Gibson for ya? Would you even read it, or use it as toilet paper? lol
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Haha, I know this post wasn't directed at me, but funnily enough, I just bought that book. I also bought "How the Republicans Stole Christmas" so that I could be well versed on perspectives from both sides.

I've flipped through a few pages of "The War On Christmas", and I'm finding it absolutely hilarious, actually.
 
independent_thinker2002 said:
I celebrate christmas, the commercial holiday. The funny thing is that my in-laws used to be C-E christians(i don't think that they even go those days now). But they are all upset because fox news told them to be upset. they would seriously jump off of a cliff if fox news told them to.
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Jump off a cliff? Now I'm a fan of Fox News, but jumping off of a cliff is not my idea of watching a network. Nor should you even worship a network like that. Get your relatives some help. lol
 
Stace said:
Haha, I know this post wasn't directed at me, but funnily enough, I just bought that book. I also bought "How the Republicans Stole Christmas" so that I could be well versed on perspectives from both sides.

I've flipped through a few pages of "The War On Christmas", and I'm finding it absolutely hilarious, actually.
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You say "flipped", but have you actually "read" it? Don't judge a book until you've read it cover to cover. Actually, read the last chapter first, so if you should die before you finish it, at least you'll know how it ended. lol
 
Donkey1499 said:
CHRISTmas. I celebrate the religious and no-religious parts of christmas. And I still go to church year round, unlike the hypocrites who only go on Christmas and Easter. But then again, I don't represent all Christians either.
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Yeah, yeah, it's called Christmas, which translates into "Mass of Christ", I know that...but it was created to compete with the pagans, some literature suggests that Christ was actually born months before December or even months after...

But like I said, Christ is the only unique aspect to the holiday, and more and more people are about, as independent_thinker2002 said, the commerical aspects rather than the religious.
 
26 X World Champs said:
Wow! Here I was thinking that you were zealous about your views but still somewhat reasonable. Then I read this post that is a real slap in my face, as a Jewish American.

Do you realize how offensive your post is? You certainly are smart enough to know that majority has absolutely nothing to do with constitutionality of an issue, and especially this issue. I think it's complete and utter nonsense for anyone to whine that the government does not allow for religious symbolism on government property, regardless of which faith you profess.

I am offended that you think that placing a crucifix on a government building is OK, and that you're unable to recognize that it exclusive and that it shut's out millions and millions of Americans. How can you be so callous, or is it just selfishness? The "I want what I want when I want it" mentality that is so destructive in life in so many ways.

You want America to have race riots like Australia is now having? That is the result of excluding legitimate minority groups, it festers ill feelings that can mushroom into severe hate and violence.

So please, sir, do not shut me out of our country. Telling me that if I don't like having Christian symbolism I should move to China or wherever is KKK like talk, hate filled and devisive. Stop, please!
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You're Jewish, so you should know how important tradition, religion, and moral guidance is.......or maybe you just grew up in a sheltered America. I know how important these things are, and I respect them, even as a non-Christian, and someone who struggles with his own belief daily. I also know the importance of a disciplined society. You seem to think you know how the world/country would be without them, you're wrong. History has shown us what a Godless, hopeless, irresponsible society can lead to, and it's never been the utopia some of you claim it will be. I am defending a way of life that has done wonderful things for this country, made this country. This infant example of greatness, this world super power, this complete center of our universe, this didn't happen by accident.

This country has become what it is because of these great things, not despite them. To suggest we are moving backwards, that we are in danger of a theocracy, this is a slap in the face of our proud move away from these very things. Of course our founding fathers did not want a church to control our government, and they have seen to that, asthe system has worked brilliantly, for more then two hundred years. Now you heros, you brave liberals, you're here to save of us all from our religious masters. You could not be more wrong, you could not be more arrogant in your assumptions. This is why the war wages, you have two sides that want to push their morals on others, funny only one side will admit that fact.:roll:

As for your weak attempt to paint me is a hateful person, I won't even dignify that with a response. I will only to continue to bask in the success, and beauty that is this country's great diversity, and ALL the great facets that brings in to shaping this great land.
 
Donkey1499 said:
You say "flipped", but have you actually "read" it? Don't judge a book until you've read it cover to cover. Actually, read the last chapter first, so if you should die before you finish it, at least you'll know how it ended. lol
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Well, I just bought them tonight, so I haven't had a chance to read more than a few pages in either book. I'm still keeping an open mind about both, just saying that what I've read in "The War On Christmas" so far is funny.
 
At least there are a few more rationals than I thought......

Caine said:
So.....I don't get it.....
Your saying we should all celebrate Christmas?
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(I wouldnt' care what you do in your own home. I am not one of those.... oh I wouldn't mention who)
 
headforspace said:
At least there are a few more rationals than I thought......



(I wouldnt' care what you do in your own home. I am not one of those.... oh I wouldn't mention who)
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Im still confused... your not being very clear in your words.
 
Hey, here's a store that those of you on the "Merry Christmas" side of things don't have to boycott....apparently, Victoria's Secret is using phrases like Merry Christmas and Christmas presents in their stores and advertising.
 
We should nuke Christmas Now!

Some thoughts now on the subject. Sam Seder hosts the show "Majority Report" on Air America Radio. Bob Knight is the director of the Culture and Family Institute, it's affiliated with the Christian conservative organization, Concerned Women for America.

Gentleman, great to have you with me.

SAM SEDER, HOST, "MAJORITY REPORT": Thanks for having us on.

PHILLIPS: Let's start with the holiday card. What do you think, Sam?

SEDER: Listen, as far as the war on Christmas goes, I feel like we should be waging a war on Christmas. I mean, I believe that Christmas, it's almost proven that Christmas has nuclear weapons, can be an imminent threat to this country, that they have operative ties with terrorists and I believe that we should sacrifice thousands of American lives in pursuit of this war on Christmas. And hundreds of billions of dollars of taxpayer money.
PHILLIPS: Is it a war on Christmas, a war Christians, a war on over-political correctness or just a lot of people with way too much time on their hands?

SEDER: I would say probably, if I was to be serious about it, too much time on their hands, but I'd like to get back to the operational ties between Santa Claus and al Qaeda.
PHILLIPS: I don't think that exists. Bob? Help me out here.

SEDER: We have intelligence, we have intelligence.

PHILLIPS: You have intel. Where exactly does your intel come from?

SEDER: Well, we have tortured an elf and it's actually how we got the same information from Al Libbi. It's exactly the same way the Bush administration got this info about the operational ties between al Qaeda and Saddam.
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http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0512/12/lol.03.html
 
Caine said:
So, the government displaying a giant ass nativity scene and no other religious symbology isn't endorsing the christian religion?

Since your are such a Constitution expert, what exactly is the proper interpretation of the Establishment Clause in the 1st Amendment?
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At the last count there were.One Catholic church,between 15 and 20 Eastrn Orthodox churches and 27,000 diferent protestant churches.The establishmen clause refers to, " a state religion " many of the colonies had state religions when the Republic was created. .The constittion forbids the creation of a Nationnal church. Showing some regard for the religion of the majority of the population is not the same thing.Also much of the reason the United states was founded, was so people could openly practice their religions.Whether they were Quakers, Catholics, or fundamentalist protestants.
 
JOHNYJ said:
At the last count there were.One Catholic church,between 15 and 20 Eastrn Orthodox churches and 27,000 diferent protestant churches.The establishmen clause refers to, " a state religion " many of the colonies had state religions when the Republic was created. .The constittion forbids the creation of a Nationnal church. Showing some regard for the religion of the majority of the population is not the same thing.Also much of the reason the United states was founded, was so people could openly practice their religions.Whether they were Quakers, Catholics, or fundamentalist protestants.
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Exactly, and the only thing more difficult then turning this country in to a theocracy, would be getting all of these churches to decide on one united national church!:rofl
 
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