Tennessee GOP file resolutions to expel three Democrats who led gun reform chants on House floor

[Lovebug]

Why?
How about when during a SOTU address someone yells “You lied!”?

Or rips up a speech.

 

[upsideguy]

They’re big babies whose tiny brains can’t comprehend that being a legislator means YOU are responsible for crafting the legislation you want to see. That doesn’t mean hijacking the House with a bullhorn and torquing up a mob. Good riddance to them.

You mean like MTG.... does she know you are this disloyal?

 

[Lovebug]

Then it’s their obligation to craft the legislation they want to see not hijack the House and shriek through a bullhorn like petulant children.

The dead kids and adults deserve all attention they can get.

 

[Lovebug]

There is no constitutional right to hijack a Legislature.

Is there?

https://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/cruz-control-article-1.1467708

 

[poweRob]

I never moved the target. The target was established by me in post #93 where I said:

“So do the 3 soon to be ex lawmakers have legislation to put on the table or were they just screaming because no one else was doing the work for them?”

Deflecting to legislation that died in committee three years ago is a no.

How would anyone know what legislation they have to put on the table? But when it was stated that Bills that were on the table didn't include any gun stuff from them, you immediately lapped it up as proof of them not having any legislation to be brought up. Which is specifically what you asked for. You moved the goal posts when you felt like you got the answer you wanted. But do keep dancing. It's hilarious.

 

[Rucker61]

Doubtful. The obstructionist pukes on the other side of the aisle will leave them with similar options

Maybe the new ones will eschew bullhorns on the floor.

 

[poweRob]

HB 1292 failed in subcommittee in March of 2021. Since then she's introduced a bill of make it illegal for any child under the age of 12 to possess a firearm unless the person has the permission of the child's parent or guardian, the child is under the supervision of an adult, and the firearm was used for lawful sporting activity;

Johnson has been in office since 2018.

It seems her time would be better spent gathering support for the two bills she's sponsored than disrupting the proceedings of the Tennessee legislature.

You actually think there is any support she'd get from the republican supermajority? No... You know better.

 

[Rucker61]

You actually think there is any support she'd get from the republican supermajority? No... You know better.

Shouldn't she have, too? Especially now.

 

[trblmkr]

There's the key phrase, isn't it? It looks like someone had read Bruen and someone had not.

Bruen had to do with restrictions on concealed carry. I'm saying these kids are not only concerned, they are afraid. And the people who can do anything about it just throw up their hands and say there is nothing we can do. Hell, we won't even try. You kids need to get used to it.

 

[Rucker61]

Bruen had to do with restrictions on concealed carry. I'm saying these kids are not only concerned, they are afraid. And the people who can do anything about it just throw up their hands and say there is nothing we can do. Hell, we won't even try. You kids need to get used to it.

The Bruen decision was much more encompassing.

"While the Supreme Court’s Bruen decision lifted most state restrictions on the public carrying of weapons, it also did something much more significant. It changed the way in which courts must judge Second Amendment challenges to gun regulations and restrictions.

Before Bruen, most federal courts used a two-step framework for weighing the constitutionality of gun regulations. If historical evidence showed that the regulated conduct was outside the Second Amendment’s original scope, then the conduct or activity was not protected. But if text and history were unclear, then courts applied what is known as intermediate scrutiny to the regulation. The government, to prevail, had to show that the regulation was “substantially related to the achievement of an important governmental interest.”

This two-step process often resulted in gun regulations being upheld. In the Bruen majority opinion last summer, Justice Clarence Thomas rejected the two-step framework as “one step too many.”

Analysis: How a Supreme Court ruling led to the overturning of a guns and domestic violence law

All U.S. Supreme Court decisions have consequences but only a few jolt the legal system and the nation with immediate and long-term consequences.

www.pbs.org

"On June 23, 2022, the Supreme Court ruled for the first time that the Second Amendment confers a constitutional right to carry a gun outside the home. Bruen voided New York’s requirement that concealed carry permit applicants demonstrate “proper cause,” or a special need for self-defense. The decision also struck down “may-issue” permitting, which gave authorities the discretion to deny permits based on subjective criteria that go beyond basic requirements like a background check.

Most significantly, Bruen rewrote the methodology lower courts defer to when evaluating the constitutionality of a gun law, prescribing that it must have a well-established analogue in American history. Specifically, the 77-year span from 1791, when the Second Amendment was ratified, to 1868, when the 14th Amendment was ratified. Within this framework, judges can no longer consider the real-world effects of gun regulations, like violence reduction."

Tracking the Effects of the Supreme Court's Gun Ruling

The Bruen decision is reshaping gun laws across the U.S. — and propelling a series of court challenges to existing regulations.

www.thetrace.org

 

[trblmkr]

The Bruen decision was much more encompassing.

"While the Supreme Court’s Bruen decision lifted most state restrictions on the public carrying of weapons, it also did something much more significant. It changed the way in which courts must judge Second Amendment challenges to gun regulations and restrictions.

Before Bruen, most federal courts used a two-step framework for weighing the constitutionality of gun regulations. If historical evidence showed that the regulated conduct was outside the Second Amendment’s original scope, then the conduct or activity was not protected. But if text and history were unclear, then courts applied what is known as intermediate scrutiny to the regulation. The government, to prevail, had to show that the regulation was “substantially related to the achievement of an important governmental interest.”

This two-step process often resulted in gun regulations being upheld. In the Bruen majority opinion last summer, Justice Clarence Thomas rejected the two-step framework as “one step too many.”

Analysis: How a Supreme Court ruling led to the overturning of a guns and domestic violence law

All U.S. Supreme Court decisions have consequences but only a few jolt the legal system and the nation with immediate and long-term consequences.

www.pbs.org

"On June 23, 2022, the Supreme Court ruled for the first time that the Second Amendment confers a constitutional right to carry a gun outside the home. Bruen voided New York’s requirement that concealed carry permit applicants demonstrate “proper cause,” or a special need for self-defense. The decision also struck down “may-issue” permitting, which gave authorities the discretion to deny permits based on subjective criteria that go beyond basic requirements like a background check.

Most significantly, Bruen rewrote the methodology lower courts defer to when evaluating the constitutionality of a gun law, prescribing that it must have a well-established analogue in American history. Specifically, the 77-year span from 1791, when the Second Amendment was ratified, to 1868, when the 14th Amendment was ratified. Within this framework, judges can no longer consider the real-world effects of gun regulations, like violence reduction."

Tracking the Effects of the Supreme Court's Gun Ruling

The Bruen decision is reshaping gun laws across the U.S. — and propelling a series of court challenges to existing regulations.

www.thetrace.org

Yes, it removed the States abilities to do much, regardless of what the majority of the population of that State wanted. Where does it say to legislators that there is nothing we can do and we can't even try? Kids are going to die and we should get used to it?

 

[Napoleon]

You mean like MTG.... does she know you are this disloyal?

I couldn’t care less what MTG does with her time.

 

[Grizzly Adams]

It's pretty clear that talking nicely to conservatives about guns is going nowhere. The time for being nice is over.

Translation: they won't change their minds to do what I want so we have to make them do what I want.

The kids are in fear for their lives. The democrats are the only ones who care.

Typical "you won't do what I want you to do so you must want children TO DIE" bullshit.

Shovel it elsewhere.

 

[Rucker61]

Yes, it removed the States abilities to do much, regardless of what the majority of the population of that State wanted. Where does it say to legislators that there is nothing we can do and we can't even try? Kids are going to die and we should get used to it?

Do you support state legislators attempting to pass laws that are clearly unconstitutional? Is there truly a point in the Tennessee legislator to introduce a gun control bill that is guaranteed not to pass?

Should we allow government to ignore the Constitution, the Bill of Rights and SCOTUS?

Some ideas:
⦁ Allow individual access to NICS so that private sales can utilize the background check process. Sen Coburn sponsored a bill that would be very effective for this.
⦁ Arrest those who commit felonies while attempting to get guns. In 2010, 72,000 applicants were denied permission to purchase a firearm via the NICS and state systems. 34,000 of these were denied for previous felony convictions. Another 20,000 were denied for state and local prohibited status. Only 10 (10!) were convicted. We still have tens of thousands of people who committed a felony by lying on the Form 4473 and have a violent past free to find guns through illegal means. Given that a violent felon is looking for a gun, how many violent crimes could be prevented by arresting and incarcerating these felons? https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/bjs/grants/239272.pdf
⦁ Focus on the gun dealers and sellers who sell large amounts of guns to ineligible buyers. If the Brady Campaign knows who they are, then ATF knows who the major sellers are.
⦁ Mandatory sentences for those who use guns in acts of criminal violence. Stop plea bargaining away gun crimes. http://chicagoreporter.com/thousand...-being-dismissed-cook-county-criminal-courts/
⦁ Extend the legal possession geographies for CCW holders.
⦁ Fully prosecute and punish straw purchasers. http://www.omaha.com/news/crime/pol...cle_dcd60ace-8716-5651-9125-cb297998694e.html

My suggestion to reduce mass shootings like active shooter and domestic violence looks at three actions: prevention, isolation, intervention.

Prevention is the process to reduce the chance that a shooter will have a firearm in the first place. It's easier for DV than for active shooters, as the Lautenberg Amendment can be used to disarm anyone convicted of domestic violence or with a personal protective order sworn against them preemptively or actively. For Lautenberg to be effective, we need to educate potential victims, their legal support and local law enforcement. Potential active shooters don't have that history and with HIPAA restrictions find it easier to pass background checks. Prevention against rampage shooters is much less effective.

Isolation is the action of keeping a shooter separated from his victims. For DV, removal of the family to a safe house is the primary tool, unless the DV offender commits another crime or is caught violating a PPO before any homicide attempts occur, when he can be arrested. For active shooters, limiting access to schools or other targeted areas via channelized entry, metal detectors and similar passive measures are the first step. Being able to effectively lock down classrooms and other sub-geographies is also necessary.


Sometimes none of these work, or the area under attack isn't conducive to isolation, and that's where intervention is important. The FBI teaches Run, Hide, Fight when thrust into an active shooter situation, and data shows that the best way to fight is with a firearm. The current strategy of limiting ammunition magazine capacity to force reloads where the shooter can be physically restrained is untenable and hasn't been shown to be effective as an active response with a firearm. It suffers from fatal flaws: that the pool of potential victims includes someone that is brave enough to physically attack the shooter, that the brave person isn't among the first shot, that he or she is lucky enough to be in a close enough position during a reload and that he or she is physically capable of restraining a shooter. The biggest flaw, however, is that this tactic requires at least 10 shots to be fired with up to ten dead victims before there is a chance to stop the shooter. We've seen with both the Uber driver and Philly barbershop that CCW holders are not so restrained and can act quickly and effectively enough to stop a shooter with no innocent lives lost.

 

[Fearandloathing]

Republicans absolute hate democracy. They filed for expulsion of 3 state house dems because they dare to voice out against their beloved guns. Merely disagree politically, and get thrown out. For Tennessee republicans, guns come before students and now before democracy. This is what fascism looks like.

MSN

​

Tennessee House Republicans on Monday filed resolutions to expel three Democrats for "disorderly behavior" after the trio led protest chants for gun reform on the floor of the chamber last week in the wake of the deadly Covenant School shooting.​

​

The official expulsion resolutions state the trio "did knowingly and intentionally bring disorder and dishonor to the House of Representatives through their individual and collective actions."​

​

Lawmakers have not yet voted for expulsion. Once the House votes on the resolution, it is expected to trigger an expulsion process that would give the trio a chance to defend themselves at another floor session before a final expulsion vote.​

"I may not agree with what a man says, but I will fight to the death his right to say it!"

Words that put a war in progress in 1776!


But now resonate off bare walls of constructed hate.

If Donald Trump is actually and legally elected in 2024 it will be the end of the Republic. Ben was right...."a republic, if you can keep it" and you couldn't and didn't.

The United States is NOT the birthplace of democracy, it is its graveyard.

 

[trblmkr]

No, I don't suggesting wasting time on passing unconstitutional laws. I advocate trying to do something other than say we can't do anything. That is just weak management.

Some ideas:
⦁ Allow individual access to NICS so that private sales can utilize the background check process. Sen Coburn sponsored a bill that would be very effective for this.
Absolutely, and increase the time limit to accomplish to at at least 10 days.
⦁ Arrest those who commit felonies while attempting to get guns. In 2010, 72,000 applicants were denied permission to purchase a firearm via the NICS and state systems. 34,000 of these were denied for previous felony convictions. Another 20,000 were denied for state and local prohibited status. Only 10 (10!) were convicted. We still have tens of thousands of people who committed a felony by lying on the Form 4473 and have a violent past free to find guns through illegal means. Given that a violent felon is looking for a gun, how many violent crimes could be prevented by arresting and incarcerating these felons? https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/bjs/grants/239272.pdf
I also agree. Not only this but remove the ability of DA's to plead down gun crimes to get quick convictions and avoid trials. 5 years when in possession during commission of a crime, 10 years for discharge, 15 for shooting someone and +20 for a death.
⦁ Focus on the gun dealers and sellers who sell large amounts of guns to ineligible buyers. If the Brady Campaign knows who they are, then ATF knows who the major sellers are.
Recent data shows that nationwide, the largest source of guns used in crimes are traced back to GA. A gun shop in GA was recently in the news (with MTG on hand) for a several day review by ATF. This is a very large volume shop and coincidentally is the number one source for guns used in crimes in the state of GA.
⦁ Mandatory sentences for those who use guns in acts of criminal violence. Stop plea bargaining away gun crimes. http://chicagoreporter.com/thousand...-being-dismissed-cook-county-criminal-courts/
Strongly Agree, discussed above.
⦁ Extend the legal possession geographies for CCW holders.
I can agree if there is some sort of permitting, training requirements.
⦁ Fully prosecute and punish straw purchasers. http://www.omaha.com/news/crime/pol...cle_dcd60ace-8716-5651-9125-cb297998694e.html
Hell yes.
My suggestion to reduce mass shootings like active shooter and domestic violence looks at three actions: prevention, isolation, intervention.

 

[Ahlevah]

Republicans absolute hate democracy. They filed for expulsion of 3 state house dems because they dare to voice out against their beloved guns. Merely disagree politically, and get thrown out. For Tennessee republicans, guns come before students and now before democracy. This is what fascism looks like.

MSN

​

Tennessee House Republicans on Monday filed resolutions to expel three Democrats for "disorderly behavior" after the trio led protest chants for gun reform on the floor of the chamber last week in the wake of the deadly Covenant School shooting.​

​

The official expulsion resolutions state the trio "did knowingly and intentionally bring disorder and dishonor to the House of Representatives through their individual and collective actions."​

​

Lawmakers have not yet voted for expulsion. Once the House votes on the resolution, it is expected to trigger an expulsion process that would give the trio a chance to defend themselves at another floor session before a final expulsion vote.​

“Democracy”? Is that what Democrats are now calling inciting mob rule? It’s no longer “insurrection”?

 

[JasperL]

“Democracy”? Is that what Democrats are now calling inciting mob rule? It’s no longer “insurrection”?

Right, cause these are the same. Look at that MOB!!!!

Just a friendly tour of the Capitol!! MAGA!!!

 

[Ahlevah]

Right, cause these are the same. Look at that MOB!!!!

Just a friendly tour of the Capitol!! MAGA!!!

Hey, if “democracy” is grabbing Chuck Schumer’s microphone and kicking him off his podium I’m all for it. They can tar and feather him, too as long as it’s “peaceful.”

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Who gives a shit? It's not like they broke in the building smashing windows, shitting on the floor to violently try and kill the president of the senate. They opposed Tennessee GOP doing NOTHING about guns. That is all.

Why are you supporting insurrection?

A party which runs for and wins elections on a promise to protect gun rights is not obligated to vote for any policy which their constituents don’t want. The democrats have no right to engage in insurrection for this

 

[poweRob]

“Democracy”? Is that what Democrats are now calling inciting mob rule? It’s no longer “insurrection”?

The only thing that got broken in this was maybe a nail and magats will say, "SEE IT'S DA SAME TING AS 1/6!"

 

[Slartibartfast]

The only thing that got broken in this was maybe a nail and magats will say, "SEE IT'S DA SAME TING AS 1/6!"

Yup, and the normal people will once again see through that false equivalence.

 

[CaughtInThe]

I keep reading tweets by Dolly Parton's sister. She's been irate at Republicans in Tennessee, where they both live, for ages.

And I think, ever so slowly, sane people like Dolly Parton are inching closer to doing things that Republicans there are not going to like. She just has to figure out the legal way to do those things and also not hurt her own community.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Very stupid move Tennessee GOP, but that's their usual MO.

I would hope that the vote in this regard goes the other way, but it's Tennessee, so I'm not holding my breath.

Only 27 more "Democrats" (whatever that means) and the "Republicans" (whatever that means) will have freed Tennessee of the insidious left-wing, socialist, commie, liberal, pinko, plague that has invested its government - right?

 

[D_NATURED]

As a moderate, I'm concerned about the lack of civility on both sides. Our form of government is supposed to be above this sort of shit. Somehow, there is a pervasive lie alive on both sides of the aisle that presumes if you're certain you're right, you can do whatever it takes in support of your pet cause. We've somehow arrived at a place where civil processes and civil disobedience needn't be civil.

Americans should spend more time thinking than shouting at each other. But, shouting is the norm. I mourn the loss of statemanship in American politics. Rational arguments are equally poisoned by the right's silly faith-based politics and by the left's protest culture. In both cases, conversation is impossible.

How can violence NOT result when we're no longer willing to debate, just use our power to remove or drown out the opposition. They all disgust me.