Soldiers still waiting for armor reimbursements

[Canuck]

Hardy a valid comparison.

What's so wrong with sending your troops out with good protection? If you have the capability of doing so, it only helps to protect them, moral, and your training investment in the individual soldier. None of this is bad.


nothing wrong with it
why is it not happening is my question
mommy and daddy ought to not support a war if they really care about jr's batte scars

 

[MSgt]

If boots aren't standard equipment for a soldier, what are? Nail clippers? Button kits? :doh

Nope. Marines are issued two pairs of boots in Boot Camp. After that they buy replacements out of their clothing alllowences. I, because of my rank, receive $300-$340 a year. When major deployments occur such as MEU's and war...there is what is called CTAP. CTAP is specialty gear, where two extra pairs of cammies, a pair of boots (sometimes), and other desert or jungle type gear is given. Between deployments, Marines are expected to pay for their own uniform items. In the last couple of years, we have been receiving a plethora of gear, so CTAP has become a thing of the past. While in Iraq my second time, I received two free pair of cammies to replace my blood stained cammies and a pair of boots that I didn't need. Our armories are now carrying tactical three-point slings and thigh holsters. Before, we have always bought them on our own, because the crap that we did have was vietnam vintage.

-Nail clippers are a part of hygiene gear and it is a paycheck issue.
-We are required to maintain a sewing kit to repair our gear and field uniforms, but this too is a paycheck issue.:doh :doh :doh

I'll attempt to go off of the top of my head.......

Basic combat supply issue:

-MOLLE Pack (We have improved from the ALICE Pack. Vietnam is gone and the version of MOLLE used in Afghanistan had to be improved because it was too weak for the mission)
-LBV (We have improved from the 'H' Harness. Vietnman is gone)
-Two canteens
-Two canteen holders
-First Aid Kit (We have imporoved one's now. Vietnam is gone)
-Two magazine pouches
-Camel Back
-Sleeping System (We have improved from the Sleeping bag. Vietnam is gone)
-ISOMAT
-Knit Cap (We have improved from the old Knit Cap. Vietnam is gone)
-Cold Weather gear (We have improved from the Field Jacket. Vietnam is gone)
-Two pairs of Poly Pro Underwear (We have improved from the old cold weather wool underwear.)
-Kevlar (We have improved to a better and lighter material. The Gulf War is gone.)
- Flak Jacket (We have improved form the old style. Vietnam is gone)
- Armor (New technology that is only issued to units that are war bound.)
-Butt Pack (Improved. Vietnman is gone)


Basic combat Armory issue

-M16A2 or M16A4 or M4 (6 magazines, cleanig gear, single or 3 point sling, BFA, and improved bayonet.)

or
-M9 or Glock (2 magazines, lanyard, cleaning gear, side holster or thigh holster, and improved K-bar.)

OR BOTH!

If some of this gear is trash (never the weapons), since Marines have used it before us, we buy better gear. If issued a single sling, we buy a 3 point sling, however, armories are carrying these now. Same goes for the type of holster we get. I own my own gear. I bought is years before the huge push to get better gear in the military.

Incidentally, the gear in "BOLD" is gear that has been improved and we have been gettting since late 2002. This is basic issue. There is a surmountable more improvements in gear across the board in other areas.

 

[MSgt]

nothing wrong with it
why is it not happening is my question
mommy and daddy ought to not support a war if they really care about jr's batte scars

Learn the issues before puking up your criticisms. That is all you do right?

 

[Canuck]

Learn the issues before puking up your criticisms. That is all you do right?

criticism is not all I do
I love alot of americans
I like to think I am a good neighbor to america
only thing is where is america I dont see her today
it is all gone
the America i grew up with does not exist
the last vestiges left when you decided that preemptive war using depleted uranium bombs was a good idea
is that how America gets rid of the burnt fission material these days
while mom and pop buys jr armour little do they know he will need a rad suit because of all the uranium fallout

 

[MSgt]

criticism is not all I do
I love alot of americans
I like to think I am a good neighbor to america
only thing is where is america I dont see her today
it is all gone
the America i grew up with does not exist
the last vestiges left when you decided that preemptive war using depleted uranium bombs was a good idea
is that how America gets rid of the burnt fission material these days
while mom and pop buys jr armour little do they know he will need a rad suit because of all the uranium fallout

Unlike all of those evil wars in the past where we used carpet bombing, nukes, and gas....right? Give me a break. America's not different, you are. You grew up and realized that freedoms and securities come at a price and you don't like it.

 

[cnredd]

Unlike all of those evil wars in the past where we used carpet bombing, nukes, and gas....right? Give me a break. America's not different, you are. You grew up and realized that freedoms and securities come at a price and you don't like it.

Don't you just love it when they say "I love America...

Now let me break down, in minute detail, everything wrong with America"...:roll:

 

[MSgt]

Don't you just love it when they say "I love America...

Now let me break down, in minute detail, everything wrong with America"...:roll:

HAHAHAHA.

Same goes for "this war is wrong and evil...we are the real terrorists....our military are a bunch of thugs who torture their prisoners...Bush is like hitler.....there is no Islamic threat....it's all lies.....where's the WMD's?...."soldiers" die for nothing...you are all tools for corporations...............

Oh yeah...uh..."Support the troop".

 

[cnredd]

HAHAHAHA.

Same goes for "this war is wrong and evil...we are the real terrorists....our military are a bunch of thugs who torture their prisoners...Bush is like hitler.....there is no Islamic threat....it's all lies.....where's the WMD's?...."soldiers" die for nothing...you are all tools for corporations...............

Oh yeah...uh..."Support the troop".

I love this "connect the dots" game...can I play?

Personally, I blame those Conservative bastards on the Mayflower...If they weren't so gung-ho about having religious freedoms, Donald Rumsfeld never would have shaken Saddam's hand in 1983...Damn Plymouth Rock terrorists...:2wave:

 

[MSgt]

I love this "connect the dots" game...can I play?

Personally, I blame those Conservative bastards on the Mayflower...If they weren't so gung-ho about having religious freedoms, Donald Rumsfeld never would have shaken Saddam's hand in 1983...Damn Plymouth Rock terrorists...:2wave:

It's fun, huh. We can pretty much blame anything on anybody.

 

[cnredd]

It's fun, huh. We can pretty much blame anything on anybody.

Remember the stock market crash of 1929?....

OH yeah...Bush's fault...:roll:

 

[cnredd]

Most people think Angelina Jolie caused Brad and Jennifer's breakup....Nope...

Vast right-wing conspiracy...

 

[Napoleon's Nightingale]

You think this is a Bush problem? Of course there was left over garbage from the 90's. Ripped NBC suits was not a Marine Corps problem and it only affected units that were in trail behind the combatants. It was not a problem. It's amazing how you people care now that you can use it to bash who wasn't responsible, but has been fixing it in leaps and bounds. None of you cared during the 90's when we were sucken up Al-Queda attacks with crappy gear.

Of course you ignored the part in which I said that Bush shouldn't be held accountable for the pentagons misgivings prior to his first inaguration. Just fyi the Marine Corps doesn't constitute all of the armed forces and the Marine Corps isn't the only division fighting in Iraq. It hasn't been fixed in "leaps and bounds" under Bush. Rumsfeld has even acknowledged as much..but I suppose you're going to refute him too because you have a military desk job and you know better than him right?

The National Guard are not military.

Technically they are.

Do you realize that you are talking to an individual who is a leader of large amounts of Marines and wears this gear you claim to know so much about?

You sit at a desk at an HQ somewhere all day yet you're claiming to know more about this than anyone else because you're in the military...kinda. Amusing.

 

[SKILMATIC]

Cnredd and gunny, you guys are hilarious. :lol:

And the unfortunate thing is all that which you said was true. Those were all arguments of the left.

 

[cnredd]

Cnredd and gunny, you guys are hilarious. :lol:

And the unfortunate thing is all that which you said was true. Those were all arguments of the left.

And meanwhile Saddam's character witness above your post still likes to sweat the small stuff...:shrug:

 

[MSgt]

Of course you ignored the part in which I said that Bush shouldn't be held accountable for the pentagons misgivings prior to his first inaguration. Just fyi the Marine Corps doesn't constitute all of the armed forces and the Marine Corps isn't the only division fighting in Iraq. It hasn't been fixed in "leaps and bounds" under Bush. Rumsfeld has even acknowledged as much..but I suppose you're going to refute him too because you have a military desk job and you know better than him right?



Technically they are.



You sit at a desk at an HQ somewhere all day yet you're claiming to know more about this than anyone else because you're in the military...kinda. Amusing.

I didn't ignore it. I dismissed it. He did what every Preident did since Vietnam. He cut corners by hurting the military. He has since made ammends. FYI...when you see the operations in the Al-Anbar Province (area between Syria and Baghdad) and the fighting on TV...those are the Marines. The majority of the fighting is being conducted by Marines. The majority of the IED victims are the Army.

HA! The National Guard are as much military as you are.

You know what's amusing? A college brat thinking he can look down on a Marine that has spent his entire 13 yr 6m career in the infantry except for the last 11 months that he has had a "desk job", because he has spent the last 4 years on constant deployments that involved wars, humanitarian missions, and joint training operations with foreign militaries. What's amusing is a kid who has a bad day when his hair doesn't comb over correctly talking to a guy who's bad days have consisted of IED blasts. Fire fights are nothing. At least you know that's coming. What's amusing is a kid who is trying to preach the ways of the military to a guy that was fighting Islamic extremists in Somalia when he was back home in Elementary School. Now that's amusing.

It's funny how Cheney is called a liar until you can use something that furthers your bashing. Cheney gets reports from the Armed Forces. The Army is notorious for crying about everything. In the Army, there is dissent at every level. Unproffesionalism is not something that is hard to find. The words "I can't" is used often. How many Marine Generals do you see on TV passing off what they "think" about situations? How many Generals from the Army get on TV and all have different opinions and act as "doom bringers" as they are paving the way for their political futures? You don't find it odd that there was an armor issue, and now the Army has presented a list of things that "soldiers" buy on their own as if the Government has screwed up and people like you lump all of that into our standard issues? They are not in "dire" straights as you think. You're a fool. Things have been fixed in leaps and bounds as I have stated. Who the **** are you to argue with me and say that they haven't, because you heard misleading and innaccurate reports?

UpArmor (bad for the vehicles)
Flaks
SAPPI Plates
M16A4
Bayonet
K-Bar
Knit Cap
WileyX Tactical Eyewear
First Aid Kit (FAC)
Kevlar
ACOG System
Thigh Holsters
3 Point Slings
Digital Cammies
Boots
PRR (Personal Roll Radios)

This is what the basic "soldier" has gotten under Bush. I haven't even touched any technical gear that has been upgraded. Stop being ignorant. You have a habit of desperately hanging on to every scrap of thread as if you are "all knowing." You have a lot of growing up to do.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Stop being ignorant.

Its WILLFUL ignorace, Gunny.
He doesnt WANT to know.

 

[Napoleon's Nightingale]

HA! The National Guard are as much military as you are.

Typical of a Marine to be so arrogant. Just because you're a Marine doesn't make you more qualified to take a life than anyone else on the planet.

What's amusing is a kid who is trying to preach the ways of the military to a guy that was fighting Islamic extremists in Somalia when he was back home in Elementary School. Now that's amusing.

So basically you're older than God. You're right..that is amusing.

It's funny how Cheney is called a liar until you can use something that furthers your bashing.

Cheney knows better than to toss around the biggest scare tactic of them all when it isn't prooven or factual in any way. There was no intelligence sudgesting that Saddam had or could develop nukes.

You're a fool. Things have been fixed in leaps and bounds as I have stated.

No you are the fool. The army was sent in with defective gas masks and chemical suits which have been known to be defective since the 90s. Sorry, I don't support telling the troops to patch a hole in a chemical suit with duct tape and I don't support giving them gas maks which were proven to be defective almost a decade ago. None of that 87 billion went to providing the troops with the equiptment they needed like it was supposed to.

 

[Ima Troll]

Pentagon fails to figure out how to pay back troops' personal expenditures
WASHINGTON - Nearly a year after Congress demanded action, the Pentagon has still failed to figure out a way to reimburse soldiers for body armor and equipment they purchased to better protect themselves while serving in Iraq.

Soldiers and their parents are still spending hundreds and sometimes thousands of dollars for armor they say the military won’t provide. One U.S. senator said Wednesday he will try again to force the Pentagon to obey the reimbursement law it opposed from the outset and has so far not implemented.

Sen. Christopher Dodd, D-Conn., said he will offer amendments to the defense appropriations bill working its way through Congress, to take the funding issue out of the hands of Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld and give control to military unit commanders in the field.

(continued at http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9524109/)

This sort of thing is shameful. They can pay Halliburton billions in "No-Bid" contracts and for work that isn't even getting done, but they make GI's and their families pay for body armor and all sorts of other stuff that is supposed to be provided for them by the military. Frickin' ridicules. "George Bush cares about the troops," what BS. How some people in the military and their families can continue to support that sham of a leader is beyond comprehension.

granted, soldiers had to pay for their own body armor, but did they at least get guns?

 

[MSgt]

Typical of a Marine to be so arrogant. Just because you're a Marine doesn't make you more qualified to take a life than anyone else on the planet.

No you are the fool. The army was sent in with defective gas masks and chemical suits which have been known to be defective since the 90s. Sorry, I don't support telling the troops to patch a hole in a chemical suit with duct tape and I don't support giving them gas maks which were proven to be defective almost a decade ago. None of that 87 billion went to providing the troops with the equiptment they needed like it was supposed to.

Sooo, we get to the heart of the matter. There is a lot of Ohio Marines. Perhaps one hurt you in some way? Because I am a Marine it gives me the priviledge of claiming the word "proffesional". When was the last times Marines were involved in a Abu-Graib scenario? This sort of behavior is reserved for civilians in uniform. And yes it does make me more qualified. I can do it quicker.

Yes the Army was sent in with outdated masks and poorly maintained suits. I have no sympathy for a branch of service that receives waaay more money than mine and can't upkeep it's equipment. I see you are resorting to true form and tactics by running in circles looking for the argument. Your true liberal calling is to lump as much BS into the "facts" of the matter to give it more weight. You're still the fool.

Where are you getting this 87 billion dollar dissapearance anyway?

On Sunday night, Mr. Bush told the nation that he will do what is necessary and spend what is necessary in Iraq and Afghanistan to win the war on terrorism. The bulk of his $87 billion request will be used for military operations, with the rest going to reconstruction projects.

http://www.iwar.org.uk/news-archive/2003/09-09-2.htm

 

[Napoleon's Nightingale]

Sooo, we get to the heart of the matter. There is a lot of Ohio Marines. Perhaps one hurt you in some way?

LOL no.

Because I am a Marine it gives me the priviledge of claiming the word "proffesional".

Riiiight...long live the cubicle eh? ROFL.

And yes it does make me more qualified. I can do it quicker.

LOL not really. Anyone can blow another persons head off with a gun.

Yes the Army was sent in with outdated masks and poorly maintained suits. I have no sympathy for a branch of service that receives waaay more money than mine and can't upkeep it's equipment.

The equiptment was proven to be defective in the 90s..the DOD reisued it. They weren't just outdated..they had holes in them and the masks never worked properly. You don't have a problem with the DOD issuing those to the troops?

On Sunday night, Mr. Bush told the nation that he will do what is necessary and spend what is necessary in Iraq and Afghanistan to win the war on terrorism.

Lol yeah I suppose that has been the goal of Bush. Bankrupt America and deprive us of our rights via the Patriot Act. Shrubola needs to take a hint from Thomas Jefferson.."Those who would trade safety for freedom deserve neither." and Benjamin Franklin "“Those who would sacrifice a little freedom for temporal safety deserve neither to be safe or free."

 

[MSgt]

LOL not really. Anyone can blow another persons head off with a gun.

The equiptment was proven to be defective in the 90s..the DOD reisued it. They weren't just outdated..they had holes in them and the masks never worked properly. You don't have a problem with the DOD issuing those to the troops?

There's more to it than that. We don't aim for the head. We aim center mass. We are skilled Marksmen and are able to perform assaults while maintaining our accuracy. So, of course anyone can do it...if they are trained. The National Guard is not trained. Now, you pit a squad of Marines with our weapons and training against a Platoon of Al-Queda with their weapons and training and who do you think will win?

Of course I have a problem with some of our gear. What I have a more problem with was with what funds was the DOD supposed to use to fix this problem? Do you remember the year where the DOD had no funds, because President Clinton wouldn't sign the Annual Defense Budget and our paychecks were payed through loans? I remember. What I have a problem with is why the Army got a hold of these masks and not the Marine Corps. What I have a problem with is why the Army spent a decade doing nothing about it. What I have a problem with is why the Army is synonymous with scandels, out spoken Generals, and a constant bitching of what they "can't" do. You don't see any of this in the Marine Corps. Receiving less funds than three other branches, why is that the Marine Corps did not have these probolems and seem to always be able to accomplish the mission? What the **** is going on inside the Army? There are five other branches under the DOD. Why is it that the Army is in constant "need." These are the questions you should ask if you truly "support the troop."

http://www.heritage.org/Research/NationalSecurity/EM467.cfm

 

[M14 Shooter]

Lol yeah I suppose that has been the goal of Bush. Bankrupt America...

~$350B over 4 years is 'bankrupting' America?
Whats the ~$4896B spent by the Fed government over the last 4 years on welfare doing to us?

and deprive us of our rights via the Patriot Act.

I thnk this was asked before and never asnwered...
name 10 rights (actual rights) you culd exercise before the PA that youcannot exercise now.

Shrubola needs to take a hint from Thomas Jefferson.."Those who would trade safety for freedom deserve neither." and Benjamin Franklin "“Those who would sacrifice a little freedom for temporal safety deserve neither to be safe or free."

And yet, in every single war we've fought, we've done just that.
Whats you;re point?

 

[M14 Shooter]

Now, you pit a squad of Marines with our weapons and training against a Platoon of Al-Queda with their weapons and training and who do you think will win?

Well DUH!
The platoon of Al-Queda.
After all, they ARE the good guys.

 

[Calm2Chaos]

Unlike all of those evil wars in the past where we used carpet bombing, nukes, and gas....right? Give me a break. America's not different, you are. You grew up and realized that freedoms and securities come at a price and you don't like it.

My guess is he's never had to pay for it.

Or he's been living under that comfortable umbrella of ours.

 

[Calm2Chaos]

LOL no.



Riiiight...long live the cubicle eh? ROFL.



LOL not really. Anyone can blow another persons head off with a gun.



The equiptment was proven to be defective in the 90s..the DOD reisued it. They weren't just outdated..they had holes in them and the masks never worked properly. You don't have a problem with the DOD issuing those to the troops?




Lol yeah I suppose that has been the goal of Bush. Bankrupt America and deprive us of our rights via the Patriot Act. Shrubola needs to take a hint from Thomas Jefferson.."Those who would trade safety for freedom deserve neither." and Benjamin Franklin "“Those who would sacrifice a little freedom for temporal safety deserve neither to be safe or free."

Other then this (Sitting on the computer)... What exactly have you done or did that makes you at all qualified to state anything about the marines or any issue they may receive? Do you have ANYTHING at all that may be considered redeemable? Your arguing with someone that has fought for this country for over a decade. Yes it makes him more qualified in a lot of things. And until you can actually come to the party with something I can't see how you can embarrass yourself repeatedly.