Should people who commit violent crimes with a firearm be punished more severely

[bilbus]

Violent crimes would include but not limited to

Robbery
Extortion
Battery
Rape
Sexual assault
Abduction
Murder

 

[RightinNYC]

Your poll options seem to imply that there currently is no additional penalty for the use of a firearm in the commission of a violent crime, when there actually is.

As a result, I think that the law is fine the way it is.

 

[Real Korimyr #9]

Gun's just a tool. Most important thing when determining sentencing is what measures are going to be most effective at preventing the crime from being repeated.

 

[bilbus]

I am not aware of any law that adds time to a sentence if a gun is used. Can you quote a example of a law that adds severity if a gun is used?

I am not saying you are wrong, i am just not aware of any such law.

I also think felons should get life in jail if they commit a crime with a gun.

 

[RightinNYC]

I am not aware of any law that adds time to a sentence if a gun is used. Can you quote a example of a law that adds severity if a gun is used?

I am not saying you are wrong, i am just not aware of any such law.

I also think felons should get life in jail if they commit a crime with a gun.

Assault with a deadly weapon is a more serious crime than assault.

NY:

S 120.00 Assault in the third degree.
A person is guilty of assault in the third degree when:
1. With intent to cause physical injury to another person, he causes
such injury to such person or to a third person

Assault in the third degree is a class A misdemeanor.

v.

S 120.05 Assault in the second degree.
A person is guilty of assault in the second degree when:
...
2. With intent to cause physical injury to another person, he causes
such injury to such person or to a third person by means of a deadly
weapon or a dangerous instrument

Assault in the second degree is a class D felony.

The use of a firearm is an aggravating factor in pretty much every violent crime that you mentioned. I'm unaware of any place where it's not.

 

[Vader]

Your poll options seem to imply that there currently is no additional penalty for the use of a firearm in the commission of a violent crime, when there actually is.

As a result, I think that the law is fine the way it is.

I agree.

There is no need for tougher laws ... except in white collar crimes.

 

[RightinNYC]

I agree.

There is no need for tougher laws ... except in white collar crimes.

Fine by me, I could use the extra business. :lol:

 

[Vader]

Fine by me, I could use the extra business. :lol:

You sound like a lawyer!

 

[bilbus]

Assault with a deadly weapon is a more serious crime than assault.

NY:



v.




The use of a firearm is an aggravating factor in pretty much every violent crime that you mentioned. I'm unaware of any place where it's not.

Deadly weapon constitutes any deadly weapon, not a gun in particular.

 

[RightinNYC]

Deadly weapon constitutes any deadly weapon, not a gun in particular.

So are you asking whether a crime committed with a gun should be/is punished more harshly than a crime committed with a knife/axe/baseball bat?

In that case, yes, it still is, but generally by adding an additional firearm charge, not by increasing the degree of the underlying offense.


NY:

§ 265.08 Criminal use of a firearm in the second degree.
A person is guilty of criminal use of a firearm in the second degree
when he commits any class C violent felony offense as defined in paragraph (b) of subdivision one of section 70.02 and he either:
(1) possesses a deadly weapon, if the weapon is a loaded weapon from which a shot, readily capable of producing death or other serious injury may be discharged; or
(2) displays what appears to be a pistol, revolver, rifle, shotgun, machine gun or other firearm.

Criminal use of a firearm in the second degree is a class C felony.

 

[bilbus]

ahh ok thanks.

In that case do you all think it should hold a harsher penalty?

 

[Ikari]

The laws are fine as is.

 

[jamesrage]

Violent crimes would include but not limited to

Robbery
Extortion
Battery
Rape
Sexual assault
Abduction
Murder

I say no. Because it should treated no different than a violent crime that was committed with any other weapon. Armed robbery should be armed robbery no matter what kind of weapon was used,the fact you used a gun instead of a knife or some other weapon should be irrelevant. Its almost like hate crime laws but instead of applying different punishments because the victim is a minority or a fake minority(people who choose a different sexual lifestyle or choose to mutilate themselves so they can pretend to be a gender they are not), different punishments are applied because of the weapon used.

Is it going to make the victim's loved ones feel better because the victim was killed with a knife instead of a gun? Are victims who were robbed at knife point somehow feel better because the weapon wasn' t a firearm? Do rape victims who were raped by a rapist who threatened them with a baseball bat somehow feel less victimized?

 

[Goshin]

Exactly, james. You're just as freaking dead, whether you were shot or stabbed to death. Actually, stabbing/beating deaths may arguably be more brutal and involve greater suffering in many cases, from what I've seen IRL.

Special laws with special punishments for using a gun to commit a specific crime are simply about demonizing firearms and pandering to irrational fears, as if being shot was somehow worse than being gutted with a butcher knife.


G.

 

[RightinNYC]

So if a person who is robbing you fires a gun at you and misses, you think that's exactly the same as if they swing a baseball bat at you and miss?

Getting stabbed in the leg is the same as getting shot in the leg?

Having a gun shoved in your face is the same as having brass knuckles waved in your face?

 

[Goshin]

So if a person who is robbing you fires a gun at you and misses, you think that's exactly the same as if they swing a baseball bat at you and miss?

Getting stabbed in the leg is the same as getting shot in the leg?

Having a gun shoved in your face is the same as having brass knuckles waved in your face?

Yup. They are all potentially deadly weapons.

I've been shot at; I've had a gun shoved in my face at close range. I've had a guy come at me with a knife. I've been hit with a club.

None of it was exactly fun.

G.

 

[RightinNYC]

Yup. They are all potentially deadly weapons.

I've been shot at; I've had a gun shoved in my face at close range. I've had a guy come at me with a knife. I've been hit with a club.

None of it was exactly fun.

G.

I'm not saying it's all fun, I'm saying that IMO, the incidents involving the firearm are each more serious than their counterparts.

 

[Jerry]

So if a person who is robbing you fires a gun at you and misses, you think that's exactly the same as if they swing a baseball bat at you and miss?

Getting stabbed in the leg is the same as getting shot in the leg?

Having a gun shoved in your face is the same as having brass knuckles waved in your face?

SD sees little difference between firing a gun and swinging a bat (at the head).

Both are deadly weapons and both are attempts to end the life of the post-viable fertilized egg.

 

[winston53660]

Firearms should never be used in a mugging, 7-11 hold up or whatever. They are there for protection and/or meat. For this reason I do support stiffer penalties if a gun is used in the commitment of a violent crime.

 

[Jerry]

In related news.....

1 dead, one injured in Miami Burger King shooting
By ROBERT SAMUELS AND JENNIFER LEBOVICH
jlebovich@MiamiHerald.com

One man was killed and another seriously wounded in a shootout inside a Miami Burger King on Tuesday, officials said.

Police said a man wearing a ski mask walked into the store at Biscayne Boulevard and 54th Street and demanded money from a clerk.

A customer, who has a concealed weapons permit, pulled a gun, said Officer Jeff Giordano, a Miami police spokesman.

The customer and robber exchanged fire.

The robber was shot dead at the scene.

The customer, who had several gunshot wounds, was taken to Ryder Trauma Center in serious but stable condition, said Lt. Ignatius Carroll, a Miami Fire Rescue spokesman.

At about 4 p.m., officials got several 911 calls reporting people shot inside the Burger King.

Now THAT is the proper penalty for committing a crime with a firearm.

 

[RightinNYC]

SD sees little difference between firing a gun and swinging a bat (at the head).

Both are deadly weapons and both are attempts to end the life of the post-viable fertilized egg.

....

what?

 

[Goshin]

Firearms should never be used in a mugging, 7-11 hold up or whatever. They are there for protection and/or meat. For this reason I do support stiffer penalties if a gun is used in the commitment of a violent crime.

Huh?


Knives are supposed to be used for utility purposes, not carving humans. Baseball bats are supposed to be used for baseball, not laying open someone's skull like a melon. Hammers are supposed to drive nails, not fracture brainpans. So, I support stiffer penalties if baseball bats, hammers or knives are used to commit a violent crime.

Now, a garrotte is specifically made for murder, so there shouldn't be any additional penalties for using a garrotte...

(/irony)

Get the point?

It's not the tool used, but the act that is criminal.

G.

 

[jamesrage]

Exactly, james. You're just as freaking dead, whether you were shot or stabbed to death. Actually, stabbing/beating deaths may arguably be more brutal and involve greater suffering in many cases, from what I've seen IRL.

Anti-gun nuts for some reason seem to think we are stupid enough to think that someone somewhere is going at least Billy was was stabbed to death with a knife instead of shot to death with a gun.

Special laws with special punishments for using a gun to commit a specific crime are simply about demonizing firearms

I believe this is why crimes committed firearms in some areas have stiffer punishments. Is the same reason why school shootings practically get 24/7 media attention and they are quick to point out the shooter used a gun and why some civilian stopping crime with a firearm gets a token mention and they are not so quick to point out he used a gun.Its about demonization of something we have a constitional right to. If they can demonize it then it might be easier for them take it away and label anyone who opposes them as paranoid nuts.

 

[jamesrage]

So if a person who is robbing you fires a gun at you and misses, you think that's exactly the same as if they swing a baseball bat at you and miss?
Getting stabbed in the leg is the same as getting shot in the leg?

Having a gun shoved in your face is the same as having brass knuckles waved in your face?

Why does it make a difference to you if the victim is killed with any of these things?

 

[RightinNYC]

Why does it make a difference to you if the victim is killed with any of these things?

Did you notice that none of my examples involved death?