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Should anti-radar/laser/redlight camera products be illegal?

Should anti-radar/laser/redlight products be illegal?

  • Yes

    Votes: 5 27.8%
  • No

    Votes: 13 72.2%

  • Total voters
    18

joko104

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Speeding tickets fines and punishments continue to increase. There are numerous products a person can buy to detect or even block laser and radar guns, and GPS units that warn of most known redlight cameras.

Speeding tickets fines and punishments continue to increase. There are numerous products a person can buy to detect or even block laser and radar guns, and GPS units that warn of most known redlight cameras. Here is the list and effectiveness:

1. Radar jammers. Illegal and not available.
2. Radar scramblers: Ineffective

3. Redlight camera GPS. Totally warning effective ONLY if camera locale is in the software.

4. Laser jammers: Legal/Illegal depending on the state. Reduce laser detection range about 50%.

5. Laser absorbing paint: Legal. Reduce laser detection range about 50%.

6. Combination laser jammer & absorbing paint: reduces detection range about 70%

7. Radar absorbing paint: legal. Difficult to find and questionable effectiveness.

8. Radar detectors: From virtually worthless to highly effective depending on price. Most expensive models can not be detected.

COST: The best of everything - $2000 plus installation.

Should such products be legal to have on/in your vehicle?
 

jamesrage

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Speeding tickets fines and punishments continue to increase. There are numerous products a person can buy to detect or even block laser and radar guns, and GPS units that warn of most known redlight cameras.

Speeding tickets fines and punishments continue to increase. There are numerous products a person can buy to detect or even block laser and radar guns, and GPS units that warn of most known redlight cameras. Here is the list and effectiveness:

1. Radar jammers. Illegal and not available.
2. Radar scramblers: Ineffective

3. Redlight camera GPS. Totally warning effective ONLY if camera locale is in the software.

4. Laser jammers: Legal/Illegal depending on the state. Reduce laser detection range about 50%.

5. Laser absorbing paint: Legal. Reduce laser detection range about 50%.

6. Combination laser jammer & absorbing paint: reduces detection range about 70%

7. Radar absorbing paint: legal. Difficult to find and questionable effectiveness.

8. Radar detectors: From virtually worthless to highly effective depending on price. Most expensive models can not be detected.

COST: The best of everything - $2000 plus installation.

Should such products be legal to have on/in your vehicle?

I say no to the radar detectors, laser absorbing paint, and red light camera GPS being illegal. If we do not have a expectation of privacy out on the open road then neither does law enforcement and law enforcement equipment. Yes for the radar and laser jammers being illegal.
 

joko104

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I was surprised that laser jammers are legal and more surprised they actually work. Radar jammers (radio waves) are within the jurisdiction of the F.C.C., and therefore they are illegal unlicensed radio signals. Lasers fall under the jurisdiction of the F.D.A., which has set legal maximum power levels.

Police lasers have to be low power because of the potential eye damage and liabilities for it. However, the power of those are far below the maximum legal allowed usage. Since lasers are used for a huge number of reasons - from measuring distance to gun sights and countless scientific and manufacturing processes, the level is legal quite high for what is allowable. Car laser jammers work by sending out a laser beam in a light frequency the human eye can not see (but if too high could be damaged) - at the maximum USA legal level, which is about 50 times higher than the police use in their laser speed detectors. Thus they are legal.

I would have guessed that it was lasers that couldn't be defeated. However, because radar jamming is illegal only detection is legally possible. Thus, the most dangerous of all for tickets is instant-on radar, which obviously a detector cannot detect until too late.

I don't think either should be illegal (jammers) and would give analogy of should it be illegal to have a phone scrambler on your phone in case of wiretapping or illegal turn up loud music if you think police have put a microphone in your home, car or are listening with a remote listening device. Since jammers don't hurt anyone, I am inclined to think they should be legal.

A curious argument I read by one person is that when the police are shooting radar and lasers at you, they are literally shooting you with radiation. The government claims that it's safe, but the person argued that if police can shoot concentrated radio waves and lasers specifically concentrated on people randomly, then citizens should be able to randomly shoot radar radio waves and laser beams at the police too.

Should private citizens be allowed to have radar and laser speed detectors? Which, of course, could be used to document police officers speeding (but also could be used to defeat radar and laser detectors?)
 

Caine

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Speeding tickets fines and punishments continue to increase. There are numerous products a person can buy to detect or even block laser and radar guns, and GPS units that warn of most known redlight cameras.

Speeding tickets fines and punishments continue to increase. There are numerous products a person can buy to detect or even block laser and radar guns, and GPS units that warn of most known redlight cameras. Here is the list and effectiveness:

1. Radar jammers. Illegal and not available.
2. Radar scramblers: Ineffective

3. Redlight camera GPS. Totally warning effective ONLY if camera locale is in the software.

4. Laser jammers: Legal/Illegal depending on the state. Reduce laser detection range about 50%.

5. Laser absorbing paint: Legal. Reduce laser detection range about 50%.

6. Combination laser jammer & absorbing paint: reduces detection range about 70%

7. Radar absorbing paint: legal. Difficult to find and questionable effectiveness.

8. Radar detectors: From virtually worthless to highly effective depending on price. Most expensive models can not be detected.

COST: The best of everything - $2000 plus installation.

Should such products be legal to have on/in your vehicle?
Anything that warns you.... Legal.

Any device that jams... Illegal.
 

joko104

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The CL65 my wife got me for my birthday is still in the body shop for mild customization and fresh paint. They promise it'll be done by next week, it's just she keeps adding things to do for them. She did order "the works" in terms of laser jammers and radar detectors also added to it. The center console box is going to be like a James Bond car I guess. Little switches:
1. Brake lights on-off (hard to follow someone without brake lights in terms of turns)
2. Taillights on-off (same reason at night)
3. Nitrous Oxide injection
4. Alcohol injection
5. Twin front and 1 rear laser jammers
6. Radar detectors
7. Red/blue flashing lights behind the grill (legal for me if "official business")

I imagine she'll have the headlight shields and chrome Mercedes star painted with radar absorbing paint too.
 

joko104

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Anything that warns you.... Legal.

Any device that jams... Illegal.
Why illegal? Should it also be illegal for you to encrypt files on your computer?
 

Caine

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Why illegal? Should it also be illegal for you to encrypt files on your computer?
No.

It has everything to do with Radio Broadcasts being subject to regulation by the FCC.
 

douglas

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I believe that jammers should be illegal, due to the fact that they are interfering with the police's ability to implement the law. Awareness devices are no more effective then just seeing the cop or having a buddy who knows about the speed traps. I can think of no reason for why "knowledge" should be illegal, so the Awareness/Detection devices should be legal.

The jammers are illegal in most states, but my grandfather had a radar detector. It didn't work very well and lit up for no reason a lot.

The absorbing/reflecting paint is kind of a strange hybrid of the two; they're passive but more than just knowledge. It's a bit of a moot point though; they're rare, expensive, and relatively non-effective.

Of course, you could just drive at a reasonable speed.
 

joko104

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No.

It has everything to do with Radio Broadcasts being subject to regulation by the FCC.
Yes, I understand WHO made it illegal. Why should it be illegal? Encryption codes on computers interfere with police investigations of crimes FAR greater than speeding. Laser jammers are not illegal because they are under the F.D.A. and there are lots of applications of lasers. Radar jammers being illegal is a bit curious, because many, many cars now use radar for proximity sensors - which in effect makes them very short range radar jammers at certain frequencies.
 
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joko104

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I believe that jammers should be illegal, due to the fact that they are interfering with the police's ability to implement the law. Awareness devices are no more effective then just seeing the cop or having a buddy who knows about the speed traps. I can think of no reason for why "knowledge" should be illegal, so the Awareness/Detection devices should be legal.

The jammers are illegal in most states, but my grandfather had a radar detector. It didn't work very well and lit up for no reason a lot.

The absorbing/reflecting paint is kind of a strange hybrid of the two; they're passive but more than just knowledge. It's a bit of a moot point though; they're rare, expensive, and relatively non-effective.

Of course, you could just drive at a reasonable speed.
Actually, it is not absorbing. Rather, not very reflective. Depending on the car and it's shape, it can be very effective. What it does is shortens the range at which the radar can read a car. Because radar would measure everything if it could read on a small feedby, the level of return radar has to be relatively high. Otherwise it could pick of leaves on a tree behind the car and say the car was going 10 mph or 100 mpd if a leaf was flickering in the wind a certain way.

What radar most picks up on are license plates, chrome and headlights as they best reflect back. So if the headlights are painted with a semi-clear flat-type paint - like slightly tinted headlights - and the same with chrome pieces and a front license plate (if required), the car has to be closer before radar can pick it up. For some cars, the distance is reduced by about 2/3rds, depending on the unit the officer is using.

Laser jammers work on the same concept of allowing you more tip to see the officer - plus react to your detectors.
 

Caine

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Yes, I understand WHO made it illegal. Why should it be illegal? Encryption codes on computers interfere with police investigations of crimes FAR greater than speeding. Laser jammers are not illegal because they are under the F.D.A. and there are lots of applications of lasers. Radar jammers being illegal is a bit curious, because many, many cars now use radar for proximity sensors - which in effect makes them very short range radar jammers at certain frequencies.
Radio broadcasting regulation has many more applications than Police SMIs.

As far as laser, good luck... LOL.

Laser detection devices are about as worthless as tits on a boar hog.

Im a licensed LIDAR operator........ part of the training they actually showed us the results of a laser detector in a car and a LIDAR instrument.... unless the officer is aiming his LIDAR at the driver or windshield area, it ain't gonna detect.

Now if you want to put a Laser Detector down by the headlights/driver side bumper area and wire some alerts into the passenger area, go for it.
 

Caine

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Actually, it is not absorbing. Rather, not very reflective. Depending on the car and it's shape, it can be very effective. What it does is shortens the range at which the radar can read a car. Because radar would measure everything if it could read on a small feedby, the level of return radar has to be relatively high. Otherwise it could pick of leaves on a tree behind the car and say the car was going 10 mph or 100 mpd if a leaf was flickering in the wind a certain way.

What radar most picks up on are license plates, chrome and headlights as they best reflect back. So if the headlights are painted with a semi-clear flat-type paint - like slightly tinted headlights - and the same with chrome pieces and a front license plate (if required), the car has to be closer before radar can pick it up. For some cars, the distance is reduced by about 2/3rds, depending on the unit the officer is using.

Laser jammers work on the same concept of allowing you more tip to see the officer - plus react to your detectors.
The paint doesn't work for Radar, despite the sales pitch.
 

Goshin

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Speeding tickets fines and punishments continue to increase. There are numerous products a person can buy to detect or even block laser and radar guns, and GPS units that warn of most known redlight cameras.

Speeding tickets fines and punishments continue to increase. There are numerous products a person can buy to detect or even block laser and radar guns, and GPS units that warn of most known redlight cameras. Here is the list and effectiveness:

1. Radar jammers. Illegal and not available.
2. Radar scramblers: Ineffective

3. Redlight camera GPS. Totally warning effective ONLY if camera locale is in the software.

4. Laser jammers: Legal/Illegal depending on the state. Reduce laser detection range about 50%.

5. Laser absorbing paint: Legal. Reduce laser detection range about 50%.

6. Combination laser jammer & absorbing paint: reduces detection range about 70%

7. Radar absorbing paint: legal. Difficult to find and questionable effectiveness.

8. Radar detectors: From virtually worthless to highly effective depending on price. Most expensive models can not be detected.

COST: The best of everything - $2000 plus installation.

Should such products be legal to have on/in your vehicle?


As long as speeding tickets have as much or more to do with providing revenue to the local gov, anti-radar/etc stuff should not be illegal.


Consider it similar to hiring a professional accountant to minimize your tax burden. :mrgreen:
 

Manc Skipper

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Have things moved on since Mythbusters found none of these devices worked?(IIRC) By the time your detector detects the beam, then DUH, it's too late. Actively avoiding the lawful consequences of your illegal actions should be illegal. Like refusing a breath test for drunk driving carrying the same penaties as if you had failed it.
The only thing I agree with is GPS showing location of fixed speed traps/red lights. Logically, they are there to promote road safety, so they need to be publicised, not hidden away. UK road maps as well as GPS carry speed camera locations.
 

Caine

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As long as speeding tickets have as much or more to do with providing revenue to the local gov, anti-radar/etc stuff should not be illegal.


Consider it similar to hiring a professional accountant to minimize your tax burden. :mrgreen:
I am disappointed that you actually think that.

Maybe it works that way in South Carolina, but in NORTH Carolina all fines are paid to the Administrative Office of the Court, which is state run, and has little to do with local government.
 

Goshin

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I am disappointed that you actually think that.

Maybe it works that way in South Carolina, but in NORTH Carolina all fines are paid to the Administrative Office of the Court, which is state run, and has little to do with local government.



Yeah, it's different here. You pay the locals.... who will often nicely knock of half your points if you pay the fine without a fuss. :roll:
 

Thoreau72

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Regarding the RLC, there are many products available to defeat them, from the sublime to the ridiculous.

One is called Photoblocker, and it works, but only for a few months and must then be reapplied. Simply a clear spray that somehow diffuses light from the flashers the cameras use for the picture. It cannot be seen on the tag, but somehow it makes it so that such cameras cannot read the tag number.

Another cottage industry, eh? :lol:
 

radcen

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Anything that warns you.... Legal.

Any device that jams... Illegal.
This was 30 years ago so it may have since changed, but when I was stationed in Virginia radar detectors were illegal. There were even big signs on the highways as soon as you entered from another state. Also, ads for radar detectors in car magazines had disclaimer that they could not ship to Virginia addresses.
 

Caine

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This was 30 years ago so it may have since changed, but when I was stationed in Virginia radar detectors were illegal. There were even big signs on the highways as soon as you entered from another state. Also, ads for radar detectors in car magazines had disclaimer that they could not ship to Virginia addresses.
I was last in Virginia about 8 months ago and it was the same still.

My post was more to the topic of "Should...... be legal"
 

Manc Skipper

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Regarding the RLC, there are many products available to defeat them, from the sublime to the ridiculous.

One is called Photoblocker, and it works, but only for a few months and must then be reapplied. Simply a clear spray that somehow diffuses light from the flashers the cameras use for the picture. It cannot be seen on the tag, but somehow it makes it so that such cameras cannot read the tag number.

Another cottage industry, eh? :lol:
If a police car with an ANPR camera pings up a "blank" plate, you'll be busted anyway.
 

Tigger

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NO. In fact any vehicle found equipped with this stuff should be impounded until it is removed and a serious fine paid.

If you want to break the law take the risks associated with it.
 

Thoreau72

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If a police car with an ANPR camera pings up a "blank" plate, you'll be busted anyway.
Thanks for that. Sounds logical. What does ANPR stand for?

I know 2 people who use it, and no troubles so far.
 

joko104

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anti-radar bra

Kip Fuller - Radar Absorbing Car Bra - YouTube


anti-radar paint

Veil anti laser stealth paint coating - YouTube


Redlight cameras can get it wrong

Plate Defender - Red Light Camera FAIL - Wrong Driver Ticketed! - YouTube


Anti radar/red light license plate spray

Controversial Spray Shields License Plates from Traffic Cameras.... - YouTube

There are also plate shields, although those illegal.


Here's a cool James Bond type product - a license plate flipper.
License Plate Flipper - Like James Bond - YouTube


A danger of redlight/speeding cameras? I could make it so someone I don't like receives hundreds of tickets in two weeks in 2 dozen cities before they ever knew what hit them. All I need to know is your license plate number. To make it perfect, also what you drive and rent a vehicle like yours - but wouldn't have to.


It is a piece of cake to make a license identical to yours on paper using a color photo copier. Cameras can not tell the difference. I then look up (possible) where such cameras are located in a major metro area with numerous suburbs and then speed and run lights past them. You are now receiving 1,3, 5, 10, 20, 50, 100 tickets from 1, 2, 5, 8, 10, 15 different cities.


You, of course, can go to the courts in every one of those cities trying to convince each of those courts the car/truck exactly like registered to you with your license plate really isn't you and really isn't your car. Good luck with that. I could just keep driving from city to city getting you 2,3,5 tickets in everyone of those. They would be no way for you to stop this, no certainty any court would go along with you on it, and do you have time to go to 50, 100 different courts anyway?


Impossible? Not at all. Cops rarely ever check VINs on cars when stopped. I used a photocopy plate of an identical car I was driving for about 3 years back in my past. Never a problem, though that was too long ago so predated such cameras. Whose number did I use? The first car I saw identical to mine - totally random selection. So your 50, 100, 500 tickets from 5, 10, 25, 100 different cities could be that you were just randomly selected. A form of ID theft, via your license plate. And one that takes you to 50 different courts.

Explain anyway to protect yourself against that ^.
 
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Helix

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considering that it has become much more about revenue than safety and that the speed limits have been set artificially low to enhance revenue, i'd say the arms race on both sides is fair.

that being said, i gave up all of the above ten years ago. i'll lose fifteen to twenty minutes and $120 being pulled over as opposed to the maybe three minutes i save by speeding.
 
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