Robert Reich: American Workers Are on Strike Over 'Low-Wage S*** Jobs'

[Slartibartfast]

Biden's economic policies as expressed in his flurry of EOs.

And those had no measurable negative effect on the economy and were quite minor in the scope of things.

That his 'infrastructure' agenda is being held up in congress is probably a good thing, in that they are neither 'infrastructure' (not at only 20% or less of the spending) nor beneficial to the economy (dumping that much money likely to spur even more inflation). Economic legislation driven by ideology rarely results in benefiting the economy.

Perhaps or perhaps not, but you cannot say that a certain agenda is bad for the economy when that agenda has not been enacted. You could, however, be correct in saying that inaction is either good or bad because that is the current state of things.

 

[eohrnberger]

And those had no measurable negative effect on the economy and were quite minor in the scope of things.

Ahh. nope. Going from an net energy exporter to a net energy importer is only one of the negative economic impacts from the Biden's EOs.

Perhaps or perhaps not, but you cannot say that a certain agenda is bad for the economy when that agenda has not been enacted. You could, however, be correct in saying that inaction is either good or bad because that is the current state of things.

The feds dumping trillions into the economy, deflating the value of the currency, is going to be a good thing?
I hardly think so. It's going to be damaging to the economy not to mention all the damage that it would cause to everyone's retirement savings and the inflation it would cause.

It really seems like the left has picked up every possible bad idea (policy) and is driving to implement it.

 

[Slartibartfast]

Ahh. nope. Going from an net energy exporter to a net energy importer is only one of the negative economic impacts from the Biden's EOs.

Oil prices bottomed out and wells shuttered. This is part of the oil cycle and has nothing to do with who is president.

The feds dumping trillions into the economy, deflating the value of the currency, is going to be a good thing?
I hardly think so. It's going to be damaging to the economy not to mention all the damage that it would cause to everyone's retirement savings and the inflation it would cause.

It really seems like the left has picked up every possible bad idea (policy) and is driving to implement it.

The inflationary pressures are due to global supply chain issues, not currency policy. This is well documented by both the FED and economists.

 

[eohrnberger]

Oil prices bottomed out and wells shuttered. This is part of the oil cycle and has nothing to do with who is president.

Yes, the petroleum industry is cyclical, as are all industries, but when there was a glut of oil on the world market, weren't the US wells producing? I do believe they were.

The inflationary pressures are due to global supply chain issues, not currency policy. This is well documented by both the FED and economists.

Yes, partially due to global supply chain issues and also due to currency policy. Are you trying to tell me that the billions (or was it trillions?) in COVID aide didn't have any inflationary effect at all? I find that hard to believe.

 

[KevinKohler]

When the “safety net” is so generous that it offers serious competition (an alternative?) to ‘low wage’ work, the problem might not be the existence of ‘low wage’ work (capable of attracting millions of ‘undocumented’ foreign workers) - it might be that the “safety net” has simply become too generous.

This would have merrit but for the fact that wages have been stagnant, and not kept pace with inflation.

I was making 11.50 per hour in 2006, working as a stocker at bed bath and beyond. Those same positions have JUST NOW made it to 14, on average, thanks ONLY to the pandemic. Only 14 years to climb 3.50.

 

[ttwtt78640]

This would have merrit but for the fact that wages have been stagnant, and not kept pace with inflation.

I was making 11.50 per hour in 2006, working as a stocker at bed bath and beyond. Those same positions have JUST NOW made it to 14, on average, thanks ONLY to the pandemic. Only 14 years to climb 3.50.

Agreed. Another troubling thing is that ‘official’ inflation is simply a number (calculated, thus fully controlled) by government, but acts as a tax both directly (as property assessed value rises) and indirectly (increasing the hours of work needed to buy X).

 

[Slartibartfast]

Yes, the petroleum industry is cyclical, as are all industries, but when there was a glut of oil on the world market, weren't the US wells producing? I do believe they were.

Oil prices went negative a year ago: Here's what traders have learned since

It’s been a year since the U.S. benchmark West Texas Intermediate crude futures settled at a negative price for the first time, and while prices have...

www.marketwatch.com

Yes, partially due to global supply chain issues and also due to currency policy. Are you trying to tell me that the billions (or was it trillions?) in COVID aide didn't have any inflationary effect at all? I find that hard to believe.

The policy argument is invalidated due to the fact that these issues are a global phenomenon and not one being experienced only by the US.

 

[mrjurrs]

When the “safety net” is so generous that it offers serious competition (an alternative?) to ‘low wage’ work, the problem might not be the existence of ‘low wage’ work (capable of attracting millions of ‘undocumented’ foreign workers) - it might be that the “safety net” has simply become too generous.

So the ending of the safety net (no more fed Unemployment benefits) would lead to a hiring surge right? Nope.

Cutoff of Jobless Benefits Is Found to Get Few Back to Work (Published 2021)

Prematurely ending federal programs had little effect on employment but sharply cut spending, potentially hurting state economies, researchers say.

www.nytimes.com

 

[eohrnberger]

Oil prices went negative a year ago: Here's what traders have learned since

It’s been a year since the U.S. benchmark West Texas Intermediate crude futures settled at a negative price for the first time, and while prices have...

www.marketwatch.com

This citation doesn't dispute anything which I've posted.

The policy argument is invalidated due to the fact that these issues are a global phenomenon and not one being experienced only by the US.

I would tend to disagree with this assertion.

 

[ttwtt78640]

So the ending of the safety net (no more fed Unemployment benefits) would lead to a hiring surge right? Nope.

Cutoff of Jobless Benefits Is Found to Get Few Back to Work (Published 2021)

Prematurely ending federal programs had little effect on employment but sharply cut spending, potentially hurting state economies, researchers say.

www.nytimes.com

Having “little” effect is not the same as having “no” effect. The way things work, a reduction in UI income may result in qualifying for more assistance from other “safety net”programs. By not returning to ‘on the books’ employment, one can keep getting UI (and other “safety net” program assistance) while earning ‘off the books‘ income.

 

[mrjurrs]

Having “little” effect is not the same as having “no” effect. The way things work, a reduction in UI income may result in qualifying for more assistance from other “safety net”programs. By not returning to ‘on the books’ employment, one can keep getting UI (and other “safety net” program assistance) while earning ‘off the books‘ income.

And that is different from before the pandemic how?

 

[ttwtt78640]

And that is different from before the pandemic how?

It’s not and I made no claim otherwise.

 

[VanceMack]

How many people does Robert Reich employ and how much does he pay them?

Its always idiot leftists that bitch about the wages being paid...by other people.

 

[mrjurrs]

It’s not and I made no claim otherwise.

I didn't take that as a claim, I was trying to infer that the more things change, the more they stay the same.

 

[Slartibartfast]

This citation doesn't dispute anything which I've posted.

Either way the current oil prices are due to this more than any one country’s policy.

I would tend to disagree with this assertion.

Unsurprising

 

[eohrnberger]

Either way the current oil prices are due to this more than any one country’s policy.

Not solely, no, but then that's not a claim I was making either.

Unsurprising

Agreed.

 

[Slartibartfast]

Not solely, no, but then that's not a claim I was making either.

It’s by far the principal reason.

Agreed.

 

[KevinKohler]

Agreed. Another troubling thing is that ‘official’ inflation is simply a number (calculated, thus fully controlled) by government, but acts as a tax both directly (as property assessed value rises) and indirectly (increasing the hours of work needed to buy X).

I don't think it is fully controlled by the government.

It's no accident that wages have gone up in response to employers inability to hire or retain employees...and all the sudden the cost of things has gone up pretty dramatically. All well outside of any illusion of control on our government's part.

Never the less, for the bottom earners, and even into the lower middle, this has been beneficial. The folks who ARE going back to work are killing it, practically naming their price. The only downside is, their increased disposable income is now translating into increased demand on things like hospitality and leisure, 2 areas that are struggling to staff to fulfill that increased demand. Perhaps....due to a failure to keep up with the times, in terms of pay...? If they could get themselves staffed, we'd be sitting on a BOOMING economy right now.

 

[KevinKohler]

then why do so many illegal immigrants want to take these jobs then? Am I to think that an illegal immigrant has more work ethic than an american who is born here?

Yes. And they don't complain about less than OSHA standard working conditions. That's why farms, restaurants, and low end manufacturing love them. Profit first, safety last, and minimum wage sounds like a lot to them.

 

[KevinKohler]

Why not?

An agricultural subsidy (also called an agricultural incentive) is a government incentive paid to agribusinesses, agricultural organizations and farms to supplement their income, manage the supply of agricultural commodities, and influence the cost and supply of such commodities. Examples of such commodities include: wheat, feed grains (grain used as fodder, such as maize or corn, sorghum, barley and oats), cotton, milk, rice, peanuts, sugar, tobacco, oilseeds such as soybeans and meat products such as beef, pork, and lamb and mutton.[1] A 2021 study by the UN Food and Agriculture Organization found 87% of the $540bn farmers given every year between 2013 and 2018 in global subsidies are harmful to both people and environment.[2]

Agricultural subsidy - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The majority of farmers net well over 25K per year, meaning, AFTER EBIDTA, which when you factor in "rent", or where they live, means, they have realistic earnings of 50-80k per year, for the smaller time farmers...that ain't bad. You'll forgive me if I don't weep for the plight of the "poor" farmer. Add into that their typical net worth of 1 mill+, and then the question becomes....why are we spending so much to support these folks, when we won't spend any to support folks who work just as hard, do just as much, but make far far far less.

 

[ttwtt78640]

I don't think it is fully controlled by the government.

It's no accident that wages have gone up in response to employers inability to hire or retain employees...and all the sudden the cost of things has gone up pretty dramatically. All well outside of any illusion of control on our government's part.

Never the less, for the bottom earners, and even into the lower middle, this has been beneficial. The folks who ARE going back to work are killing it, practically naming their price. The only downside is, their increased disposable income is now translating into increased demand on things like hospitality and leisure, 2 areas that are struggling to staff to fulfill that increased demand. Perhaps....due to a failure to keep up with the times, in terms of pay...? If they could get themselves staffed, we'd be sitting on a BOOMING economy right now.

I guess we’ll have to wait and see how close the ‘official’ inflation figure (used to increase Social Security benefits) comes to what people are observing as the increase in their (admittedly local) basic living expenses.

It appears that many entry level wage offers have gone from $10/hour to $12/hour (or more) which is a 20% (or greater) increase. However, I expect that the ‘official’ inflation figure will not exceed 4% for those getting the (annual?) Social Security (SS) COLA. I also expect that the Medicare monthly premium will be increased, making the net SS COLA even lower.

 

[DarkWizard12]

Yes. And they don't complain about less than OSHA standard working conditions. That's why farms, restaurants, and low end manufacturing love them. Profit first, safety last, and minimum wage sounds like a lot to them.

That doesn't sound like higher work ethic, it sounds like you're describing exploitation. Yes, everyone knows businesses are willing to exploit illegal labour and it's why we have so many issues with illegal migrants.

 

[ttwtt78640]

That doesn't sound like higher work ethic, it sounds like you're describing exploitation. Yes, everyone knows businesses are willing to exploit illegal labour and it's why we have so many issues with illegal migrants.

It’s all relative to the (various) conditions which motivated them to illegally enter (or remain in) the US.

 

[KevinKohler]

I guess we’ll have to wait and see how close the ‘official’ inflation figure (used to increase Social Security benefits) comes to what people are observing as the increase in their (admittedly local) basic living expenses.

It appears that many entry level wage offers have gone from $10/hour to $12/hour (or more) which is a 20% (or greater) increase. However, I expect that the ‘official’ inflation figure will not exceed 4% for those getting the (annual?) Social Security (SS) COLA. I also expect that the Medicare monthly premium will be increased, making the net SS COLA even lower.

Yeah, my inflation "calculator" is entirely anecdotal. Beef, chicken, and pork have all gone up about 75% per pound, with the occasional sale bringing certain items back to prepandemic prices. This is also due to supply constraints...true. But, i suspect an increase in operating expense for companies that are now paying higher minimum wages (company imposed, not state) is also affecting this. Basically, I see this as a correction. What should have been happening gradually all along, and wasn't...is now happening all of a sudden.

 

[KevinKohler]

That doesn't sound like higher work ethic, it sounds like you're describing exploitation. Yes, everyone knows businesses are willing to exploit illegal labour and it's why we have so many issues with illegal migrants.

From a companies standpoint, they're the same thing.

What do you call a worker's ethic who shows up everyday, does whatever you tell them to, is willing to work for next to nothing, and never complains about anything?