President Trump, Democratic lawmakers brace for White House meeting on government shutdown

[Chomsky]

Too bad Mulvaney couldn't do anything about that weird-ass cabinet meeting they held today with the President going a meandering incoherent rant for about an hour and a half with everyone seated there trying their best to keep a straight face while the President publicly indulges his lunatic fantasies. Did you see that Game of Thrones like blowup poster of him there with words "the Sanctions are Coming!" emblazoned on it being displayed prominently in the middle of the table in front of him? WTF is up with that?

"Reality TV"

 

[MovingPictures]

Yep. Shut him out, or extract their pound of flesh. Ask for DACA & a Mueller Protection Bill, in exchange. Leave it up to him.

Pelosi is saying that it's too late for that, and she's not interested in a trade, but I'm not convinced of that just yet.

Still, in any deal there should be clear parameters and deadlines set. Any sort of trade should have the Republicans lose far more than they gain, and any deal should only be on the table for a very short period of time, and there should be severe consequences for any last minute GOP reneging.

Personally I'd rather the GOP get nothing and be forced to sell "border security" to their base, and come away with no wall.

 

[Chomsky]

Pelosi is saying that it's too late for that, and she's not interested in a trade, but I'm not convinced of that just yet.

Still, in any deal there should be clear parameters and deadlines set. Any sort of trade should have the Republicans lose far more than they gain, and any deal should only be on the table for short period of time.

Personally I'd rather the GOP get nothing and be forced to sell "border security" to their base, and come away with no wall.

Agreed. Any trade has to hurt. Trump needs to be punished for shutting down the government, not rewarded. That said, I really like the idea of dangling a Mueller Protection Bill in front of him. The psy-ops aspect of it would be freaking awesome!

 

[MovingPictures]

Agreed. Any trade has to hurt. Trump needs to be punished for shutting down the government, not rewarded. That said, I really like the idea of dangling a Mueller Protection Bill in front of him. The psy-ops aspect of it would be freaking awesome!

Yeah, I suggested that in another thread. :2razz:

McConnell won't go for it though, because that would be too big a loss for Trump, and DACA is out because the MAGA base despises any way for undocumented immigrants to become members of our society.

They are royally ****ed.

 

[yankintx]

To the people that say Trump would pay for the Wall FIRST here is a video of Candidate Trump in a Televised Town Hall where he tells Hannity Mexico would not be writing a check. He says Mexico would pay by taxes and by other means pay attention to 5:00 on.

Trump moves the goal posts. Tell ya what, when he has clawed that 5billion from Mexico he can have his wall.

 

[Chomsky]

Yeah, I suggested that in another thread. :2razz:

McConnell won't go for it though, because that would be too big a loss for Trump, and DACA is out because the MAGA base despises any way for undocumented immigrants to become members of our society.

They are royally ****ed.

Interestingly enough, I believe they (Dems) are firing-off a Mueller bill this week. So there will be one available and already passed by the House, to use as a bargaining chip if desired.

Regardless of McConnell's beef, there's nothing wrong with using these bills in negotiations.

"You want $5.6B for a wall? Fine. We want Mueller protection. Let's strike a deal!"

I mean, why the hell not negotiate like that? Even if it's behind closed doors?

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

People that have narcissistic related mental disorders, often will ramble on and on, incoherently wondering from one irrational statement to another, never making a lick of sense.

What's most disturbing is that 43% of the country isn't able to see it.

I've watched cheating womanizing baptist ministers get fiercely defended even when caught red handed.
At least a couple dozen congregation members will say something along the lines of "Don't you touch our pastor, he is an anointed man of God" etc. even though he was caught inflagrante delicto by eyewitnesses.

Forty-three percent of the country are addicted to a DRUG called Trump. It's like CRACK.

 

[MovingPictures]

Interestingly enough, I believe they (Dems) are firing-off a Mueller bill this week. So there will be one available and already passed by the House, to use as a bargaining chip if desired.

Regardless of McConnell's beef, there's nothing wrong with using these bills in negotiations.

"You want $5.6B for a wall? Fine. We want Mueller protection. Let's strike a deal!"

I mean, why the hell not negotiate like that? Even if it's behind closed doors?

Trump is not going to ever sign a deal that protects Mueller, forget it.

It's time to stop negotiating with people that always deal in bad faith.

 

[MovingPictures]

I've watched cheating womanizing baptist ministers get fiercely defended even when caught red handed.
At least a couple dozen congregation members will say something along the lines of "Don't you touch our pastor, he is an anointed man of God" etc. even though he was caught inflagrante delicto by eyewitnesses.

Forty-three percent of the country are addicted to a DRUG called Trump. It's like CRACK.

The MAGA pipe is truly some of strongest dope in the history of the world.

They behave so cultish in their defense of this buffoon, it's actually pitiful.

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

Trump moves the goal posts. Tell ya what, when he has clawed that 5billion from Mexico he can have his wall.

Remember this scene in Spinal Tap?



Now, extrapolate that to Trump and his "wall".
The entertainment value might almost be worth a few million. :lamo

 

[MovingPictures]

Remember this scene in Spinal Tap?



Now, extrapolate that to Trump and his "wall".
The entertainment value might almost be worth a few million. :lamo

:lol:

Yeah, it's based off a real set that Black Sabbath had during the 'Born Again' tour, where they drunkenly suggested Stonehenge as their stage set. It was supposed to be four or five feet, but the prop guy (who was high as a kite) mistakenly wrote the plans for it in meters.

Yes, it really happened.

 

[MovingPictures]

Remember this scene in Spinal Tap?



Now, extrapolate that to Trump and his "wall".
The entertainment value might almost be worth a few million. :lamo

Speaking of Spinal Tap, do you think Kushner will be singing 'Big Bottom' in the county jail shower? :think:

 

[Xelor]

Senator Mitch McConnell of Kentucky, the majority leader, said after the meeting that he had no intention of putting Democratic bills to reopen the government to a vote if Mr. Trump would not sign them.
-- Trump and Democrats Dig In After Talks to Reopen Government Go Nowhere


McConnell apparently feels the need to carry Trump's water re: the shutdown. The Senate, about a week ago, unanimously passed a bill that provided $1.6B in border security funding. Accordingly, were the Senate to simply re-pass that bill, the onus would be on the House to pass it with a 2/3rds majority, in which case it really doesn't matter whether Trump signs the thing.

McConnell's insistence that a bill he brings to the floor be one Trump will sign submits and subordinates Senatorial sovereignty to Trump. Our bicameral government was never designed or intended to work that way. Congress passes bill, and the POTUS approves them or doesn't. If Congress is sufficiently certain of the righteousness of the bill, it will override the veto, and if not, it won't. McConnell should let the Constitution's stipulated process play out, the "chips" falling as they do.

 

[Xelor]

Speaking of Spinal Tap, do you think Kushner will be singing 'Big Bottom' in the county jail shower? :think:

ROTFL!

I doubt he'll be singing that, but if he arrives there, it's likely he'll be a "big ol' bottom" whether he wants to or not.

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

:lol:

Yeah, it's based off a real set that Black Sabbath had during the 'Born Again' tour, where they drunkenly suggested Stonehenge as their stage set. It was supposed to be four or five feet, but the prop guy (who was high as a kite) mistakenly wrote the plans for it in meters.

Yes, it really happened.

I know, but Sabbath got the scale right. The "funny" is extrapolating a "wall" in danger of being crushed by Trump's ....

 

[trouble13]

Who was in the majority? Obviously a lot of Republicans didn't vote for it either with that kind of margin.

Republican vote was split because some object to giving DACA kids a pathway to citizenship which is what the Democrats claim they do want. Democrats all voted the same, care to explain why? You all like to claim that Trump has been uncompromising but the truth is it's the Democrats who have been uncompromising.

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[Chomsky]

Trump is not going to ever sign a deal that protects Mueller, forget it.

It's time to stop negotiating with people that always deal in bad faith.

That's the whole idea ...

 

[trouble13]

Yep. Shut him out, or extract their pound of flesh. Ask for DACA & a Mueller Protection Bill, in exchange. Leave it up to him.

Again he already offered them DACA and THEY refused him. At this point there is nothing left to talk about. Leave it shut down until
Position and Schumer feel enough pressure to actually negotiate. If Trump is smart he will excoriate them during the state of the union when he has a national audience. Let them and the media defend their position of NO

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[trouble13]

Pelosi is saying that it's too late for that, and she's not interested in a trade, but I'm not convinced of that just yet.

Still, in any deal there should be clear parameters and deadlines set. Any sort of trade should have the Republicans lose far more than they gain, and any deal should only be on the table for a very short period of time, and there should be severe consequences for any last minute GOP reneging.

Personally I'd rather the GOP get nothing and be forced to sell "border security" to their base, and come away with no wall.

Democrats idea of border security

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[trouble13]

Speaking of Spinal Tap, do you think Kushner will be singing 'Big Bottom' in the county jail shower? :think:

If we are talking spinal tap I think this is more appropriate

https://youtu.be/I-BYzaDwNoE

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[Chomsky]

He has already said he is willing to sign a DACA bill. How important is DACA to the dems because he has already told them the price and they balked

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Again he already offered them DACA and THEY refused him. At this point there is nothing left to talk about. Leave it shut down until
Position and Schumer feel enough pressure to actually negotiate. If Trump is smart he will excoriate them during the state of the union when he has a national audience. Let them and the media defend their position of NO

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If this is the late Jan/early Feb incident you're talkinhg about, it wasn't a straight-up "DACA for the Wall" trade. Trump added a lot of complicated other stuff in there, making it unacceptable to both Dems & some Repubs. The Senate vote was 60 against, which included quite a few Republicans. It wasn't a Dem refusal, but a Senate refusal.

Here's the recap:

In a rebuke to the president, senators voted overwhelmingly, 39 to 60, against the White House-backed bill, which would have committed $25 billion for a wall along the border with Mexico, placed strict limits on legal immigration, ended the diversity visa lottery and offered 1.8 million Dreamers an eventual path to citizenship.

Senators were 21 votes short of the 60 required to open debate, and the rejection of the president’s plan was bipartisan: Democrats refused its get-tough approach to legal immigration, while many conservative Republicans derided it as amnesty.

Source: Senate Rejects Immigration Plans, Leaving Fate of Dreamers Uncertain

Here's what I was referring to in my posts, which kicked this whole thing off:

President Trump and Senate minority leader Chuck Schumer made a deal at a White House meeting Friday where Schumer agreed to funding for the border wall — but two hours later, the White House reneged, Democrats say.

Besides the wall, Republicans are demanding that any deal include an end to chain migration and a visa lottery program.

Source: Dems offer to accept border wall in exchange for DACA deal — but GOP won’t budge

So Trump had his deal: DACA for the Wall.

Then he got greedy, and pulled it back. Just like he did with the earlier Senate budget now. And here we are.