POLL: Would terrorists be swayed by a "system of compassion?"

Ouroboros · Apr 23, 2019

Ilhan Omar thinks so. I do not.

Here's the text of her Nov 8 letter pleading for leniency of nine convicted terrorists. Agree with her or disagree?

___________

As you undoubtedly deliberate with great caution the sentencing of nine recently convicted Somali-American men, I bring to your attention the ramifications of sentencing young men who made a consequential mistake to decades in federal prison. Incarcerating 20-year-old men for 30 or 40 years is essentially a life sentence. Society will have no expectations of the to be 50- or 60-year-old released prisoners; it will view them with distrust and revulsion. Such punitive measures not only lack efficacy, they inevitably create an environment in which extremism can flourish, aligning with the presupposition of terrorist recruitment: “Americans do not accept you and continue to trivialize your value. Instead of being a nobody, be a martyr.”

The best deterrent to fanaticism is a system of compassion. We must alter our attitude and approach; if we truly want to affect [sic] change, we should refocus our efforts on inclusion and rehabilitation. A long-term prison sentence for one who chose violence to combat direct marginalization is a statement that our justice system misunderstands the guilty. A restorative approach to justice assesses the lure of criminality and addresses it.

The desire to commit violence is not inherent to people — it is the consequence of systematic alienation; people seek violent solutions when the process established for enacting change is inaccessible to them. Fueled by disaffection turned to malice, if the guilty were willing to kill and be killed fighting perceived injustice, imagine the consequence of them hearing, “I believe you can be rehabilitated. I want you to become part of my community, and together we will thrive.”

Integrityrespec · Apr 23, 2019

Ouroboros said:
Ilhan Omar thinks so. I do not.

Here's the text of her Nov 8 letter pleading for leniency of nine convicted terrorists. Agree with her or disagree?

___________

As you undoubtedly deliberate with great caution the sentencing of nine recently convicted Somali-American men, I bring to your attention the ramifications of sentencing young men who made a consequential mistake to decades in federal prison. Incarcerating 20-year-old men for 30 or 40 years is essentially a life sentence. Society will have no expectations of the to be 50- or 60-year-old released prisoners; it will view them with distrust and revulsion. Such punitive measures not only lack efficacy, they inevitably create an environment in which extremism can flourish, aligning with the presupposition of terrorist recruitment: “Americans do not accept you and continue to trivialize your value. Instead of being a nobody, be a martyr.”

The best deterrent to fanaticism is a system of compassion. We must alter our attitude and approach; if we truly want to affect [sic] change, we should refocus our efforts on inclusion and rehabilitation. A long-term prison sentence for one who chose violence to combat direct marginalization is a statement that our justice system misunderstands the guilty. A restorative approach to justice assesses the lure of criminality and addresses it.

The desire to commit violence is not inherent to people — it is the consequence of systematic alienation; people seek violent solutions when the process established for enacting change is inaccessible to them. Fueled by disaffection turned to malice, if the guilty were willing to kill and be killed fighting perceived injustice, imagine the consequence of them hearing, “I believe you can be rehabilitated. I want you to become part of my community, and together we will thrive.”

She really is an idiot.

Risky Thicket · Apr 23, 2019

Compassion at what point in their lives and by whom?

Beyond that, how's invading their countries, seizing their natural resources, attempting to impose our values and religions on them, destroying the cities and villages, killing their women and children and innocents, destroying their historical sites and destroying their mosques working out for the U.S.?

Phys251 · Apr 23, 2019

Anything that de-radicalizes a radicalized man and prevents him from committing violence, I'm all for.

Surrealistik · Apr 23, 2019

Ouroboros said:
Ilhan Omar thinks so. I do not.

Here's the text of her Nov 8 letter pleading for leniency of nine convicted terrorists. Agree with her or disagree?

___________

As you undoubtedly deliberate with great caution the sentencing of nine recently convicted Somali-American men, I bring to your attention the ramifications of sentencing young men who made a consequential mistake to decades in federal prison. Incarcerating 20-year-old men for 30 or 40 years is essentially a life sentence. Society will have no expectations of the to be 50- or 60-year-old released prisoners; it will view them with distrust and revulsion. Such punitive measures not only lack efficacy, they inevitably create an environment in which extremism can flourish, aligning with the presupposition of terrorist recruitment: “Americans do not accept you and continue to trivialize your value. Instead of being a nobody, be a martyr.”

The best deterrent to fanaticism is a system of compassion. We must alter our attitude and approach; if we truly want to affect [sic] change, we should refocus our efforts on inclusion and rehabilitation. A long-term prison sentence for one who chose violence to combat direct marginalization is a statement that our justice system misunderstands the guilty. A restorative approach to justice assesses the lure of criminality and addresses it.

The desire to commit violence is not inherent to people — it is the consequence of systematic alienation; people seek violent solutions when the process established for enacting change is inaccessible to them. Fueled by disaffection turned to malice, if the guilty were willing to kill and be killed fighting perceived injustice, imagine the consequence of them hearing, “I believe you can be rehabilitated. I want you to become part of my community, and together we will thrive.”

Depends on the terrorist, doesn't it?

Cassandra · Apr 23, 2019

Ouroboros said:
Ilhan Omar thinks so. I do not.

Here's the text of her Nov 8 letter pleading for leniency of nine convicted terrorists. Agree with her or disagree?

___________

I don't know anything of the cases to which she was referring but I would say that the place to start is to realize that the Abrahamic religions are extremely violent and those who wish to live by a fundamentalist reading of the Torah/ Bible/ Koran are likely to behave in ways that most of us find abhorrent. IT is very difficult to argue people out of BELIEF, even w compassion. The Saudis have been spreading a toxic, fundamentalist version of Islam for many years and the U.S. tolerates it because they have oil- and THAT is a very big problem. I don't know if Ilhan Omar has identified this original sin.

ecofarm · Apr 23, 2019

Ultimately, women win the war against terrorism. Each in their neighborhoods. Empowerment for hearts and minds.

In the meantime, everyone should kill as many terrorists as possible.

Apocalypse · Apr 23, 2019

An instant death seems compassionate enough.

Perotista · Apr 23, 2019

Ouroboros said:
Ilhan Omar thinks so. I do not.

Here's the text of her Nov 8 letter pleading for leniency of nine convicted terrorists. Agree with her or disagree?

___________

As you undoubtedly deliberate with great caution the sentencing of nine recently convicted Somali-American men, I bring to your attention the ramifications of sentencing young men who made a consequential mistake to decades in federal prison. Incarcerating 20-year-old men for 30 or 40 years is essentially a life sentence. Society will have no expectations of the to be 50- or 60-year-old released prisoners; it will view them with distrust and revulsion. Such punitive measures not only lack efficacy, they inevitably create an environment in which extremism can flourish, aligning with the presupposition of terrorist recruitment: “Americans do not accept you and continue to trivialize your value. Instead of being a nobody, be a martyr.”

The best deterrent to fanaticism is a system of compassion. We must alter our attitude and approach; if we truly want to affect [sic] change, we should refocus our efforts on inclusion and rehabilitation. A long-term prison sentence for one who chose violence to combat direct marginalization is a statement that our justice system misunderstands the guilty. A restorative approach to justice assesses the lure of criminality and addresses it.

The desire to commit violence is not inherent to people — it is the consequence of systematic alienation; people seek violent solutions when the process established for enacting change is inaccessible to them. Fueled by disaffection turned to malice, if the guilty were willing to kill and be killed fighting perceived injustice, imagine the consequence of them hearing, “I believe you can be rehabilitated. I want you to become part of my community, and together we will thrive.”

I don't think so either. I also think she is wrong about violence not being inherent to people. I think history proves that humans are the most violent or close to it of all the animals on earth.

Mycroft · Apr 23, 2019

Phys251 said:
Anything that de-radicalizes a radicalized man and prevents him from committing violence, I'm all for.

A bullet to the head will do the job.

Trippy Trekker · Apr 23, 2019

The OP did not provide a link. Two Pinocchios... for misleading context.

Back in 2016, Democratic Minnesota Rep. Ilhan Omar wrote a letter to a judge requesting a more lenient sentence on behalf of a Minnesota man who was accused of trying to join ISIS. Abdirahman Yasin Daud was one of two young men arrested in San Diego in April 2015. They were a part of a larger group of nine that was arrested for trying to join ISIS. Daud specifically was caught trying to buy fake passports in order to travel to Syria. Federal prosecutors requested Daud spend 30 years in prison followed by a lifetime of supervised release. Omar was one of the 13 people to write letters to Judge Michael Davis on Daud’s behalf.

FACT CHECK: Did Rep. Ilhan Omar Call for Lighter Sentences for Would-Be ISIS Recruits?

Gaius46 · Apr 23, 2019

POLL: Would terrorists be swayed by a "system of compassion?"

The OP is a nice shiny example of one of the problems we have with radicals. We treat them as caricatures. We’re supposed to look inside people we don’t know and decide how’d they react to compassion. Hell the OP doesn’t even bother to tell us what they did - the fact that they’re terrorists should be enough for us to conclude that they’re emotionless killing machines that deserve life plus 50 or maybe a bullet in the head.

Maybe they do. Who knows. But then maybe they don’t. People aren’t labels. And all people that you affix a label to don’t all act the same way.

Deuce · Apr 23, 2019

Mycroft said:
A bullet to the head will do the job.

Problem is that it creates more terrorists. "Americans summarily execute their prisoners! Look how evil they are!"

You want America to be the "good guys," you gotta act like it.

Tigerace117 · Apr 23, 2019

Risky Thicket said:
Compassion at what point in their lives and by whom?

Beyond that, how's invading their countries, seizing their natural resources, attempting to impose our values and religions on them, destroying the cities and villages, killing their women and children and innocents, destroying their historical sites and destroying their mosques working out for the U.S.?

Yeah, we definitely shouldn’t have tried to keep the people of Somalia from starving decades ago. Clearly that was a mistake. US evillllllll :roll:

Which countries have we “attempted to impose our religion on”? What “values” have we so evillllly imposed? Democracy? Not machine gunning little girls for going to school?

Don’t forget the age old left wing myth about things all being for the oil/insert other nature resource here!

Cassandra · Apr 23, 2019

Tigerace117 said:
Yeah, we definitely shouldn’t have tried to keep the people of Somalia from starving decades ago. Clearly that was a mistake. US evillllllll :roll:

Which countries have we “attempted to impose our religion on”? What “values” have we so evillllly imposed? Democracy? Not machine gunning little girls for going to school?

Don’t forget the age old left wing myth about things all being for the oil/insert other nature resource here!

So exactly how else would you explain the U.S. support for the toxic, violent Saudis?

eohrnberger · Apr 23, 2019

Tigerace117 said:
Yeah, we definitely shouldn’t have tried to keep the people of Somalia from starving decades ago. Clearly that was a mistake. US evillllllll :roll:

Which countries have we “attempted to impose our religion on”? What “values” have we so evillllly imposed? Democracy? Not machine gunning little girls for going to school?

Don’t forget the age old left wing myth about things all being for the oil/insert other nature resource here!

Agreed.

Cassandra said:
So exactly how else would you explain the U.S. support for the toxic, violent Saudis?

Not all of the Saudis are toxic or violent. Just the Wahhabi Islamic sect.

Believe it or not, the present King of Saudia Arabia is a reformer, moving more to moderate some long held restrictions such as women driving and holding jobs, if I recall correctly.

Divine_Wind · Apr 23, 2019

Ouroboros said:
Ilhan Omar thinks so. I do not.

Here's the text of her Nov 8 letter pleading for leniency of nine convicted terrorists. Agree with her or disagree?

___________

As you undoubtedly deliberate with great caution the sentencing of nine recently convicted Somali-American men, I bring to your attention the ramifications of sentencing young men who made a consequential mistake to decades in federal prison. Incarcerating 20-year-old men for 30 or 40 years is essentially a life sentence. Society will have no expectations of the to be 50- or 60-year-old released prisoners; it will view them with distrust and revulsion. Such punitive measures not only lack efficacy, they inevitably create an environment in which extremism can flourish, aligning with the presupposition of terrorist recruitment: “Americans do not accept you and continue to trivialize your value. Instead of being a nobody, be a martyr.”

The best deterrent to fanaticism is a system of compassion. We must alter our attitude and approach; if we truly want to affect [sic] change, we should refocus our efforts on inclusion and rehabilitation. A long-term prison sentence for one who chose violence to combat direct marginalization is a statement that our justice system misunderstands the guilty. A restorative approach to justice assesses the lure of criminality and addresses it.

The desire to commit violence is not inherent to people — it is the consequence of systematic alienation; people seek violent solutions when the process established for enacting change is inaccessible to them. Fueled by disaffection turned to malice, if the guilty were willing to kill and be killed fighting perceived injustice, imagine the consequence of them hearing, “I believe you can be rehabilitated. I want you to become part of my community, and together we will thrive.”

Disagree with her although I can concede a few points. We'll beat terrorism by compassion and support for those being dominated by the terrorists, not the terrorists themselves. While I think 20 year olds are too easily misled, a good reason to 1) NOT drop the voting age to 16 and 2) raise the voting age to 25, they should still pay a penalty. If they haven't killed anyone, I can see 10 years as a sentence. If they have murdered people, then they should serve the same sentence as murderers.

noonereal · Apr 23, 2019

Ouroboros said:
Would terrorists be swayed by a "system of compassion?"

That is like asking if a TRumpet can be swayed by logic.

Some things are simply never gonna happen.

Tigerace117 · Apr 23, 2019

Cassandra said:
So exactly how else would you explain the U.S. support for the toxic, violent Saudis?

Because they were slightly better than any of their toxic, violent neighbors.

Waddy · Apr 24, 2019

For the most part, the West treats people better than the terrorists own homelands. No matter what is done going forward, there will always be people who want to kill other people.

ajn678 · Apr 24, 2019

Strange how much love she has for violent human garbage. I find it extremely hard to believe that she doesn't harbor animosity towards the United States as well as the Jewish people.

VanceMack · Apr 24, 2019

Anyone that thinks you can sway terrorists with compassion should take you ass there tomorrow and give it a whirl. Man...especially if you are a leftist, woman, gay, maybe trans? Oh ****...they would LOVE you.

Make sure someone documents your efforts for posterity sake.

Masterhawk · Apr 24, 2019

you forgot to add the poll

Xelor · Apr 24, 2019

Ouroboros said:
Ilhan Omar thinks so. I do not.

Here's the text of her Nov 8 letter pleading for leniency of nine convicted terrorists. Agree with her or disagree?

___________

As you undoubtedly deliberate with great caution the sentencing of nine recently convicted Somali-American men, I bring to your attention the ramifications of sentencing young men who made a consequential mistake to decades in federal prison. Incarcerating 20-year-old men for 30 or 40 years is essentially a life sentence. Society will have no expectations of the to be 50- or 60-year-old released prisoners; it will view them with distrust and revulsion. Such punitive measures not only lack efficacy, they inevitably create an environment in which extremism can flourish, aligning with the presupposition of terrorist recruitment: “Americans do not accept you and continue to trivialize your value. Instead of being a nobody, be a martyr.”

The best deterrent to fanaticism is a system of compassion. We must alter our attitude and approach; if we truly want to affect [sic] change, we should refocus our efforts on inclusion and rehabilitation. A long-term prison sentence for one who chose violence to combat direct marginalization is a statement that our justice system misunderstands the guilty. A restorative approach to justice assesses the lure of criminality and addresses it.

The desire to commit violence is not inherent to people — it is the consequence of systematic alienation; people seek violent solutions when the process established for enacting change is inaccessible to them. Fueled by disaffection turned to malice, if the guilty were willing to kill and be killed fighting perceived injustice, imagine the consequence of them hearing, “I believe you can be rehabilitated. I want you to become part of my community, and together we will thrive.”

Red:
She's right about that, so I agree with it.

Blue:
That, frustration over their inability to self-actualize, seems to have been a material motivator of a host of recent US terrorists.

Sweden · Apr 24, 2019

Ouroboros said:
Ilhan Omar thinks so. I do not.

Here's the text of her Nov 8 letter pleading for leniency of nine convicted terrorists. Agree with her or disagree?

___________

As you undoubtedly deliberate with great caution the sentencing of nine recently convicted Somali-American men, I bring to your attention the ramifications of sentencing young men who made a consequential mistake to decades in federal prison. Incarcerating 20-year-old men for 30 or 40 years is essentially a life sentence. Society will have no expectations of the to be 50- or 60-year-old released prisoners; it will view them with distrust and revulsion. Such punitive measures not only lack efficacy, they inevitably create an environment in which extremism can flourish, aligning with the presupposition of terrorist recruitment: “Americans do not accept you and continue to trivialize your value. Instead of being a nobody, be a martyr.”

The best deterrent to fanaticism is a system of compassion. We must alter our attitude and approach; if we truly want to affect [sic] change, we should refocus our efforts on inclusion and rehabilitation. A long-term prison sentence for one who chose violence to combat direct marginalization is a statement that our justice system misunderstands the guilty. A restorative approach to justice assesses the lure of criminality and addresses it.

The desire to commit violence is not inherent to people — it is the consequence of systematic alienation; people seek violent solutions when the process established for enacting change is inaccessible to them. Fueled by disaffection turned to malice, if the guilty were willing to kill and be killed fighting perceived injustice, imagine the consequence of them hearing, “I believe you can be rehabilitated. I want you to become part of my community, and together we will thrive.”

It's the great liberal delusion: be nice to bad people and they will be nie to you. Of course the reality is that if you are nice to bad people they will think you are weak and that they can act with impunity.

Omar displays another leftist theme. No one is actually bad - except of course for 'white' men who are all rotten to the core. If bad things are done it always turns out to be our fault.

POLL: Would terrorists be swayed by a "system of compassion?"

Ouroboros

Integrityrespec

Risky Thicket

Sewer Rat

Phys251

Purge evil with Justice

Surrealistik

Cassandra

ecofarm

global liberation

Apocalypse

DEATH TO ANTARCTICA!!!

Perotista

Mycroft

Genius is where you find it.

Trippy Trekker

Gaius46

Deuce

Outer space potato man

Tigerace117

Cassandra

eohrnberger

Divine_Wind

noonereal

Tigerace117

Waddy

ajn678

VanceMack

Less like the tiger...more like the lion.

Masterhawk

Xelor

Sweden

POLL: Would terrorists be swayed by a "system of compassion?"

Sewer Rat

Purge evil with Justice

global liberation

DEATH TO ANTARCTICA!!!

Genius is where you find it.

Outer space potato man

Less like the tiger...more like the lion.

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