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Orlando Terror Attack Live Updates: [READ THE OP BEFORE POSTING]

Zyphlin

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LINK

Forty-nine people are dead and at least 53 injured in the deadliest shooting in American history after a gunman opened fire and took hostages inside the Pulse gay nightclub in Orlando, Fla.

What we know:
• The gunman has been identified as 29-year-old Omar Mateen, an American citizen who was born in New York.
• Dozens of victims remain hospitalized, many in critical condition .
• Mateen was killed by law enforcement after he took hostages during an hours-long siege.
• He used a legally purchased assault rifle and handgun , which he had bought in the last 12 days. He also had another "device" but it's not clear what that was.
• Mateen lived in the area of Fort Pierce, Fla., about 120 miles south of Orlando, and worked as a private security officer .
• Investigators are operating under the theory that the attack was inspired by Islamic State .
• Mateen had been interviewed by the FBI twice and had once been on a terrorist watch list .
• President Obama called the shooting an act of terror that was an attack on all Americans.

Moderator's Warning:
Alright folks, this is getting restarted and some simple ground rules set.

This thread is for discussing the shooting that occurred in Orlando. Please read that again and understand I mean this literally. It is for discussing THE SHOOTING. This is a *breaking news* thread, and it should be used only for posts directly discussing the story itself and/or relaying new news as it breaks concerning the story.

If you want to take this story and make some larger/broader point about gun regulations, Islam, the war on terror, Christians, muslims, Donald Trump or any other politician, conservatives, liberals, homophobia, etc then you should start a new thread in an appropriate section. Any and all of those conversations may be reasonable, but they should not be occurring in this thread. While some of those issues may be referenced here, they should only be done so in a post that is primarily and CLEARLY focused on narrowly discussing this story.

Due to the amount of in thread warnings in the previous thread on this topic, we're going to set the ground rules right off the bat. Any violation of this warning or any of our other forum rules will result in a removal from the thread and points. If you see someone posting something you believe violates this, do not make a post accusing them of such; report it and let the mods deal with it if needed.
 

Erod

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What we also know:

The attacks in Orlando, San Bernardino, Paris, and Belgium have all occurred in 7 months time.

The FBI says there are thousands of similar threats across the US, including some in all 50 states.

The FBI says Middle Easterers are trying to enter illegally through the Mexican borders.

Immigrants are pouring illegally into the US by thousands per week.
 

PoS

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What we also know:

The attacks in Orlando, San Bernardino, Paris, and Belgium have all occurred in 7 months time.

The FBI says there are thousands of similar threats across the US, including some in all 50 states.

The FBI says Middle Easterers are trying to enter illegally through the Mexican borders.

Immigrants are pouring illegally into the US by thousands per week.

The shooter was born in NY, he isnt an immigrant.
 

JoeTrumps

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The shooter was born in NY, he isnt an immigrant.

exactly. If they can radicalized someone BORN HERE than someone coming from an islamic country(with a history of extremism) is TWICE as likely to be indoctrinated ISIS ideology. good point. We'll see if Trump can fix that for ya.
 

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Moderator's Warning:
Folks, the first thread ban has already been handed out. I suggest if you see someone giving bait that isn't narrowly discussing this actual event that you don't take the bait, or you may get caught up in the chain of moderator action. Last warning/indication I'm going to give in this thread
 

tres borrachos

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Looking at the OP it says 49 dead. I've been busy and away from the telly all day. Did the death count go down?
 
Last edited:

Top Cat

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That man gets more insufferable by the minute.

Looking at the OP it says 49 dead. I've been busy and away from the telly all day. Did the death count go down?

I don't know. Hopefully yes. After reading the warnings I deleted my post.
 

tres borrachos

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From the link in the OP:

FBI director: Mateen claimed loyalty to Islamist groups that are opposed to each other

Orlando gunman Omar Mateen told a 911 dispatcher he was attacking an LGBT nightclub on behalf of the leader of the Islamic State, but he also expressed solidarity with the 2013 Boston Marathon bombers and an American suicide bomber in Syria who was not affiliated with Islamic State, FBI's Director James Comey said Monday.

Comey said Mateen's statements added "confusion" about his inspiration for the attack, because Mateen had expressed loyalty to Islamist groups and figures that are opposed to each other.

While working as a courthouse guard in 2013, Mateen made "inflammatory and contradictory" statements to co-workers about having relatives in Al Qaeda, the radical Sunni terrorist group, Comey said. Mateen also claimed to be a member of Hezbollah, Lebanon's Shiite militia, and his remarks drew an 11-month FBI investigation, Comey said. Both groups oppose Islamic State.


He sounds like a wannabe. A very confused young man.
 

humbolt

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That man gets more insufferable by the minute.

Looking at the OP it says 49 dead. I've been busy and away from the telly all day. Did the death count go down?

The FBI revised the count to 49 victims and 1 perpetrator rather than counting the perpetrator among the victims. In my opinion, with such events it should always be reported in just that fashion. There should be some distinguishing between the innocent victims and the bad actors.
 

tres borrachos

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The FBI revised the count to 49 victims and 1 perpetrator rather than counting the perpetrator among the victims. In my opinion, with such events it should always be reported in just that fashion. There should be some distinguishing between the innocent victims and the bad actors.

That makes perfect sense humbolt - thank you for explaining.
 

The Mark

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The FBI revised the count to 49 victims and 1 perpetrator rather than counting the perpetrator among the victims. In my opinion, with such events it should always be reported in just that fashion. There should be some distinguishing between the innocent victims and the bad actors.

Ah, that makes sense...I had heard "50 dead" earlier and wondered how that went down. There's still 50 dead, it's just that one of them was the person who killed the other 49.
 

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That makes perfect sense humbolt - thank you for explaining.

I think we can expect that number to fluctuate over the coming days. There was one man who was first thought to be dead, then was said to be alive and in surgery at the hospital, but this morning I received a notification from my employer and he did in fact die. I have not seen his name in the list of victims yet though. It's unclear which people that number includes....those who survived initially but succumbed to their injuries at the hospital or just those who died in the club or some incomplete combination.
 

tres borrachos

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So going back to this deranged POS Mateen, I saw on MSNBC this morning a picture of his current wife and their 3-year old child, whose face was blurred, but the wife wasn't. So he had a steady job, lots of friends, family close by, a young child.....and he does this. How can we even begin to analyze the workings of the minds of these people? Are they seeking absolute martyrdom?
 

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Npr is reporting that the first wife claims he was abusive.

This person was investigated by the FBI it seems that they failed in this case
 

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I've got some issues with what's been reported so far.

1. At this point it's been implied that all of the dead and all of the injured were shot. That just doesn't sound right to me. Stuff has happened at other clubs and there have been many deaths due to trampling and subsequent asphyxiation. I find it strange that we haven't heard anything about that so far.

2. If all 102-103 victims were shot and several were shot multiple times that's a lot of ammunition that got used. One would have to figure that the shooter fired over 200 rounds and that takes time. It's kind of surprising that nobody tried to stop him.

3. The cops waited 3 hours to enter the building. I wasn't there so I don't know the situation but that sure seems like a long time to wait when you KNOW that the perp is willing to kill.

4. I saw a video of the police assault. While there wasn't much to see you could hear the gunfire and somebody expended a whole lot of ammo during the raid. I have to question whether the perp was the only casualty there.

5. The guy in Orlando acted alone, didn't use explosives and took out roughly 1/3 of the club patrons. The Bataclan incident also caused death or injury to roughly 1/3 of the patrons but involved three attackers and explosives. The numbers just seem off for this last incident and lead me to believe that there is more to this story.

I don't think that there's any conspiracy going on here but I'm pretty sure that the current version of the story isn't the one we're going to have once everything gets sorted out.
 

WillyPete

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I don't think that there's any conspiracy going on here but I'm pretty sure that the current version of the story isn't the one we're going to have once everything gets sorted out.

Well, it was 2 AM, so I'd guess very few of the victims were alert and sober. Many were probably close to crashing for the night.
 

ttwtt78640

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Looking at the OP it says 49 dead. I've been busy and away from the telly all day. Did the death count go down?

They subtracted the shooter, who was killed by police, from the victim count.
 

Beaudreaux

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I've got some issues with what's been reported so far.

1. At this point it's been implied that all of the dead and all of the injured were shot. That just doesn't sound right to me. Stuff has happened at other clubs and there have been many deaths due to trampling and subsequent asphyxiation. I find it strange that we haven't heard anything about that so far.

2. If all 102-103 victims were shot and several were shot multiple times that's a lot of ammunition that got used. One would have to figure that the shooter fired over 200 rounds and that takes time. It's kind of surprising that nobody tried to stop him.

3. The cops waited 3 hours to enter the building. I wasn't there so I don't know the situation but that sure seems like a long time to wait when you KNOW that the perp is willing to kill.

4. I saw a video of the police assault. While there wasn't much to see you could hear the gunfire and somebody expended a whole lot of ammo during the raid. I have to question whether the perp was the only casualty there.

5. The guy in Orlando acted alone, didn't use explosives and took out roughly 1/3 of the club patrons. The Bataclan incident also caused death or injury to roughly 1/3 of the patrons but involved three attackers and explosives. The numbers just seem off for this last incident and lead me to believe that there is more to this story.

I don't think that there's any conspiracy going on here but I'm pretty sure that the current version of the story isn't the one we're going to have once everything gets sorted out.

The first reports from the battle are always skewed. You make good points, that some of the dead may have not died from the perpetrator's weapons. Some may have died from being trampled, some may have died from "friendly fire" when the police breached the building, or some may have died of natural causes due to the stress (such as heart attack or seizure).

As the investigation continues, autopsies are conducted, and reports written, we may find out more information. But, we may not. Since there will not be a trial, the public record on this event may be less than transparent or at a minimum, the government reports may be less than forthcoming.
 

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Well, it was 2 AM, so I'd guess very few of the victims were alert and sober. Many were probably close to crashing for the night.

Been a while since you were in your 20's?

I don't know about you but at that point in my life we had either found some companionship or were looking for the "after party". Going home to crash, especially on a Saturday night, was way down on the list of things to do.
 

poweRob

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exactly. If they can radicalized someone BORN HERE than someone coming from an islamic country(with a history of extremism) is TWICE as likely to be indoctrinated ISIS ideology. good point. We'll see if Trump can fix that for ya.

At this point it doesn't seem he was radicalized by ISIS. His exwife said he was violent and bipolar and would frequently rant about homosexuality. His dad said that his son saw two men kissing in public recently and he had his little son with him and it set him off. A mad nut declaring allegiance to ISIS doesn't mean ISIS got to him. It just means he's ****ing nuts.

If they find a link of communication with ISIS later, then you might have something. As of now it looks more like a mentally deficient ****tard went crazy.
 

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I've got some issues with what's been reported so far.

1. At this point it's been implied that all of the dead and all of the injured were shot. That just doesn't sound right to me. Stuff has happened at other clubs and there have been many deaths due to trampling and subsequent asphyxiation. I find it strange that we haven't heard anything about that so far.

2. If all 102-103 victims were shot and several were shot multiple times that's a lot of ammunition that got used. One would have to figure that the shooter fired over 200 rounds and that takes time. It's kind of surprising that nobody tried to stop him.

3. The cops waited 3 hours to enter the building. I wasn't there so I don't know the situation but that sure seems like a long time to wait when you KNOW that the perp is willing to kill.

4. I saw a video of the police assault. While there wasn't much to see you could hear the gunfire and somebody expended a whole lot of ammo during the raid. I have to question whether the perp was the only casualty there.

5. The guy in Orlando acted alone, didn't use explosives and took out roughly 1/3 of the club patrons. The Bataclan incident also caused death or injury to roughly 1/3 of the patrons but involved three attackers and explosives. The numbers just seem off for this last incident and lead me to believe that there is more to this story.

I don't think that there's any conspiracy going on here but I'm pretty sure that the current version of the story isn't the one we're going to have once everything gets sorted out.

A couple of points:

1. I am not surprised by the death count or the fact that the victims were all shot. The club only has one way out and it's the same door the shooter came in through. Everyone scattered looking for a place to hide. Those who were fast enough and had their wits about them ran to the patio and smashed through the fence to make their own way out of there. Everyone else was trapped inside, hiding as best they could. Unfortunately for many of them, that meant they were trapped in the bathroom and the shooter easily mowed them down en masse. One girl recounts that she survived in there by hiding beneath a pile of bodies.

2. The police did take 3 hours to enter, but they weren't doing nothing. It was being treated as a hostage situation and the police were doing things like removing AC units so people could (and did) crawl out through the vents and holes in the walls while he was distracted. They got as many people out as they could until it became clear that he had no intention of willingly letting anyone out.
 

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At this point it doesn't seem he was radicalized by ISIS. His exwife said he was violent and bipolar and would frequently rant about homosexuality. His dad said that his son saw two men kissing in public recently and he had his little son with him and it set him off. A mad nut declaring allegiance to ISIS doesn't mean ISIS got to him. It just means he's ****ing nuts.

If they find a link of communication with ISIS later, then you might have something. As of now it looks more like a mentally deficient ****tard went crazy.

His dad, who IS an immigrant is a supporter of the Mujahideen.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omar_Mateen

At approximately 2:00 a.m. on June 12, 2016, Mateen entered the Pulse nightclub in Orlando, Florida, and began shooting. At 2:22 a.m., he made a 9-1-1 call in which he pledged allegiance to ISIL and also referenced Tamerlan and Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, the Boston Marathon bombers.[34] Mateen took hostages after police arrived and engaged in a shootout with him. At approximately 5:00 a.m. police shot and killed Mateen, ending the attack. In the end, Mateen had killed at least 49 people and injured 53 more. The attack was the deadliest mass shooting in United States history,[a] the deadliest incident of violence against LGBT people in U.S. history,[40] and the deadliest terrorist attack on U.S. soil since September 11, 2001.[24][41]
 

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A couple of points:

1. I am not surprised by the death count or the fact that the victims were all shot. The club only has one way out and it's the same door the shooter came in through. Everyone scattered looking for a place to hide. Those who were fast enough and had their wits about them ran to the patio and smashed through the fence to make their own way out of there. Everyone else was trapped inside, hiding as best they could. Unfortunately for many of them, that meant they were trapped in the bathroom and the shooter easily mowed them down en masse. One girl recounts that she survived in there by hiding beneath a pile of bodies.

2. The police did take 3 hours to enter, but they weren't doing nothing. It was being treated as a hostage situation and the police were doing things like removing AC units so people could (and did) crawl out through the vents and holes in the walls while he was distracted. They got as many people out as they could until it became clear that he had no intention of willingly letting anyone out.

I suspect that there was more than one way out as I can't imagine that a single exit or even a second exit to an enclosed patio would be fire compliant. I may be wrong but that just doesn't sound right.
 

The Mark

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I recall hearing on a live press conference yesterday that the FBI had investigated the attacker in 2013 and 2014, including interviewing him 2-3 times.

But that both investigations were inconclusive.

I'd frankly like more detail on these inconclusive investigations, and why the FBI could not (as in, legally not allowed) or would not go any further.
If it's a matter of legal restrictions, can they be changed without unduly infringing on the rights and freedoms we expect?
If it's not a matter of legal restrictions, then...well I dunno...something got screwed up...
 
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