"Obamacare" is REALLY the ACA

[The Man]

great avatar btw .. i'm a big Social D fan myself

:thumbs:

 

[Thrilla]

Isn't that pretty much how any insurance pool works?

sorta, but not really.

folks generally pay into the insurance pool....they are called premiums.

a single person making 22k a year won't have to pay into the pool now..... it's fee for them.
so roughly 40% of the population will get "free" healthcare provided to them.... the other 60% will pay for it.

 

[Diving Mullah]

sorta, but not really.

folks generally pay into the insurance pool....they are called premiums.

a single person making 22k a year won't have to pay into the pool now..... it's fee for them.
so roughly 40% of the population will get "free" healthcare provided to them.... the other 60% will pay for it.

40% of the population already got the "Free Healthcare" It was called Emergency room, which all paid through the nose!

This way, they have to contribute like the rest of us, which makes the over all cost cheaper, but server limits on why or how the insurance companies can deny coverage or raise their premiums Willy Nelly!

I know this plan is like a Big, LONG, FAT spiky thorny stick up the republican and libertarians butt, but this plan was actually conceived by the very same Republicans who cry murder now, few years back and many Republicans hailed it as a GREAT PLAN!!!!! So what has changed?....


Oh yeah! It got passed a by a Black Democratic President...

So if that seems to THE sore point, my advice would to close your eyes and imagine Barrack Hussein Obama is now a REPUBLICAN President named Bob LilyWhite Pewterschmidt, and perhaps you get to enjoy that stick (just like the other sticks that you really enjoyed when Bush was president)

Diving Mullah

 

[The Man]

40% of the population already got the "Free Healthcare" It was called Emergency room, which all paid through the nose!

This way, they have to contribute like the rest of us, which makes the over all cost cheaper, but server limits on why or how the insurance companies can deny coverage or raise their premiums Willy Nelly!

I know this plan is like a Big, LONG, FAT spiky thorny stick up the republican and libertarians butt, but this plan was actually conceived by the very same Republicans who cry murder now, few years back and many Republicans hailed it as a GREAT PLAN!!!!! So what has changed?....


Oh yeah! It got passed a by a Black Democratic President...

So if that seems to THE sore point, my advice would to close your eyes and imagine Barrack Hussein Obama is now a REPUBLICAN President named Bob LilyWhite Pewterschmidt, and perhaps you get to enjoy that stick (just like the other sticks that you really enjoyed when Bush was president)

Diving Mullah

Those people making $22K/year (and don't have health insurance subsidized by their employer) still won't be able to afford health insurance, only now they will be "taxed" for not being abled to afford it. Health insurance and health care is REALLY REALLY REALLY EXPENSIVE, and the one thing that this plan does not, and will not do, is lower costs and keep them affordable. That is why the majority of Americans, Republicans, Democrats, Conservatives, Liberals, etc., are against it.

 

[Neomalthusian]

40% of the population already got the "Free Healthcare" It was called Emergency room, which all paid through the nose!

What's to say they won't keep over utilizing the ER? It's not like you want to start charging them for it.

This way, they have to contribute like the rest of us, which makes the over all cost cheaper,

A) you have to specify cost of WHAT (the care or the insurance, and B) no it doesn't. In theory it makes per-policyholder premiums decrease, not overall costs, and it's also forcing the companies to accept all applicants and insure people more indiscriminately, which lets premiums rise. Plus, with the consumer base being guaranteed by federal law, what's to keep them from raising rates

I know this plan is like a Big, LONG, FAT spiky thorny stick up the republican and libertarians butt, but this plan was actually conceived by the very same Republicans who cry murder now, few years back and many Republicans hailed it as a GREAT PLAN!!!!! So what has changed?....

Nothing. Republicans lie just as often as their Democrat counterparts. Whatever position du jour boosts their political popularity is what they'll say.

 

[The Man]

One major thing about Obamacare that is a turnoff to me, and to most people is that they call it the "Affordable Care Act", yet they have never defined what exactly they think is affordable. And that's because they themselves do not know. But, we do know that it will not be affordable. "Affordable" to Obama, or any member of Congress or the Senate, who are all wealthy, has a totally different meaning than what is actually affordable to the average American.

 

[johnny_rebson]

"Obamacare", is a pejorative. Its really called the ACA or "Affordable Care Act".

From now on, let's all be less provocative..and call it what it is. The ACA.

You could always call it RomneyCare version 2.0.

 

[johnny_rebson]

well, for someone who makes 15k a year ... they'll get "free" healthcare now... "free" as in " someone else has to pay for it"

Plus we now get Death Panels.

 

[Neomalthusian]

Plus we now get Death Panels.

If true, that would be the only measure that would have a chance at suppressing costs. Someone has to start being denied health care in this free-for-all if we want to suppress our per capita health care expenditures. Death panels would be the be the only PPACA provision I would support, as there'd at least some hint of cost-containment intention.

 

[Stewart]

Those people making $22K/year (and don't have health insurance subsidized by their employer) still won't be able to afford health insurance, only now they will be "taxed" for not being abled to afford it. Health insurance and health care is REALLY REALLY REALLY EXPENSIVE, and the one thing that this plan does not, and will not do, is lower costs and keep them affordable. That is why the majority of Americans, Republicans, Democrats, Conservatives, Liberals, etc., are against it.

People on that kind of money will be eligible for the expanded Medicaid or federal subsidies.
But let's not let facts get in the way of a good story.

 

[Thrilla]

You could always call it RomneyCare version 2.0.

he's fine with pejoratives, as long as they aren't pointed at Democrats...

 

[The Man]

People on that kind of money will be eligible for the expanded Medicaid or federal subsidies.
But let's not let facts get in the way of a good story.

States aren't required to expand Medicaid, and what exactly will those federal subsidies be? They've never said how much they would subsidize (an actual dollar amount or percentage of premium cost). I can guarantee though, even with subsidies, it won't make health insurance "affordable" to people with low income, but too much income for medicaid. Plus, who's paying for the subsidies? They say to start it will be people making over $250K, but what's to keep it that way? Plus, how will Obama's plan lower the costs of health insurance and health care (which is the real problem, and what the majority of Americans want to see fixed, not a government windfall to insurance companies)?

 

[joko104]

You could always call it RomneyCare version 2.0.

So you're voting for Romney as the creator?

 

[joko104]

Those people making $22K/year (and don't have health insurance subsidized by their employer) still won't be able to afford health insurance, only now they will be "taxed" for not being abled to afford it. Health insurance and health care is REALLY REALLY REALLY EXPENSIVE, and the one thing that this plan does not, and will not do, is lower costs and keep them affordable. That is why the majority of Americans, Republicans, Democrats, Conservatives, Liberals, etc., are against it.

Obama care does 2 things;

1. It takes 20% of every health dollar spent and gives it to insurance corporations for nothing but more paperwork in return and
2. It taxes the middle class for healthcare so that property owners and the wealthy don't have to keep paying for free indigent care, which they now pay thru commercial and residential property taxes in addition to income taxes and higher sales taxes. Obama Care is welfare for the rich at the expense of the middle class - no suprise there.

 

[winston53660]

Obama care does 2 things;

1. It takes 20% of every health dollar spent and gives it to insurance corporations for nothing but more paperwork in return and
2. It taxes the middle class for healthcare so that property owners and the wealthy don't have to keep paying for free indigent care, which they now pay thru commercial and residential property taxes in addition to income taxes and higher sales taxes. Obama Care is welfare for the rich at the expense of the middle class - no suprise there.

can you support that with some links?

 

[joko104]

Folks making more than 133% of the Federal Poverty Level and you pay for insurance or pay the $600 a year tax. A single person making over $14,856 would have to pay for insurance (on $14,856, really?) or $600 tax. A married couple with no kids making over $20,122 a year would be required to pay for insurance for 2 or the tax for 2. A family of 4, 2 adults and 2 kids making over $30,656 a year would have to buy insurance for 4 or pay double the tax for the adults. What makes you think it will be affordable to someone attempting to live on $15,000 a year?

They will qualify for food stamps and other aids to help make up the difference.

 

[274ina]

"Obamacare", is a pejorative. Its really called the ACA or "Affordable Care Act".

From now on, let's all be less provocative..and call it what it is. The ACA.

You are correct now.

But when everyone sees how great Obamacare is in a few years. We must keep the name for HISTORY..........

And it will be a massive piece of history.....and Obama wants his name front and center......

 

[274ina]

Folks making more than 133% of the Federal Poverty Level and you pay for insurance or pay the $600 a year tax. A single person making over $14,856 would have to pay for insurance (on $14,856, really?) or $600 tax. A married couple with no kids making over $20,122 a year would be required to pay for insurance for 2 or the tax for 2. A family of 4, 2 adults and 2 kids making over $30,656 a year would have to buy insurance for 4 or pay double the tax for the adults. What makes you think it will be affordable to someone attempting to live on $15,000 a year?

All wrong.

Health Reform Subsidy Calculator - Kaiser Health Reform

As you can figure out. it IS easly affordable for all those people. And thats the YEARLY premium you must pay, so divide by 12.
Also note the max payout in a major medical event under the premiums.

 

[274ina]

One major thing about Obamacare that is a turnoff to me, and to most people is that they call it the "Affordable Care Act", yet they have never defined what exactly they think is affordable. And that's because they themselves do not know. But, we do know that it will not be affordable. "Affordable" to Obama, or any member of Congress or the Senate, who are all wealthy, has a totally different meaning than what is actually affordable to the average American.

Affordable is 2% of your pay. 100% of poverty to 133%.
Affordable is 4-8% of your pay 133% to 400% of poverty
affordable is 9% (or 9.5%) if your employer keeps coverage

I will personaly pay $22 month for my coverage. THAT is affordable.