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Near Miss In Chicago

Yes. The ATC told the smaller aircraft to hold position and the smaller aircraft ignored the command.

Fun question: How many ATCs were on duty?
I have a question for you! Hypothetically speaking, if there were 100,000 ATCs on staff at Midway and the plane ignored the instruction to hold short what difference would that have made?
 
I have a question for you! Hypothetically speaking, if there were 100,000 ATCs on staff at Midway and the plane ignored the instruction to hold short what difference would that have made?
An ATC that had time to look would have seen that the small plane kept moving.
 
An ATC that had time to look would have seen that the small plane kept moving.
And done what? Jumped out of the tower and thrown themselves in front of it? They DID see the Flexjet and DID tell it to stop. It's kind of like when there's a red light and someone runs it. Yu can yell, holler and scream all you like but by the time they get into the intersection there isn't anything you can do.

I get it, half the nation wants to blame Trump for everything including his mere existence but this incident isn't political. It's a case of a pilot with his head up his ass that was incapable of following instructions.
 
I have a question for you! Hypothetically speaking, if there were 100,000 ATCs on staff at Midway and the plane ignored the instruction to hold short what difference would that have made?
I have a question for you! Hypothetically speaking, What if there were no ATC controllers on staff at Midway. would it have made a difference? Pilots are to communicate with each other when using unstaffed airports. What if the plane on the ground ignored the SW pilot saying they were on final and to hold.

I really don't like what if games. It is unproductive.

So what is the point of your question regarding 100,000 ATC's?
 
That was scary. I don't know what the solution is to prevent this from ever happening.

Currently the President's bestie is firing FAA employees. We'll see how that works out.

I guess they haven’t fired enough of them yet to ensure air travel safety. When they do, they will save enough in the budget for the amphetamine supply they will need to provide the “efficient” workforce that remains.

In this case the fault was entirely on the pilot of the private jet that ignored a warning. Must have been a Trump supporter piloting that jet. They never listen.
 
I never said “firing a bunch of them” would help, but why have them if they don’t prevent these ‘incidents’? I’d rather have my flight delayed or cancelled than have it end up in a crash.

Why have any safety workers if accidents happen anyway? Is this a serious question? No, it isn’t. When a plane is already landing it is too late to cancel your flight. You provided no alternative other than the use of a time machine. Maybe genius “inventor” Musk is working on one to accomplish this.
 
And done what? Jumped out of the tower and thrown themselves in front of it? They DID see the Flexjet and DID tell it to stop. It's kind of like when there's a red light and someone runs it. Yu can yell, holler and scream all you like but by the time they get into the intersection there isn't anything you can do.

I get it, half the nation wants to blame Trump for everything including his mere existence but this incident isn't political. It's a case of a pilot with his head up his ass that was incapable of following instructions.
Reissued the command to stop in place and/or advise the inbound plane.

And the ATC shortage is an ongoing problem. It did not happen last week.

The question is "does anyone want to fix it?"
 
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I never said “firing a bunch of them” would help, but why have them if they don’t prevent these ‘incidents’? I’d rather have my flight delayed or cancelled than have it end up in a crash.
If I have 3 officers in a district that needs 9 officers to fully man, then I should get rid of the 3 officers because they can't cover that district?
 
If I have 3 officers in a district that needs 9 officers to fully man, then I should get rid of the 3 officers because they can't cover that district?

Nope, but expect more crime in that district.
 
Nope, but expect more crime in that district.
Then it comes down to this:

There are going to be more near misses and more crashes.

That's all there is to it.
 
So much questionable blame-placing in his thread already.

If the taxing plane was not cleared to cross the landing runway - as airport authorities seem to be claiming - the taxing plane crew is 100% at fault. No plane can taxi across runways - active or not - unless given explicit directions to do so. It's a pre-eminent rule of airport ground-traffic operations

In the Chicago incident, the Southwest plane was arriving from Omaha, Nebraska, and the private jet, a Bombardier Challenger 350, was headed to Knoxville, Tennessee, according to FlightRadar24.

Air traffic control instructed the private jet to turn left on "Runway 4L, cross Runway 31L and hold short of Runway 31C," according to audio from LiveATC.net.


The pilot replies saying, "Alright, left on 2 – uh – 4L, cross the 22, or 13C, Flexjet 560."

Then the air traffic controller on the ground immediately replies to the pilot, "Flexjet 560, negative! Cross 31L, hold short Runway 31C."


Air traffic control audio from the tower also shows the moment the pilot of the Southwest plane chose to perform the go-around to avoid the plane on the runway.


..
 
Wow! Looks vaguely familiar to an experience I had some years ago, while jumpseating a 727 on a trip.
I'll bet the fault is the pilot of the private jet. If not, the ground controller would be my next guess. I seriously doubt it's the pilot of the passenger jet, because he's not landing without clearance.
I hope they find out the cause soon.
I will say, these things are not new, but with the recent attention caused by the DC midair, and the probability of so many passengers aiming their camera phone at everything, we are seeing them brought to our attention more often.
 
Reissued the command to stop in place and/or advise the inbound plane.

And the ATC shortage is an ongoing problem. It did not happen last week.

The question is "does anyone want to fix it?"
This incident had NOTHING to do with a tower failure or a staffing failure in the tower. It was the fault of a pilot that had his head up his ass.
 
Wow! Looks vaguely familiar to an experience I had some years ago, while jumpseating a 727 on a trip.
I'll bet the fault is the pilot of the private jet. If not, the ground controller would be my next guess. I seriously doubt it's the pilot of the passenger jet, because he's not landing without clearance.
I hope they find out the cause soon.
I will say, these things are not new, but with the recent attention caused by the DC midair, and the probability of so many passengers aiming their camera phone at everything, we are seeing them brought to our attention more often.
If you read the thread, the pilot of the small plane was given clear directions, repeated them back incorrectly, and then just cruised out across the runway.
 
The plane that was landing had priority. The aircraft on the ground had been instructed to hold short of the runway and just kept goung
Is this confirmed? I'm wondering if they heard the ground controller's communication. I have no knowledge but just asking. We really have to tighten up all our Air Traffic saftey systems.
 
If you read the thread, the pilot of the small plane was given clear directions, repeated them back incorrectly, and then just cruised out across the runway.
Can you direct me to that bit on information, I've not seen that.
That would have been my first guess, that the private jet was in error, but I've not seen anything that said he blew through a ground controllers clearance.
 
Can you direct me to that bit on information, I've not seen that.
That would have been my first guess, that the private jet was in error, but I've not seen anything that said he blew through a ground controllers clearance.
Post 62.
 
I hope that private plane was impounded and the people on board taken for questioning.

This is just my opinion but it looked like the pilots thought they could just bully everyone out the way without consequence and I have a feeling it was on the orders of some twat in the plane who has a god complex.

I could be wrong though.
 
For those who don't want to click on fix.
Edit
In all fairness I think this was a failure to do what they were told
Audio from the air traffic control tower indicates that planes were told to hold position at the crossroad as a Southwest flight was attempting to land.
 
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In the Chicago incident, the Southwest plane was arriving from Omaha, Nebraska, and the private jet, a Bombardier Challenger 350, was headed to Knoxville, Tennessee, according to FlightRadar24.

Air traffic control instructed the private jet to turn left on "Runway 4L, cross Runway 31L and hold short of Runway 31C," according to audio from LiveATC.net.


The pilot replies saying, "Alright, left on 2 – uh – 4L, cross the 22, or 13C, Flexjet 560."

Then the air traffic controller on the ground immediately replies to the pilot, "Flexjet 560, negative! Cross 31L, hold short Runway 31C."


Air traffic control audio from the tower also shows the moment the pilot of the Southwest plane chose to perform the go-around to avoid the plane on the runway.


..

Thanks. That would seem to do it.
 
Based upon the “call for number, pilot deviation” transmission, it appears ATC knows who they think is at fault.

That’s same as pap telling you to go “cut a switch,” imo.

Part of my job is coordinating air ops for wildfires - I've never given a telephone number to a pilot before, but there have been a few times when I probably should have.
 
Part of my job is coordinating air ops for wildfires - I've never given a telephone number to a pilot before, but there have been a few times when I probably should have.
I was only ever a student pilot in and out of uncontrolled airports. An earlier poster made a cryptic post with the dreaded phrase and I had to research it.
 
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