Mueller Knowingly Lied to Us (1 Viewer)

[iguanaman]

No, I stated

Mueller lied to the American public by stating he couldn't make recommendations and that his hands were tied by the OLC opinion

He said "If we could have exonerated the President we would have". How is your grasp of the English language?

 

[Redress]

The difference between a special counsel and an independent counsel is obligations to the DOJ. Nothing in either counsel precludes reporting criminal activities to the AG's office. That was the point.

That is far from the only difference. I strongly suggest doing some research.

 

[Condor060]

Except for the Office of Legal Counsel's opinion on indicting a sitting President. And while you may fall for Barr's cute trick, Meuller was correct that he would not be able to accuse the President of a crime when he is unable to defend himself in a court of law.

Mueller wasn't charged with indicting or charging a sitting president. Barr confirmed (as most people already knew) Muellers job was to investigate and recommend criminal activities found to the AG.

Why would you spend 30 million and 2 years on a process that can't deliver anything? How could you even consider that?

 

[Thorgasm]

Mueller wasn't charged with indicting or charging a sitting president. Barr confirmed (as most people already knew) Muellers job was to investigate and recommend criminal activities found to the AG.

Why would you spend 30 million and 2 years on a process that can't deliver anything? How could you even consider that?

Can't deliver anything?

31 indictments ring a bell?
5 or 6 guilty pleas?
Does that count as anything?

 

[veritas1]

Mueller wasn't charged with indicting or charging a sitting president. Barr confirmed (as most people already knew) Muellers job was to investigate and recommend criminal activities found to the AG.

Why would you spend 30 million and 2 years on a process that can't deliver anything? How could you even consider that?

Exactly. They know they are full of crap and so is Mueller. Mueller is trying to breathe life into the moribund corpse of impeachment. If his report speaks for him, as he said, then no phony "statement" was necessary.

 

[veritas1]

Can't deliver anything?

31 indictments ring a bell?
5 or 6 guilty pleas?
Does that count as anything?

Since it has zero to do with collusion, no.

 

[Condor060]

He said "If we could have exonerated the President we would have". How is your grasp of the English language?

Yeah, he also stated (If we had had confidence that the president clearly did not commit a crime, we would have said so)
So the other side of that would have to be, (If we had had confidence he had commuted a crime we would have said so)

Pretty misleading statements and thrown out there just to make a dig. Very irresponsible for any special counsel to make such claims without actually making a recommendation.

 

[Lutherf]

Difference Between Special Counsel and Independent Counsel | C-SPAN.org

Rosenstein gives a decent overview of the differences but, frankly, nothing he says answers the question at hand.

Condor is right. Mueller WAS NOT prohibited by the OLC guidance from presenting the AG with a finding that Trump had committed crimes warranting prosecution. Since Mueller worked for Barr it would have been Barr's call whether OLC guidelines prevented indictment or not. Furthermore, if Mueller had come up with a reasonable basis for prosecution and if Barr had agreed with Mueller's findings the whole case could have been brought to the appropriate House and Senate committees. Those committees could have then initiated the impeachment process and, if impeached and removed from office, the president could be criminally prosecuted.

Condor posted the entire 39 page OLC advice for everyone to read. It should also be noted that there really weren't any substantive changes to this advice between 1973 and the present other than the fact that after Clinton it incorporated guidance regarding the prosecution of a sitting president for crimes committed BEFORE he took office.

 

[Trump]

Can't deliver anything?

31 indictments ring a bell?
5 or 6 guilty pleas?
Does that count as anything?

Process crimes...ALL

nothing to do with Trump Campaign conspiring with Russia

 

[Rexedgar]

Well, I learned something today! I was trying to figure out why there was a roaring fire in the background of Barr’s recent interview; turns out Barr is in Alaska.

 

[Condor060]

Can't deliver anything?

31 indictments ring a bell?
5 or 6 guilty pleas?
Does that count as anything?

That wasn't the initiation of the investigation. He was charged with finding if Trump or his campaign colluded with Russia or conspired to collude. And you are saying he can't deliver on Trump because of the OLC meaning this was instigated with no ability to present any findings on Trump.

The other charges are just fallout from the original investigation. Point being, why start an investigation into Trump if you can't deliver at the end. Mueller could have delivered and made his recommendation but he found no crimes to recommend and now tries to blame the OLC which is BS. Even Barr cleared that up yesterday

 

[Thorgasm]

Rosenstein gives a decent overview of the differences but, frankly, nothing he says answers the question at hand.

Condor is right. Mueller WAS NOT prohibited by the OLC guidance from presenting the AG with a finding that Trump had committed crimes warranting prosecution. Since Mueller worked for Barr it would have been Barr's call whether OLC guidelines prevented indictment or not. Furthermore, if Mueller had come up with a reasonable basis for prosecution and if Barr had agreed with Mueller's findings the whole case could have been brought to the appropriate House and Senate committees. Those committees could have then initiated the impeachment process and, if impeached and removed from office, the president could be criminally prosecuted.

Condor posted the entire 39 page OLC advice for everyone to read. It should also be noted that there really weren't any substantive changes to this advice between 1973 and the present other than the fact that after Clinton it incorporated guidance regarding the prosecution of a sitting president for crimes committed BEFORE he took office.

Would you like a link to the Meuller report?

Read the full Mueller report - CNNPolitics

 

[Condor060]

I think the entire purpose of this public non statement was to beg gonadler not to drag his butt in front of Congress...please...

Lets watch and see if mueller takes retirement in a country with no extradition. to the US..

My other theory is that mueller is a trump infiltrator and is egging on the democrats to destroy themselves. This concerns me. It is good to have democrats around to remind us exactly how badly things can go.

I think you have a much better grasp on this than most here and I would certainly no exclude a lot of what you are stating.

 

[Thorgasm]

Process crimes...ALL

nothing to do with Trump Campaign conspiring with Russia

Hacking the DNC email is a process crime?

 

[Lutherf]

Would you like a link to the Meuller report?

Read the full Mueller report - CNNPolitics

I appreciate your expertise in linking to various stuff. You have showed a real talent for finding links and embedding them in posts. However, I'm looking for something that goes beyond the link and actually offers some personal perspective regarding the subject of discussion.

 

[Thorgasm]

That wasn't the initiation of the investigation. He was charged with finding if Trump or his campaign colluded with Russia or conspired to collude. And you are saying he can't deliver on Trump because of the OLC meaning this was instigated with no ability to present any findings on Trump.

The other charges are just fallout from the original investigation. Point being, why start an investigation into Trump if you can't deliver at the end. Mueller could have delivered and made his recommendation but he found no crimes to recommend and now tries to blame the OLC which is BS. Even Barr cleared that up yesterday

Actually, he was charged with investigating Russia's interference in the 2016 election. Trump and his campaign got themselves sucked into it. "Russia, if you are listening..."

 

[Condor060]

Exactly. They know they are full of crap and so is Mueller. Mueller is trying to breathe life into the moribund corpse of impeachment. If his report speaks for him, as he said, then no phony "statement" was necessary.

I would have to agree with you but another poster made a very interesting theory. What if Mueller purposely made his statement to egg on Democrats to Impeach for the benefit of Trump? Since we already know you will never get 20 Repubs in the senate to convict and the house has a lot of elected Dems from red states, what would be the fallout if these Dems vote for a process they know will never happen?

 

[Thorgasm]

I appreciate your expertise in linking to various stuff. You have showed a real talent for finding links and embedding them in posts. However, I'm looking for something that goes beyond the link and actually offers some personal perspective regarding the subject of discussion.

Let me guess, you haven't read the report?

 

[Trump]

Hacking the DNC email is a process crime?

please provide exact verbiage in Mueller report which says Russia did that? does not exist

Mueller report says "It appears Russia...we don't know for sure who hacked or stole DNC emails

 

[veritas1]

I would have to agree with you but another poster made a very interesting theory. What if Mueller purposely made his statement to egg on Democrats to Impeach for the benefit of Trump? Since we already know you will never get 20 Repubs in the senate to convict and the house has a lot of elected Dems from red states, what would be the fallout if these Dems vote for a process they know will never happen?

I don't buy that theory. Mueller's all Dem team was a clear indicator that he had no use for Trump. He must have figured if anyone could ferret out something, they would. Trump is going to win, impeachment or no impeachment and I have no doubt that Mueller's intention was not to help Trump, even though impeachment actually does.

 

[Thorgasm]

please provide exact verbiage in Mueller report which says Russia did that? does not exist

Mueller report says "It appears Russia...we don't know for sure who hacked or stole DNC emails

Where do you get this propaganda?

By no later than April 12, 2016, the GRU had gained access to the DCCC computer network using the credentials stolen from a DCCC employee who had been successfully spearphished the week before.

 

[Condor060]

That is far from the only difference. I strongly suggest doing some research.

Independent counsel is appointed by a Federal Judge and is not mandated to follow DOJ procedures. Special Counsel in appointed by the DOJ and is mandated to followed DOJ criteria. Thats pretty much it in a nutshell.

My distinction here is not the differences between the two, but the common denominators between the two being EITHER counsel can recommend criminal activities and charges to the Attorney General. Any other differences have no value to this determination.

 

[Trump]

Where do you get this propaganda?

link?

 

[Condor060]

Actually, he was charged with investigating Russia's interference in the 2016 election. Trump and his campaign got themselves sucked into it. "Russia, if you are listening..."

Oh pleeeeeease. Seems you are the only one who might even consider that. The headlines from day one were Trump collusion, 24 hours a day for 2 solid years and how Mueller would take Trump down. We now know this investigation was bought and paid for up front hence why you are going to see the declassification of the FISA warrant information.

I still get a chuckle out of Dems lobbing this big ball of BS because Trump stated at a rally in jest (Hey Russia, if you're listening, how about sending over Hillarys emails) Thats about the biggest streatch I have ever heard for colluding with Russia. Like I said then and I will say now, if thats all you got, you got nothing. Turns out I was right.

 

[Condor060]

I don't buy that theory. Mueller's all Dem team was a clear indicator that he had no use for Trump. He must have figured if anyone could ferret out something, they would. Trump is going to win, impeachment or no impeachment and I have no doubt that Mueller's intention was not to help Trump, even though impeachment actually does.

Oh, come on Veritas. I was just starting to have this great fantasy and you shot me right down. Damn it man. Just when I started to like you, you had to reach up and pull me back to reality. Oh well, it was a fun 10 minutes while it lasted