MORE PROGRESS FOR GENDER DYSPHORIA.

[CLAX1911]

Thanks for admitting this incorrect claim. Gender and gender idneity are the same. Gender roles are different.

no gender is a sex role.

Gender identity is a religious belief you hold and you really kind of pushy about it too. Like I would rather have Jehovah's witnesses knocking on my door than you.

Are there any more factually incorrect claims that you want to go on the record about?


When did being scientifically incorrect and supporting discrimination become the moral stance?

you say the words science and scientifically factually as if there's some sort of magical words that somehow make your claims correct.

And I believe supporting discrimination is a moral stance we discriminate against child molesters by not letting them teach in schools. We discriminate against convicted murderers by not letting them buy guns.

To think that it's always wrong no matter what is to misunderstand the word.

And yes we discriminate against males when it comes to female sports because they're males I don't care if they put on a wig in call themselves Sally they're still boys or men.

Do you think school kids dont know? Why are you looking at the crotch of others and then claim to be offended? You're the one being a voyeur.

this is a rather dishonest tactic you and others in your religion resort to when you've been cornered.

You suggest acknowledging the difference between sexes and suggesting that we separate people based on their sex is somehow before heuristic you're essentially calling this person a pervert because you have been owned and the last resort you have is to personally attack somebody.

It's funny winding cried about me doing that to you and I never did and here you are doing it to someone else.

You simply cannot be trusted. You engage in hypocrisy dishonestly and you have posted falsehoods you can't back up anything you say.

So essentially everything you say regarding the subject is questionable.

You did that to yourself

 

[Crunchtime]

Thanks for admitting this incorrect claim. Gender and gender idneity are the same. Gender roles are different.

Are there any more factually incorrect claims that you want to go on the record about?


When did being scientifically incorrect and supporting discrimination become the moral stance?



Do you think school kids dont know? Why are you looking at the crotch of others and then claim to be offended? You're the one being a voyeur.

Somewhere there are words to describe you but I haven’t stooped low enough to find them. My fear where you are concerned is that you might have some influence on other peoples lives. Especially young people that are confused about sex, etc. Your ideology is abhorrent.

 

[ThirdTerm]

You can never find an academic article published in a good medical journal about gender dysphoria, which
it is no longer considered a diagnosable mental illness. Psychiatry has too much sway over the matter.

It is unclear what the role of psychiatry is in the assessment
and treatment of gender dysphoria, now that it is no longer
considered a diagnosable mental illness, and whether there
is still a place for a routine psychosocial assessment. It
could be argued that patients should be deterred from gender
intervention pathways while comorbid mental illness is
treated (Fig. 5). Without long-term follow-up data, it is not
possible to identify those who might reconcile with their
sex and those who might come to deeply regret their medical
and/or surgical transition.

Sex, gender and gender identity: a re-evaluation of the evidence | BJPsych Bulletin | Cambridge Core

Sex, gender and gender identity: a re-evaluation of the evidence - Volume 45 Issue 5

www.cambridge.org

 

[Phys251]

Somewhere there are words to describe you but I haven’t stooped low enough to find them. My fear where you are concerned is that you might have some influence on other peoples lives. Especially young people that are confused about sex, etc. Your ideology is abhorrent.

Says the person with transphobic views. Transphobia is literally getting people killed. Maybe that's OK in your mind?

 

[Crunchtime]

Says the person with transphobic views. Transphobia is literally getting people killed. Maybe that's OK in your mind?

A slur fits your profile. In the meantime young peoples bodies are being butchered in the name of your abhorrent ideology. Own it.

 

[Lisa]

You can never find an academic article published in a good medical journal about gender dysphoria, which
it is no longer considered a diagnosable mental illness. Psychiatry has too much sway over the matter.

You are begging to be proven wrong and I am happy to do it for you. Gender dysphoria is different than incongruent gender identity.

The term “transgender” refers to a person whose sex assigned at birth (i.e. the sex assigned by a physician at birth, usually based on external genitalia) does not match their gender identity (i.e., one’s psychological sense of their gender). Some people who are transgender will experience “gender dysphoria,” which refers to psychological distress that results from an incongruence between one’s sex assigned at birth and one’s gender identity. Though gender dysphoria often begins in childhood, some people may not experience it until after puberty or much later.


People who are transgender may pursue multiple domains of gender affirmation, including social affirmation (e.g., changing one’s name and pronouns), legal affirmation (e.g., changing gender markers on one’s government-issued documents), medical affirmation (e.g., pubertal suppression or gender-affirming hormones), and/or surgical affirmation (e.g., vaginoplasty, facial feminization surgery, breast augmentation, masculine chest reconstruction, etc.). Of note, not all people who are transgender will desire all domains of gender affirmation, as these are highly personal and individual decisions.

It is unclear what the role of psychiatry is in the assessment
and treatment of gender dysphoria, now that it is no longer
considered a diagnosable mental illness, and whether there
is still a place for a routine psychosocial assessment. It
could be argued that patients should be deterred from gender
intervention pathways while comorbid mental illness is
treated (Fig. 5). Without long-term follow-up data, it is not
possible to identify those who might reconcile with their
sex and those who might come to deeply regret their medical
and/or surgical transition.

Sex, gender and gender identity: a re-evaluation of the evidence | BJPsych Bulletin | Cambridge Core

Sex, gender and gender identity: a re-evaluation of the evidence - Volume 45 Issue 5

www.cambridge.org

Why should patients who are diagnosed with gender dysphoria be deterred because that action meets thee definition of conversion therapy.

The regret and desistance rate is less than 5%, or weren't you going to mention that fact?

 

[CLAX1911]

Somewhere there are words to describe you but I haven’t stooped low enough to find them. My fear where you are concerned is that you might have some influence on other peoples lives. Especially young people that are confused about sex, etc. Your ideology is abhorrent.

You this whole idea of medicalizing children because they're confused is messed up.

 

[CLAX1911]

You are begging to be proven wrong and I am happy to do it for you.

but you aren't capable. I've been begging you for years to prove me wrong in you fail at every opportunity.

Gender dysphoria is different than incongruent gender identity.

this is a dogma or chanting or cult speak.

Why should patients who are diagnosed with gender dysphoria be deterred because that action meets thee definition of conversion therapy.

differing isn't conversion to convert means to take them from where they are to some of their place in fact transition and conversion are synonyms.

The regret and desistance rate is less than 5%, or weren't you going to mention that fact?

I'm not sure it's a fact you'd have to prove it and that's going to be pretty difficult because there is not enough long-term data.

 

[Lisa]

You this whole idea of medicalizing children because they're confused is messed up.

Transgender teens are not confused or messed up. They are well aware of their gender idneity and that is is different from their biological sex. Who is telling you trans teens are confused?

 

[CLAX1911]

Transgender teens are not confused or messed up.

So teens are somehow much more knowledgeable than anybody older then them?

Seems like you just support medicalizing them. That's creepy and groomer behavior.

They are well aware of their gender idneity and that is is different from their biological sex. Who is telling you trans teens are confused?

How can they be aware of something that you can't even determine exists in any meaningful way?

This is why people call this grooming.

 

[Lisa]

So teens are somehow much more knowledgeable than anybody older then them?

I didn't say that so dont try to put words into my mouth.

Seems like you just support medicalizing them. That's creepy and groomer behavior.

I support what has been proven to be effective care when it is warranted. The use of hormones is up to the patients, when the diagnosis supports gender identity or dysphoria.

How can they be aware of something that you can't even determine exists in any meaningful way?

How are you aware of your homosexual sexual orientation?

I have proven many times that gender identity is proven to exist and your claims of fashion or other nonsense do not refute decades of medical science

This is why people call this grooming.

There is nothing about grooming in effective care.

 

[CLAX1911]

I didn't say that so dont try to put words into my mouth.

so how can they be experts on their own gender identity when you can't even show that such a thing exists?

I support what has been proven to be effective care when it is warranted.

False you support medicalizing children when no efficacy has been determined.

The use of hormones is up to the patients, when the diagnosis supports gender identity or dysphoria.

that's unethical.

How are you aware of your homosexual sexual orientation?

I got erections as a result of erotic thoughts only of the same sex. A real objective response not just feelings.

I have proven many times that gender identity is proven to exist and your claims of fashion or other nonsense do not refute decades of medical science

You really Believe this shit don't you?

You just engaging in wishful thinking exactly like a religion.

There is nothing about grooming in effective care.

agreed but we're not talking about effective care we're talking about something or the efficacy cannot be determined and in fact reality suggests that it isn't.

Tricking people into receiving so-called treatments that damage them permanently is grooming.

 

[Lisa]

so how can they be experts on their own gender identity when you can't even show that such a thing exists?

A person knows how they feel and can tell someone when they are asked questions such as how long have you felt this way and what does it feel like.

False you support medicalizing children when no efficacy has been determined.
that's unethical.

This is a blatant lie.

Bottom Line​

This search found a robust international consensus in the peer-reviewed literature that gender transition, including medical treatments such as hormone therapy and surgeries, improves the overall well-being of transgender individuals. The literature also indicates that greater availability of medical and social support for gender transition contributes to better quality of life for those who identify as transgender.


Below are the 8 findings of our review, and links to the 72 studies on which they are based. Click here to view our methodology. Click here for a printer-friendly one-pager of this research analysis.


Suggested Citation: What We Know Project, Cornell University, “What Does the Scholarly Research Say about the Effect of Gender Transition on Transgender Well-Being?” (online literature review), 2018.

Research Findings​

1. The scholarly literature makes clear that gender transition is effective in treating gender dysphoria and can significantly improve the well-being of transgender individuals.


2. Among the positive outcomes of gender transition and related medical treatments for transgender individuals are improved quality of life, greater relationship satisfaction, higher self-esteem and confidence, and reductions in anxiety, depression, suicidality, and substance use.


3. The positive impact of gender transition on transgender well-being has grown considerably in recent years, as both surgical techniques and social support have improved.


4. Regrets following gender transition are extremely rare and have become even rarer as both surgical techniques and social support have improved. Pooling data from numerous studies demonstrates a regret rate ranging from .3 percent to 3.8 percent. Regrets are most likely to result from a lack of social support after transition or poor surgical outcomes using older techniques.


5. Factors that are predictive of success in the treatment of gender dysphoria include adequate preparation and mental health support prior to treatment, proper follow-up care from knowledgeable providers, consistent family and social support, and high-quality surgical outcomes (when surgery is involved).


6. Transgender individuals, particularly those who cannot access treatment for gender dysphoria or who encounter unsupportive social environments, are more likely than the general population to experience health challenges such as depression, anxiety, suicidality and minority stress. While gender transition can mitigate these challenges, the health and well-being of transgender people can be harmed by stigmatizing and discriminatory treatment.


7. An inherent limitation in the field of transgender health research is that it is difficult to conduct prospective studies or randomized control trials of treatments for gender dysphoria because of the individualized nature of treatment, the varying and unequal circumstances of population members, the small size of the known transgender population, and the ethical issues involved in withholding an effective treatment from those who need it.

What does the scholarly research say about the effect of gender transition on transgender well-being? | What We Know

Overview We conducted a systematic literature review of all peer-reviewed articles published in English between 1991 and June 2017 that assess the effect of gender transition on transgender well-being. We identified 55 studies that consist of primary research on this topic, of which 51 (93%)...

whatweknow.inequality.cornell.edu

I got erections as a result of erotic thoughts only of the same sex. A real objective response not just feelings.
You really Believe this shit don't you?

A personal attack.

You just engaging in wishful thinking exactly like a religion.
agreed but we're not talking about effective care we're talking about something or the efficacy cannot be determined and in fact reality suggests that it isn't.

Once again you are wrong. See above.

Tricking people into receiving so-called treatments that damage them permanently is grooming.

That is another false accusation. Nobody is being tricked or lied into medical care. You cannot support your claims to suggest otherwise.

 

[CLAX1911]

A person knows how they feel and can tell someone when they are asked questions such as how long have you felt this way and what does it feel like.

we were talking about teenagers here and teenagers feel all sorts of crazy crap. You don't let them act on that because it can have long-lasting and dangerous consequences.

This is a blatant lie.

this is you once again engaging in wishful thinking.

A personal attack.

you can take it personally I'm not sorry. I know it's not personal I'm basing it on what you say.

If you feel attacked it's probably because a part of you knows that I'm correct.

Once again you are wrong. See above.

the above doesn't prove me wrong you are engaging once again in wishful thinking.

That is another false accusation. Nobody is being tricked or lied into medical care. You cannot support your claims to suggest otherwise.

yes I can there are people that got tricked into transition that regret it later in life.

I know you hate these people because they undermine your religion but your religion should be undermined because it's wrong and it preys on children that's ****ed up.

 

[Lisa]

we were talking about teenagers here and teenagers feel all sorts of crazy crap. You don't let them act on that because it can have long-lasting and dangerous consequences.

They are under the care of Drs and psychologists.

this is you once again engaging in wishful thinking.

And you still cant prove that you have even the most basic understanding of what gender identity is. Its amusing that you didn't go to college and you claim it doesn't exist but Drs and psychologists who have a decade or more of formal education and another decade of hands on expeince who can prove that it does exist. Your transphobic opinions are given the attention they deserve, which is absolutely zero. You have yet to post any sources supporting your claims.

Children can understand the concept of sex/gender as early as two and name things correctly in that regard, Dr. Safer says. “However, people develop their understanding of themselves at varying rates depending on interest, language, etc.”

According to the Mayo Clinic, most children typically develop the ability to recognize and label gender groups, such as girl, woman, and feminine, and boy, man, and masculine, between ages 18 and 24 months. Gender identity also develops socially from cues the child is surrounded by, Leikam says. “By the time a child is five-to-six years old, they may have a more rigid gender identity, but socialization and gender cues and norms can be taught and modeled to a child,” she says.

For most people, gender identity becomes fixed in childhood and doesn't develop in puberty and adulthood, although gender expression and/or gender roles may change and evolve, Nichols says. “For transgender/nonbinary people, puberty is extremely distressing, and may even be the first time it really becomes clear to them that they are trans/nonbinary,” she says.

This is because in advance of puberty, male and female bodies are not that different beyond genitalia. “During puberty, secondary sex characteristics develop, making it overwhelmingly clear to trans people that their internal sense of gender identity does not match their body,” Nichols says.

The majority of transgender people present to clinicians in late adolescence or adulthood, Dr. Safer says. This late presentation may be from an inability to articulate gender identity or recognize gender incongruence, or pressure to conform. Some adolescents may report their gender incongruence in order to avoid the “wrong puberty”.

Gender: Understanding Gender Identity, Dysphoria, & More

Gender identity is not about anatomy. It's the way you think about yourself—whether you're trans, nonbinary, cis, or something in between. Here's why its important.

www.psycom.net

you can take it personally I'm not sorry. I know it's not personal I'm basing it on what you say.

If you feel attacked it's probably because a part of you knows that I'm correct.
the above doesn't prove me wrong you are engaging once again in wishful thinking.
yes I can there are people that got tricked into transition that regret it later in life.

You arent correct. You have zero understating of the situation. Obviously nobody cares about your opinions that is a rejection of decades of science. It is highly likely that you lack the intelligence to understand gender identity.

I know you hate these people because they undermine your religion but your religion should be undermined because it's wrong and it preys on children that's ****ed up.

Religion has nothing to do with medical care. As an atheist I have no religion.

Your accusations of me supporting preying on kids are outrageous.

 

[CLAX1911]

They are under the care of Drs and psychologists.

that makes it worse. These are people that should know better and place the patients health as their property but milking them for every penny over the next couple of decades.

And you still cant prove that you have even the most basic understanding of what gender identity is.

I'm not trying to prove that I understand it. I'm asking you to show evidence that it exists. If I'm not even sure it exists I'm not going to try and pretend to understand. That's what charlatans do.

Thank you for pointing out that I'm not a charlatan.

Its amusing that you didn't go to college and you claim it doesn't exist but Drs and psychologists who have a decade or more of formal education and another decade of hands on expeince who can prove that it does exist.

Then why don't they? Not for trans people but for everybody else.

You prove that I have a gender identity outside of just fashion and gender roles.

Why are you and all of your doctors so incompetent at this?

Your transphobic opinions are given the attention they deserve, which is absolutely zero. You have yet to post any sources supporting your claims.

I didn't make any positive claims I just challenged yours and you are attempting to shift the burden of proof because you can't meet the challenge.

Gender: Understanding Gender Identity, Dysphoria, & More

Gender identity is not about anatomy. It's the way you think about yourself—whether you're trans, nonbinary, cis, or something in between. Here's why its important.

www.psycom.net

This doesn't prove there is gender identity it just explains the concept it doesn't show that the concept reflects reality.

I can find sources on the internet that explain how flat Earth works but it doesn't prove that it's the shape of the earth.

You arent correct. You have zero understating of the situation.

You aren't trustworthy.

I'll assume I'm correct until you can show otherwise. Then I'll happily change my position.

Obviously nobody cares about your opinions that is a rejection of decades of science. It is highly likely that you lack the intelligence to understand gender identity.

This is a personal attack. You are attacking my intelligence because of your incompetence.

Religion has nothing to do with medical care. As an atheist I have no religion.

It kind of does. You claim to be atheist but you are in the transgender beliefs and ideology. You quote prophets (Dr.s and therapists) as all knowing. You sight ideological scripture as truth (your psycom link) and you rage at heretics that dare question you.

If you aren't religious you are exactly like religious people. And your ends are congruent with theirs. Convert or transition the gay away.

Your accusations of me supporting preying on kids are outrageous.

Maybe you shouldn't support it than.

 

[Lisa]

that makes it worse. These are people that should know better and place the patients health as their property but milking them for every penny over the next couple of decades.

I'm not trying to prove that I understand it. I'm asking you to show evidence that it exists. If I'm not even sure it exists I'm not going to try and pretend to understand. That's what charlatans do.

With this admission from you this discussion is over. You cannot attempt to have an intelligent discussion about something that you do not understand.

 

[dseag2]

I’m here to argue. It’s called a debate forum. And to stand up for what’s good and call evil, evil. Does that answer your question. I’ve been here arguing since 2018. You just drove up. Get in line.

And you've clearly had a lot on here who have agreed with you over your 6 years in the forum. Once you adjust your view of what is "good and evil" we can have an intelligent conversation. And debating does not = arguing unless you are just angry and bored.

 

[CLAX1911]

With this admission from you this discussion is over.

Because you can't show that the concept exists.

You cannot attempt to have an intelligent discussion about something that you do not understand.

Didn't stop you from trying. You don't understand it either if you did you could explain it.

This is why you don't ever have intelligent discussion despite me giving you multiple opportunities.

You just demand your religious belief be accepted as fact for no other reason than people generally are too afraid to question you.

 

[Phys251]

A slur fits your profile. In the meantime young peoples bodies are being butchered in the name of your abhorrent ideology. Own it.

Hate speech is par for the course for the anti-transgender side. Own it.

 

[CLAX1911]

Hate speech is par for the course for the anti-transgender side. Own it.

Right free speech is on par with the side that is not captive by transgender ideology.

You can pretend that it's a conspiracy against you that it's a sign of anti-transgender. That isn't going to change the way people think about it.

You don't have the right and you absolutely don't have the ability to do that.

 

[dseag2]

Right free speech is on par with the side that is not captive by transgender ideology.

You can pretend that it's a conspiracy against you that it's a sign of anti-transgender. That isn't going to change the way people think about it.

You don't have the right and you absolutely don't have the ability to do that.

Jesus Christ. 30 posts on this topic. Go sell your hatred elsewhere. The fact that you are gay makes me ashamed that I am as well.

 

[CLAX1911]

Jesus Christ. 30 posts on this topic. Go sell your hatred elsewhere.

Why do you have to pretend there is hatred?

The fact that you are gay makes me ashamed that I am as well.

you should learn not to be ashamed of your sexuality.

 

[Crunchtime]

And you've clearly had a lot on here who have agreed with you over your 6 years in the forum. Once you adjust your view of what is "good and evil" we can have an intelligent conversation. And debating does not = arguing unless you are just angry and bored.

Miss me. I don’t need you to find a debate.

 

[Crunchtime]

That might be the dumbest argument ever and if its a trigger point, then you are triggered way too easily. As for reaction score, that is something largely meaningless to people on the right. Our self esteme is higher than the average libs who needs even his most childish retort validated by multiple likes.

Without the “likes” they become victims. Liberals can’t survive without a support group.