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Michigan Residents Could Face 5-Year Prison Sentence, $10,000 Fine for Using Wrong Pronouns

anatta said:
which became Ms. which is fine and not didactic and not confusing
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And when it became Ms. No one knew what to do. Lol

This is all so trite and stupid.
 
anatta said:
it was EZ. use Ms. as a title.. It's not a pronoun.. It may still be acceptable beats the **** outta me
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Not really. Some women were insulted at the latest fad in addressing them.

I call a women however they are introduced. Say they are introduced as mistress, that is what I call them. 😉
 
I'm missing the part where it criminalizes the use of pronouns. That is total BS.

The bill would add "sexual orientation" and "gender identity or expression" as protected classes and criminalize causing a person to "feel terrorized, frightened, or threatened." Seems to me that is a good law. Nobody should be terrorized , frightened or threatened because of their sexual orientation or gender identity. Don't like it ...ignore it . is none of your damn business.
 
Fletch said:
Nah

Fining people for wrong-speak is about as anti 1st Amendment as it gets.
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Should someone be fired if they are being racist to other employees or customers?
 
anatta said:
now she/them/those have done it! 10 grand means never use a pronoun
freebeacon.com

Michigan Residents Could Face 5-Year Prison Sentence, $10,000 Fine for Using Wrong Pronouns

Michigan residents could soon face hefty prison sentences and fines for misgendering someone if a new bill passes the Democrat-controlled State Senate.
freebeacon.com freebeacon.com
Democrats in the state's House of Representatives passed the bill, HB 4474, which would add "sexual orientation" and "gender identity or expression" as protected classes and criminalize causing a person to "feel terrorized, frightened, or threatened."


The bill advanced to the State Senate, where Democrats are expected to send it to Democratic governor Gretchen Whitmer, who would likely sign the legislation. If a victim says he or she is intimidated by another person and is a member of one of the protected classes, the accused person could spend five years in prison or pay a $10,000 fine

It's the latest example of the left pushing its views on gender identity on the public through legislation.

Democrats in California advanced legislation this month to consider a child's "gender affirmation" a part of his or her health, safety, and welfare when it comes to custody disputes, meaning parents who "affirm" their child's transgender status would be favored in a battle for custody.

Department of Health and Human Services assistant secretary Rachel Levine, a transgender doctor appointed by President Joe Biden, said this week that "gender-affirming care," including for minors, is "mental health care."
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Unless I’m misunderstanding this…all they have done is at gender identity as a protected class?

So it would have the same standards and proof of burden as a claim you discriminated against someone for being racist, right?

Why is this a bad thing again exactly once you remove your fear mongering about people getting sent to jail by the woke police?
 
Callen said:
I'm missing the part where it criminalizes the use of pronouns. That is total BS.

The bill would add "sexual orientation" and "gender identity or expression" as protected classes and criminalize causing a person to "feel terrorized, frightened, or threatened." Seems to me that is a good law. Nobody should be terrorized , frightened or threatened because of their sexual orientation or gender identity. Don't like it ...ignore it . is none of your damn business.
Click to expand...
Because it’s not in there. It is no different than not discriminating against someone because of race/sex/religion.
 
anatta said:
now she/them/those have done it! 10 grand means never use a pronoun
freebeacon.com

Michigan Residents Could Face 5-Year Prison Sentence, $10,000 Fine for Using Wrong Pronouns

Michigan residents could soon face hefty prison sentences and fines for misgendering someone if a new bill passes the Democrat-controlled State Senate.
freebeacon.com freebeacon.com
Democrats in the state's House of Representatives passed the bill, HB 4474, which would add "sexual orientation" and "gender identity or expression" as protected classes and criminalize causing a person to "feel terrorized, frightened, or threatened."


The bill advanced to the State Senate, where Democrats are expected to send it to Democratic governor Gretchen Whitmer, who would likely sign the legislation. If a victim says he or she is intimidated by another person and is a member of one of the protected classes, the accused person could spend five years in prison or pay a $10,000 fine

It's the latest example of the left pushing its views on gender identity on the public through legislation.

Democrats in California advanced legislation this month to consider a child's "gender affirmation" a part of his or her health, safety, and welfare when it comes to custody disputes, meaning parents who "affirm" their child's transgender status would be favored in a battle for custody.

Department of Health and Human Services assistant secretary Rachel Levine, a transgender doctor appointed by President Joe Biden, said this week that "gender-affirming care," including for minors, is "mental health care."
Click to expand...
That’s an incredibly dishonest reading of the law. The bill only criminalizes “intimidation” which is defined as a willful course of conduct of harassment that would cause an individual to reasonably feel terrorized, frightened, or threatened. (Paraphrased. My phone isn’t letting me copy the bill text for some reason). It explicitly does not include constitutionally protected speech.

I work in civil anti harassment orders in another state with a similar definition. There is no way something like pronoun use would come close to meeting this definition even if it wasn’t protected by constitutional political speech which it probably is. If anyone were ever prosecuted for simple pronoun use I’ll eat crow but I’m very confident that will not happen.

Fearmongering about things like this or what people were doing yesterday with the SCOTUS 303 decision in the other direction is IMO seriously harmful. Effective in stirring up people’s anger certainly, but harmful.
 
Nomad4Ever said:
Should someone be fired if they are being racist to other employees or customers?
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Apples and oranges.

If someone is so damn offended by the wrong pronoun usage, then maybe that person needs a shrink because they've got one doozy of a fragile brain.
 
Anagram said:
That’s an incredibly dishonest reading of the law. The bill only criminalizes “intimidation” which is defined as a willful course of conduct of harassment that would cause an individual to reasonably feel terrorized, frightened, or threatened.
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Sounds very broad. Should be interesting to see if it survives a court challenge.
 
Roadvirus said:
Sounds very broad. Should be interesting to see if it survives a court challenge.
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A pretty standard definition for harassment. My state has a similar one.

And it’s already the definition. They just added another protected class that carries additional penalties
 
Roadvirus said:
Apples and oranges.

If someone is so damn offended by the wrong pronoun usage, then maybe that person needs a shrink because they've got one doozy of a fragile brain.
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It says nothing about pronouns. It just added gender as a protected class with the same legal protections as stuff like religious beliefs or race.
 
Roadvirus said:
Apples and oranges.

If someone is so damn offended by the wrong pronoun usage, then maybe that person needs a shrink because they've got one doozy of a fragile brain.
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I don't think it is that at all.
causing a person to "feel terrorized, frightened, or threatened."
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I see it as some die hard bigots harassing them on purpose and not someone accidentally using the wrong pronoun.
Here in the south we use a lot of yes Sir/Mam. I can see that as an oopsy waiting to happen but one that can easily be corrected and forgiven.
Not the same as just being a bully.
 
noonereal said:
Sorry, I don't come here to do research.
A valid source is the obligation of the OP.
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Oh for pity's sake

For one, he gave you a source; you're the only one complaining about it.
How in the world is anyone supposed to know what @noonereal considers "valid" sources in the first place?

And second, what would make @noonereal 's list of "valid" sources in any authoritative anyway?
Is there some sticky here listing all of @noonereal 's "valid" sources for OPs? If so, maybe you should share it with us all.

And fwiw, this nonsense has been in the works for at least 6 months now. The only thing new here is that the measure actually passed, sadly.

Page 1 of "research" (Total Time: 15 seconds of copy/paste):
news.yahoo.com

Michigan House passes bill making wrong pronouns a felony, fineable up to $10,000

The Michigan state House of Representatives passed HB 4474, making it a felony to "intimidate" someone by using the wrong gender pronouns. The fine can rise up to $10,000.
news.yahoo.com news.yahoo.com
www.foxnews.com

Michigan House passes bill that could make using wrong pronouns a felony, fineable up to $10,000

The Michigan state House of Representatives passed HB 4474, making it a felony to "intimidate" someone of a protected class with inclusions for gender identity and expression. The fine can rise up to $10,000.
www.foxnews.com www.foxnews.com
www.breitbart.com

Michigan House Dems Pass Bill Making 'Wrong' Pronouns Finable Up to $10,000

Michigan Democrats passed a bill that would make intimidating someone by using "wrong" gender pronouns a felony, finable by up to $10,000.
www.breitbart.com www.breitbart.com
www.nationalreview.com

Michigan (They/Them) Strikes Again | National Review

Michigan lawmakers hope to make using the wrong pronouns a felony.
www.nationalreview.com www.nationalreview.com
headtopics.com

Michigan House passes bill making wrong pronouns a felony, fineable up to $10,000

The Michigan state House of Representatives passed HB 4474, making it a felony to 'intimidate' someone by using the wrong gender pronouns. The fine can rise up to $10,000.
headtopics.com headtopics.com
 
EdwinWillers said:
How in the world is anyone supposed to know what @noonereal considers "valid" sources in the first place?
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Its pretty simply. Any traddition news outlet.
CNN, ABC, NPR, NY TIMES...
 
Whatever happened to the 1st Amendment or "sticks & stones may break my bones but words will never hurt us?'

Even the unmentionable "N" word isn't illegal.
 
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