• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every persons position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Is it a free society?

Is the society described a free one?

  • Yes -- the Laws do not regulate Speech and Press

    Votes: 1 6.7%
  • No -- it is only nominally free

    Votes: 14 93.3%

  • Total voters
    15

SCitizen

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 10, 2014
Messages
2,138
Reaction score
316
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Other
This is a hypothetical and yet very likely society. We call it USA 2026. The First Amendment is still the Law.

There is a large list of proscribed opinions, books, movies, music videos which are offensive to Liberals for different reasons. The laws prohibit neither the media nor individuals to use these materials offensive to Liberals. Yet, by now

-- All major Social Media sites have been pressured to ban anyone expressing proscribed opinions

-- Any individual publicly expressing proscribed opinions is added to the Blacklist. Most companies would not dare to hire blacklisted individuals.

-- Laws against offensive speech are enforced much more strongly in UK 2026 then in USA 2026.
 

coldjoint

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 17, 2016
Messages
14,235
Reaction score
1,453
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
This is a hypothetical and yet very likely society. We call it USA 2026. The First Amendment is still the Law.

There is a large list of proscribed opinions, books, movies, music videos which are offensive to Liberals for different reasons. The laws prohibit neither the media nor individuals to use these materials offensive to Liberals. Yet, by now

-- All major Social Media sites have been pressured to ban anyone expressing proscribed opinions

-- Any individual publicly expressing proscribed opinions is added to the Blacklist. Most companies would not dare to hire blacklisted individuals.

-- Laws against offensive speech are enforced much more strongly in UK 2026 then in USA 2026.

Sounds fascist. It can be done without a dictator?
 

ashurbanipal

DP Veteran
Joined
Dec 8, 2005
Messages
7,324
Reaction score
2,203
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Private
It's not free if companies won't hire people who are blacklisted, or if social media sites are pressured to remove proscribed speech. Certain commonsense rules apply--if someone posts instructions for growing weaponizable anthrax in your bathtub, that should not be covered under free speech protections, for example.
 

SCitizen

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 10, 2014
Messages
2,138
Reaction score
316
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Other
Sounds fascist. It can be done without a dictator?

It can be done if more then 50% of people are against Free Speech. If most people believe in strong Left ideology.
 

SCitizen

DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 10, 2014
Messages
2,138
Reaction score
316
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Other
It's not free if companies won't hire people who are blacklisted, or if social media sites are pressured to remove proscribed speech.

The society would be only nominally free.
 

Winchester

DP Veteran
Joined
Apr 25, 2014
Messages
6,665
Reaction score
6,277
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Other
It can be done if more then 50% of people are against Free Speech. If most people believe in strong Left ideology.

Well it would take more than that. You do know about article 5 don't you? Besides in my experience it's usually the right banning books, liberals just control the media (or so I'm told).
 

grip

Light △ Bender
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Dec 1, 2011
Messages
26,705
Reaction score
10,329
Location
FL - Daytona
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
Well it would take more than that. You do know about article 5 don't you? Besides in my experience it's usually the right banning books, liberals just control the media (or so I'm told).

Spooky wisdom. You must be old?
 

ashurbanipal

DP Veteran
Joined
Dec 8, 2005
Messages
7,324
Reaction score
2,203
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Private
SCitizen said:
The society would be only nominally free.

It might or might not be named a free society. I hear that North Korea calls itself a free society.
 

grip

Light △ Bender
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Dec 1, 2011
Messages
26,705
Reaction score
10,329
Location
FL - Daytona
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
Old is relative. :lol:

It's relative to all subjects when you outclass them in sheer knowledge about the subject matter. They can't even relate, without the years of observance. It's like talking to kids?
 

Paleocon

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Dec 21, 2013
Messages
13,309
Reaction score
1,307
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Very Conservative
This is a hypothetical and yet very likely society. We call it USA 2026. The First Amendment is still the Law.

There is a large list of proscribed opinions, books, movies, music videos which are offensive to Liberals for different reasons. The laws prohibit neither the media nor individuals to use these materials offensive to Liberals. Yet, by now

-- All major Social Media sites have been pressured to ban anyone expressing proscribed opinions

-- Any individual publicly expressing proscribed opinions is added to the Blacklist. Most companies would not dare to hire blacklisted individuals.

-- Laws against offensive speech are enforced much more strongly in UK 2026 then in USA 2026.

There are no free societies.
 

Neomalthusian

DP Veteran
Joined
May 22, 2011
Messages
10,266
Reaction score
3,002
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Centrist
Society and freedom are inherently antithetical. The more free the "society," the less truly societal it is, and the more societal it is, the less free it's going to be.

The most freedom one can have is to live in a place where no societal constraints whatsoever are imposed. But that means there isn't a society.
 

grip

Light △ Bender
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Dec 1, 2011
Messages
26,705
Reaction score
10,329
Location
FL - Daytona
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
Society is by its own very definition both free and constrained at the same time. But through the law it's as free as any other concept can conceive.
 

BitterPill

Ignorance Is Virtue
DP Veteran
Joined
May 16, 2016
Messages
2,768
Reaction score
737
Location
SoCal
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Very Conservative
This is a hypothetical and yet very likely society. We call it USA 2026. The First Amendment is still the Law.

There is a large list of proscribed opinions, books, movies, music videos which are offensive to Liberals for different reasons. The laws prohibit neither the media nor individuals to use these materials offensive to Liberals. Yet, by now

-- All major Social Media sites have been pressured to ban anyone expressing proscribed opinions

-- Any individual publicly expressing proscribed opinions is added to the Blacklist. Most companies would not dare to hire blacklisted individuals.

-- Laws against offensive speech are enforced much more strongly in UK 2026 then in USA 2026.

Hypothetical, certainly, but I disagree with the 'likely' hogwash.

There are laws that regulate free speech in this country right now, and they are even more strict in the UK.
 

spud_meister

Veni, vidi, dormivi!
Dungeon Master
DP Veteran
Joined
Nov 6, 2009
Messages
36,150
Reaction score
21,545
Location
Didjabringabeeralong
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Communist
This is a hypothetical and yet very likely society. We call it USA 2026. The First Amendment is still the Law.

There is a large list of proscribed opinions, books, movies, music videos which are offensive to Liberals for different reasons. The laws prohibit neither the media nor individuals to use these materials offensive to Liberals. Yet, by now

-- All major Social Media sites have been pressured to ban anyone expressing proscribed opinions

-- Any individual publicly expressing proscribed opinions is added to the Blacklist. Most companies would not dare to hire blacklisted individuals.

-- Laws against offensive speech are enforced much more strongly in UK 2026 then in USA 2026.

Yes, freedom goes both ways, and social media sites and businesses have the right to freedom of association.

What would be your remedy to this situation?
 

ajn678

DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 19, 2016
Messages
7,966
Reaction score
3,395
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
If the law is set up to ban certain things, then no it is no longer a "free" society. But freedom is relative. There is no such thing as a truly free nation, because there would be no nation like some have suggested. Any law that is in place, reduces a person's freedom.
 

joG

DP Veteran
Joined
Jul 27, 2013
Messages
43,839
Reaction score
9,638
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Independent
Sounds fascist. It can be done without a dictator?

In relatively wide swathes of Europe the situation is already very much on its way to the situation described. This is happening well supported by the populations albeit acting on populist arguments.
 

BitterPill

Ignorance Is Virtue
DP Veteran
Joined
May 16, 2016
Messages
2,768
Reaction score
737
Location
SoCal
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Very Conservative
In relatively wide swathes of Europe the situation is already very much on its way to the situation described. This is happening well supported by the populations albeit acting on populist arguments.

Perhaps you can provide an example, and if not I understand.
 

ajn678

DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 19, 2016
Messages
7,966
Reaction score
3,395
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
And this is supposed to be a result of populations acting on populist arguments?

We in the US have our own idea of freedom of speech, and European countries often have different attitudes toward freedom of speech. I remember getting into a cab in Nottingham that posted a notice any racial epithets directed at the cab driver were punishable by a fine and even imprisonment.

I was aghast, but it's just a fact of life.

European nations in the EU are supposed to follow EU laws in regards to free speech. They simply aren't doing that. In regards to arresting people for Holocaust denial, or not allowing religious people to dress in a manner that they wish.
 

BitterPill

Ignorance Is Virtue
DP Veteran
Joined
May 16, 2016
Messages
2,768
Reaction score
737
Location
SoCal
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Very Conservative
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/24/opinion/24iht-edrojan.html?_r=0

Here is an article about the current situation with European nations and freedom of speech.

And this is supposed to be a result of populations acting on populist arguments?

We in the US have our own idea of freedom of speech, and European countries often have different attitudes toward freedom of speech. I remember getting into a cab in Nottingham that posted a notice any racial epithets directed at the cab driver were punishable by a fine and even imprisonment.

I was aghast. The idea I might insult the person who was, to be sure, behind the wheel seemed so farfetched, but it's just a fact of life in Britain I guess.
 

BitterPill

Ignorance Is Virtue
DP Veteran
Joined
May 16, 2016
Messages
2,768
Reaction score
737
Location
SoCal
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Very Conservative
European nations in the EU are supposed to follow EU laws in regards to free speech. They simply aren't doing that. In regards to arresting people for Holocaust denial, or not allowing religious people to dress in a manner that they wish.

It looks like the US is a bit more liberal than Europe when it comes to free speech, at least in a general sense.

I don't actually see the problem with that.
 

ajn678

DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 19, 2016
Messages
7,966
Reaction score
3,395
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
It looks like the US is a bit more liberal than Europe when it comes to free speech, at least in a general sense.

I don't actually see the problem with that.

You asked for examples of a move in Europe to limit viewpoints that the populace didn't agree with. That's all I was referring to.
 
Top Bottom