Is it a free society?

[Gaztopian]

The conservative counterrevolution has already commenced; thus, the U.S will be heading in the opposite direction. Nevertheless, no need to leap in time and consider the fanciful to judge that reality, as it's been the norm for the past few years, demonstrating aplenty the impossibility of freedom of expression and the inanity of its advocates.

 

[BitterPill]

You asked for examples of a move in Europe to limit viewpoints that the populace didn't agree with. That's all I was referring to.

You said, "In relatively wide swathes of Europe the situation is already very much on its way to the situation described...."

The situation described is:

-- All major Social Media sites have been pressured to ban anyone expressing proscribed opinions

-- Any individual publicly expressing proscribed opinions is added to the Blacklist. Most companies would not dare to hire blacklisted individuals.

-- Laws against offensive speech are enforced much more strongly in UK 2026 then in USA 2026.​

and I am asking for an example of that, the blacklisting and social media site suppression. Can you provide one?

If not, I will understand.

 

[BitterPill]

The conservative counterrevolution has already commenced; thus, the U.S will be heading in the opposite direction. Nevertheless, no need to leap in time and consider the fanciful to judge that reality, as it's been the norm for the past few years, demonstrating aplenty the impossibility of freedom of expression and the inanity of its advocates.

It is what it is. One benefit of free speech, unexpected or otherwise, is the yahoos sure stand out. That's for sure.

 

[ajn678]

You said, "In relatively wide swathes of Europe the situation is already very much on its way to the situation described...."

The situation described is:

-- All major Social Media sites have been pressured to ban anyone expressing proscribed opinions

-- Any individual publicly expressing proscribed opinions is added to the Blacklist. Most companies would not dare to hire blacklisted individuals.

-- Laws against offensive speech are enforced much more strongly in UK 2026 then in USA 2026.​

and I am asking for an example of that, the blacklisting and social media site suppression. Can you provide any?

If not, I will understand.

I actually did not say that, it was someone else. As far as social media goes, Twitter has begun removing confirmed, official accounts of people that don't fall in line with their policy.

Milo Yiannopoulos @Nero unverified by Twitter - Business Insider

Actions like this can suggest that down the line, punishments will be harsher. Facebook has also done similiar things as well. Now, these companies can do whatever they want. They own the sites. But that is not the question at hand.

Nations are already attempting to stifle speech that they don't agree with. As is evident by this recent case.

Polish move to strip Holocaust expert of award sparks protests | World news | The Guardian

On 15 October 2015, Polish Prosecution opened a libel probe against Gross. The office was acting under a paragraph of the criminal code that "provides that any person who publicly insults the Polish nation is punishable by up to three years in prison"

https://www.yahoo.com/news/warsaw-acts-over-claim-poles-killed-more-jews-155700210.html?ref=gs

 

[BitterPill]

I actually did not say that, it was someone else.

I quoted you verbatim. I know because I copied it from your text.

As far as social media goes, Twitter has begun removing confirmed, official accounts of people that don't fall in line with their policy.

Milo Yiannopoulos @Nero unverified by Twitter - Business Insider

Do you have any proof a European government or the EU is responsible for twitter's policies and actions?

Actions like this can suggest that down the line, punishments will be harsher. Facebook has also done similiar things as well. Now, these companies can do whatever they want. They own the sites. But that is not the question at hand.

Nations are already attempting to stifle speech that they don't agree with. As is evident by this recent case.

Polish move to strip Holocaust expert of award sparks protests | World news | The Guardian

Unless you can convince me that the EU or one of its member states tells twitter what its policies are, I don't think you have a leg to stand on. I am just hoping you can grow one by providing some evidence.

 

[ajn678]

I quoted you verbatim.



Do you have any proof a European government or the EU is responsible for twitter's policies and actions?



Unless you can convince me that the EU or one of its member states tells twitter what its policies are, I don't think you have a leg to stand on. I am just hoping you can grow one by providing some evidence.

I did not state that. Go look who wrote it. It was not me. Also, no where in the initial post does it state the government needs to be the one pressuring companies to do it. The simple fact is that these issues are moving towards a more restrictive manner of free speech, that is not what the European Union nations should be about.

 

[BitterPill]

I did not state that. Go look who wrote it. It was not me. Also, no where in the initial post does it state the government needs to be the one pressuring companies to do it. The simple fact is that these issues are moving towards a more restrictive manner of free speech, that is not what the European Union nations should be about.

Yeah.

Looks like I fubared, mistook you for Jog.

My apologies all around, and especially to you, Ajn.

 

[ajn678]

Yeah.

Looks like I fubared, mistook you for Jog.

My apologies all around, and especially to you, Ajn.

Its okay, I understand why it might have seemed like that. I in a sense hijacked your response to him with my own reply.

 

[BitterPill]

Its okay, I understand why it might have seemed like that. I in a sense hijacked your response to him with my own reply.

Thanks, you are very kind.

And don't forget, like I said, free speech lets the yahoos be known.

Yahoo!

So I'm going to leave you with some Skynyrd:

 

[joG]

Perhaps you can provide an example, and if not I understand.

You understand?

 

[BitterPill]

You understand?

Perhaps you can provide an example.

 

[Cephus]

There's no such thing as a totally free society, nor should there be. A totally free society would be anarchy.

 

[SCitizen]

Yes, freedom goes both ways, and social media sites and businesses have the right to freedom of association.

What would be your remedy to this situation?

As long as there is a strong and active Libertarian force, at least some Social Media sites will find it more profitable to have Libertarian policies.

Once more then 50% of Americans become intolerant Liberals there is no remedy.

 

[SCitizen]

In relatively wide swathes of Europe the situation is already very much on its way to the situation described. This is happening well supported by the populations albeit acting on populist arguments.

Definitely. If 80% of population are against Free Speech then in a Democracy their voice is The Law.

 

[spud_meister]

As long as there is a strong and active Libertarian force, at least some Social Media sites will find it more profitable to have Libertarian policies.

Once more then 50% of Americans become intolerant Liberals there is no remedy.

Social change always happens. Once upon a time saying you were an atheist got the reaction you describe in the OP in many parts of the US.

 

[joG]

Perhaps you can provide an example.

Pull up the Böhmermann case just now underway as an example. The latest development there is that a court has forbidden a number of the sentences in his satire about Erdogan. But laws against insult, incitement, hate speech, Auschwitz lie etc, etc are liberally and selectively applied quite often with heavy fines and jail in some cases.

 

[Ntharotep]

1984 is not freedom in any way, shape, or form...
You don't have that option in the poll.

Also, once you go down the road of banning anything that can be offensive to someONE then you go down the road of madness.

 

[Grand Mal]

This is a hypothetical and yet very likely society. We call it USA 2026. The First Amendment is still the Law.

There is a large list of proscribed opinions, books, movies, music videos which are offensive to Liberals for different reasons. The laws prohibit neither the media nor individuals to use these materials offensive to Liberals. Yet, by now

-- All major Social Media sites have been pressured to ban anyone expressing proscribed opinions

-- Any individual publicly expressing proscribed opinions is added to the Blacklist. Most companies would not dare to hire blacklisted individuals.

-- Laws against offensive speech are enforced much more strongly in UK 2026 then in USA 2026.

Sounds very '50's, very McCarthyesque.

 

[earthworm]

As long as man misbehaves and acts against society there will be limitations, rules, and laws .. Conservatives and libertarians 1 do not seem to be able to accept this ..And, this has NOTHING to do with ''liberals" ..Asinine to think that only liberals can be offended by repulsiveness..

 

[Mr Person]

This is a hypothetical and yet very likely society. We call it USA 2026. The First Amendment is still the Law.

There is a large list of proscribed opinions, books, movies, music videos which are offensive to Liberals for different reasons. The laws prohibit neither the media nor individuals to use these materials offensive to Liberals. Yet, by now

-- All major Social Media sites have been pressured to ban anyone expressing proscribed opinions

-- Any individual publicly expressing proscribed opinions is added to the Blacklist. Most companies would not dare to hire blacklisted individuals.

-- Laws against offensive speech are enforced much more strongly in UK 2026 then in USA 2026.

I'd answer except that this is a blatant anti-liberal bait thread.

You could just as well talk about things prescribed by conservatives, like declaring that you are trans, like stopping businesses from refusing to serve gay people, like prohibiting facebook from having anything but an absolutely neutral facebook feed.

Bait threads are lame.

 

[SCitizen]

I'd answer except that this is a blatant anti-liberal bait thread.

Sadly, Liberals do take many steps in the direction described. I did not include any unrealistic situations -- like repealing the First Amendment.

 

[BitterPill]

Sadly, Liberals do take many steps in the direction described. I did not include any unrealistic situations -- like repealing the First Amendment.

Like Trump's advisor suggesting Trump pull CNN's FCC license. Is that the sort of thing you're talking about?