Is Howard Dean the right man to lead the Democratic Party?

[Navy Pride]

Your question is "Is Howard Dean the right man to lead the Democratic Party?" It's not whether Howard Dean is the right man for the Republican party. That's all I was saying. What's funny is I was actually very surprised when I voted and saw the % of "yes" votes. I wanted to see honest answers about what people think about how he affects the democrats only.

Navy Pride, I totally agree. Those statements are a complete turnoff, even to democrats, although it won't make them switch sides. You'd catch a lot more bees with honey. I just don't know what happened to him. I am hoping he goes back to how he was when he was speaking on behalf of Kerry, but somehow I doubt it. *sigh*

Again I apologize for skewing the poll........

I personally don't think he can go back to time nor do I think he wants too...........The far left of the democratic party which is the base love those typre of comments......You hear them praising Dean all the time for them..........Your party needs to court the moderate voters and Dean is not them an to do that.........

 

[Navy Pride]

Well, like I said, I'm having dinner with the man tonight. Maybe I'll ask him about some of those over the top statements.

That is he problem.........He does not think they are over the top........

 

[aps]

Again I apologize for skewing the poll........

I personally don't think he can go back to time nor do I think he wants too...........The far left of the democratic party which is the base love those typre of comments......You hear them praising Dean all the time for them..........Your party needs to court the moderate voters and Dean is not them an to do that.........

All is forgiven, Navy Pride. The disappointment balloon has deflated.

 

[Navy Pride]

All is forgiven, Navy Pride. The disappointment balloon has deflated.

Thank you aps...I wish all of your liberal friends were as reasonable as you are.......:cheers: :applaud

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

I think the main points are:

1. The NATO alliance suffered ZERO casualties in Kosovo
2. We weren't lied to about the reasons to go to war. i.e. Iraq=Bin Laden
3. We had an exit strategy
4. The administration remained fiscally responsible during the war in Kosovo

As for Dean being a loose cannon - yeah I agree. That's why I love him! He get's pi**ed off sometimes. Me too!

The Kosovo conflict was a joke we may have declared victory but we did not achieve it, Clinton said to the enemy that we will not deploy ground troops no matter what, what kind of a message is that to send to your enemy: it's basically saying that if you hold out we'll leave, not to mention the fact that the estimated enemy casualties and weapons destroyed by U.S. bombings were grossly overexaggerated due to the fact that we hit many of the same targets over and over again and in most cases didn't hit the targets at all due to good camoflauge. Exit strategy? We never entered in the first place. Milosovich has still yet to be held accountable for his crimes and the presidential elect was recently assassinated.

 

[UtahBill]

What both parties need is serious minded, level headed, moderately leaning leaders and candidates. They need to be able to tell the extremists in their party that their pet peeves are not going to be solved at the expense of, or before, the more serious issues. Both sides are yellow liquid stuff-poor at prioritizing.

Instead of shotgunning all issues at once, put the lesser ones on the back burner until Congress has made a valiant effort at the more important ones. Certainly the nation's economy, our children's education, and social welfare of our citizens are more important than gay marriage, overturning Roe-Wade, saving a few acres of wetlands, etc.

And no issues get solved by bashing the other side for minor issues, or outright lying about them.

Dean has made some stupid remarks, and the media loves repeating stupid remarks. They really love GWB! He is a never ending source of stupid remarks.

I find it hard to believe we can't find some candidates who are able to represent the majority of us without sinking to the levels on rudeness and stupidity that we have been witnessing for a long time.

Could it be that the party leaderships are still stuck on "promoting the senior guy" instead of looking deeper within their own party to find someone who can better represent the wants and needs of all of us?

The system is broken, and it can't get up, especially when the mouthpieces spend too much time on "getting it up" to screw the other side.:shock:

 

[Navy Pride]

The Kosovo conflict was a joke we may have declared victory but we did not achieve it, Clinton said to the enemy that we will not deploy ground troops no matter what, what kind of a message is that to send to your enemy: it's basically saying that if you hold out we'll leave, not to mention the fact that the estimated enemy casualties and weapons destroyed by U.S. bombings were grossly overexaggerated due to the fact that we hit many of the same targets over and over again and in most cases didn't hit the targets at all due to good camoflauge. Exit strategy? We never entered in the first place. Milosovich has still yet to be held accountable for his crimes and the presidential elect was recently assassinated.

Wewere also going to be out of Kosovo in a year...........How long has it been now?

 

[aps]

Thank you aps...I wish all of your liberal friends were as reasonable as you are.......:cheers: :applaud

What a great compliment, Navy Pride! I really appreciate it. I feel the same way about you. :bright:

 

[SixStringHero]

What both parties need is serious minded, level headed, moderately leaning leaders and candidates. They need to be able to tell the extremists in their party that their pet peeves are not going to be solved at the expense of, or before, the more serious issues. Both sides are yellow liquid stuff-poor at prioritizing.

Instead of shotgunning all issues at once, put the lesser ones on the back burner until Congress has made a valiant effort at the more important ones. Certainly the nation's economy, our children's education, and social welfare of our citizens are more important than gay marriage, overturning Roe-Wade, saving a few acres of wetlands, etc.

And no issues get solved by bashing the other side for minor issues, or outright lying about them.

Dean has made some stupid remarks, and the media loves repeating stupid remarks. They really love GWB! He is a never ending source of stupid remarks.

I find it hard to believe we can't find some candidates who are able to represent the majority of us without sinking to the levels on rudeness and stupidity that we have been witnessing for a long time.

Could it be that the party leaderships are still stuck on "promoting the senior guy" instead of looking deeper within their own party to find someone who can better represent the wants and needs of all of us?

The system is broken, and it can't get up, especially when the mouthpieces spend too much time on "getting it up" to screw the other side.:shock:

This is the most intelligent post in this whole topic and I agree with about 97 percent of it. Everyone leans too far to the left or to the right in this country anymore and most people are brainwashed to the point of idiocy.

I don't agree with the implication that Bush is stupid, but then again I'm coming from the point of view that being articulate isn't synonymous with intelligence. I find it insulting that Americans believe the president of the US could be an "idiot."
He even received better grades than Kerry, but I guess than makes Kerry an idiot too?

 

[aps]

This is the most intelligent post in this whole topic and I agree with about 97 percent of it. Everyone leans too far to the left or to the right in this country anymore and most people are brainwashed to the point of idiocy.

I don't agree with the implication that Bush is stupid, but then again I'm coming from the point of view that being articulate isn't synonymous with intelligence. I find it insulting that Americans believe the president of the US could be an "idiot."
He even received better grades than Kerry, but I guess than makes Kerry an idiot too?

I think when people call Bush "stupid," they mean it more as a figure of speech. I am not one who puts a lot of importance on grades. But I will say this--I want a president who is smarter than I am, which, in my personal opinion is not the case right now. I am not some scholar by any means, but based upon what I have seen of Bush, I have reached this opinion.

 

[Navy Pride]

What a great compliment, Navy Pride! I really appreciate it. I feel the same way about you. :bright:

Now lets not get to mushy here.........:blushing: Your a liberal and I am a conservative and I am sure we will have many future disagreements on issues...Hopefully we can both remain civil with one another.........I will try......:wink3:

 

[Navy Pride]

I think when people call Bush "stupid," they mean it more as a figure of speech. I am not one who puts a lot of importance on grades. But I will say this--I want a president who is smarter than I am, which, in my personal opinion is not the case right now. I am not some scholar by any means, but based upon what I have seen of Bush, I have reached this opinion.

I think I posted in another thread how I feel......If it was in this one I apologize..

That said our left wing friends have continued to underestimate this president since he was first elected in 2000......Its true that he is not comfortable in public speaking but then neither am I.....That does not make him dumb though..He is just and old country boy like me who would rather talk things over a beer then listen to a bunch of sharks at a press conference....

You can't be a dummy and graduate from and Ivy League university............

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Wewere also going to be out of Kosovo in a year...........How long has it been now?

That's what happens when you let politicians run a war according to poll numbers.

 

[hipsterdufus]

My Dinner With Howard

hipsterdufus, I would LOVE for you to say something. I am sure others have mentioned this, but maybe with enough expressions of concern, he will re-think what he says. The man is brilliant, and he is an excellent speaker. So he has the capability of leading the democratic party.

There was a great article some time ago in the NYT, where the author was giving recommendations to the democrats on how to state their positions. One of them was the whole pro-choice issue. He said that such label makes people think we support abortion, as opposed to a woman's right to choose. What we should be doing is talking about educating women on contraceptives and how we can LIMIT abortions in this country while still supporting their right to choose.

Well, I did have a chance to ask Governer Dean about those over the top remarks. His point was that most of the quotes that are floating around are part of "Out of context theatre" So my charge is to look for the entire text of those comments. I'll revisit that when I have more info.

Anyway - Dr. Dean was quite inspriring last night! Of course some red meat for a partisan crowd - mostly about taking over Santorum's seat.

Here are some of the highlights, which I believe will be coming out soon in a platform type posistion he articulated these on "This Week" which I've quoted below.

"...Honesty in government will be one of them; balancing the budget and restoring jobs another; a health care system that benefits everybody a third one. Strong education system to give opportunity to all Americans again....We believe that we ought to have a decent public education system and the president ought to stop taking money away from it...Balance the budget after the most fiscally imprudent Administration in my lifetime, then restore the social safety net for middle class Americans that is being shredded by an Administration who says one thing and does something else...We want ethics legislation and campaign finance reform and health care reform. We will be the party of change, and we're serious about this and Democrats will have to live by these changes just like Republicans. We want fundamental reform in the United States."

My favorite part of the night was when the Gov said that Dems should not resort to running on wedge issues: i.e. gay marriage. All it does is divide the country - heck just look at the posts in here!

A good time was had by all!

 

[hipsterdufus]

He is just and old country boy like me who would rather talk things over a beer then listen to a bunch of sharks at a press conference....

You can't be a dummy and graduate from and Ivy League university............

To stoop so low as to say the great qualifier in a president is who you would like to have a beer with....

I would like the president to be 1,000 times smarter than the average American. Not just bubba scrachtin' his crotch, wachin' nascar and suckin' down a few could ones.

Hey, but I'm a dreamer.....:roll:

 

[aps]

Now lets not get to mushy here.........:blushing: Your a liberal and I am a conservative and I am sure we will have many future disagreements on issues...Hopefully we can both remain civil with one another.........I will try......:wink3:

*Sigh* So you're not trying to have a cyber affair with me after all? :boohoo: How could you lead me on this way?

Ha ha ha ha, Navy Pride. I am totally kidding. We can pat each other on the back in one thread and tear each other apart in another thread (although I doubt you are capable of tearing me apart the way I could tear you apart ).

 

[aps]

Re: My Dinner With Howard

Well, I did have a chance to ask Governer Dean about those over the top remarks. His point was that most of the quotes that are floating around are part of "Out of context theatre" So my charge is to look for the entire text of those comments. I'll revisit that when I have more info.

Anyway - Dr. Dean was quite inspriring last night! Of course some red meat for a partisan crowd - mostly about taking over Santorum's seat.

Here are some of the highlights, which I believe will be coming out soon in a platform type posistion he articulated these on "This Week" which I've quoted below.

"...Honesty in government will be one of them; balancing the budget and restoring jobs another; a health care system that benefits everybody a third one. Strong education system to give opportunity to all Americans again....We believe that we ought to have a decent public education system and the president ought to stop taking money away from it...Balance the budget after the most fiscally imprudent Administration in my lifetime, then restore the social safety net for middle class Americans that is being shredded by an Administration who says one thing and does something else...We want ethics legislation and campaign finance reform and health care reform. We will be the party of change, and we're serious about this and Democrats will have to live by these changes just like Republicans. We want fundamental reform in the United States."

My favorite part of the night was when the Gov said that Dems should not resort to running on wedge issues: i.e. gay marriage. All it does is divide the country - heck just look at the posts in here!

A good time was had by all!

Hipster, I am so happy you came back to tell us how last night went. I was hoping you would.

Yes, I know many of his statements are taken out of context, but still, the sentences that people harp on are those with very strong negative words. He doesn't need to say he hates all republicans and what they stand for. He can say, "I have a hard time understanding the issues the republicans support for these reasons....."

I am glad you had a good time last night.

I would like the president to be 1,000 times smarter than the average American. Not just bubba scrachtin' his crotch, wachin' nascar and suckin' down a few could ones.

OMG, this is hysterical. That is how I feel too, hipster. This wording is just priceless.

Navy Pride, I agree--Bush would probably be fun to have a beer with, but the same can be said about Clinton. Clinton is a charasmatic person, but he is also brilliant and unquestionably smarter than the majority of Americans.

My brother-in-law who speaks improper English said he likes Bush because he "talks like me." Oh brother.

 

[hipsterdufus]

Re: My Dinner With Howard

Hipster, I am so happy you came back to tell us how last night went. I was hoping you would.

Yes, I know many of his statements are taken out of context, but still, the sentences that people harp on are those with very strong negative words. He doesn't need to say he hates all republicans and what they stand for. He can say, "I have a hard time understanding the issues the republicans support for these reasons....."

I am glad you had a good time last night.

I would like the president to be 1,000 times smarter than the average American. Not just bubba scrachtin' his crotch, wachin' nascar and suckin' down a few could ones.

OMG, this is hysterical. That is how I feel too, hipster. This wording is just priceless.

Navy Pride, I agree--Bush would probably be fun to have a beer with, but the same can be said about Clinton. Clinton is a charasmatic person, but he is also brilliant and unquestionably smarter than the majority of Americans.

My brother-in-law who speaks improper English said he likes Bush because he "talks like me." Oh brother.

I would estimate that the president's command of the english language is at about a 7th grade level.

 

[aps]

Re: My Dinner With Howard

I would estimate that the president's command of the english language is at about a 7th grade level.

Oh, hipster, you misunderestimate him.

 

[kal-el]

Re: My Dinner With Howard

Oh, hipster, you misunderestimate him.

Yes, another one of Bush's idiotic catch phrases. What the hell is he gonna do without his "brain" Carl Rove? Cause whenever he opens his mouth, it proves how dumb he is.:2razz:

 

[Stinger]

I love the hate you all have....very enthralling.

Yeah and we are just as intralled with yours.

Dean's main job is to raise money for the Party, something he is exceptionally good at.

Really? Been reading the news lately, the Republicans are about double what Dean has raised.

No one votes for a candidate based on the head of the national party, no one. Do you think people are voting for Republicans because of Ken Mellman (isn't he gay)?

Their opinion of the party certainly influences their decission and Dean is responsible for that appearence. He speaks to the party political positions and of course he is the attack dog.

No matter how much you guys love to hate Dean

No more or less than you "love to hate" Bush I guess, actually probably less. But why do you engage in the childish tactic of saying the other side is wrong because they "are filled with hate", it's really silly.

the bottom line is that Dean doesn't set policy, isn't on any ballots and he does helluva job bringing in the green...which is what he's supposed to do.

To believe he does not influence policy and which policies will be advanced is folly.

Don't you get it? The Republican zealots in this forum and in this country are never going to vote for a Democrat so your zeal is misguided, totally, again.

Probably no more chance of that than the Democrat zealots in this forum voting for Republicans, bit independent voters like me are certainly swayed by what direction Dean takes the party in and that fact that he is selected to head the party.

The question itself is idiotic, plain dumb, completely stupid...but then again consider who started this thread?

Hmmm stating that asking if Dean is the right man to head the party is "idiotic, plain dumb, completely stupid", I think that statement is "idiotic, plain dumb, completely stupid" considering this is a political debate forum.

 

[kal-el]

Originally posted by aps
My brother-in-law who speaks improper English said he likes Bush because he "talks like me." Oh brother.

:rofl......

 

[hipsterdufus]

Re: My Dinner With Howard

Oh, hipster, you misunderestimate him.

Exactly!

We look forward to hearing your vision, so we can more better do our job. That's what I'm telling you." —George W. Bush, Gulfport, Miss., Sept. 20, 2005

"If it were to rain a lot, there is concern from the Army Corps of Engineers that the levees might break. And so, therefore, we're cautious about encouraging people to return at this moment of history." —George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Sept. 19, 2005

"Listen, I want to thank leaders of the — in the faith — faith-based and community-based community for being here." —George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Sept. 6, 2005

"So please give cash money to organizations that are directly involved in helping save lives — save the life who had been affected by Hurricane Katrina." —George W. Bush, Washington D.C., Sept. 6, 2005

"I can't wait to join you in the joy of welcoming neighbors back into neighborhoods, and small businesses up and running, and cutting those ribbons that somebody is creating new jobs." —George W. Bush, Poplarville, Miss., Sept. 5, 2005

"And Brownie, you're doing a heck of a job." —George W. Bush, to FEMA director Michael Brown Sept. 2, 2005

 

[Deegan]

Re: My Dinner With Howard

Exactly!

We look forward to hearing your vision, so we can more better do our job. That's what I'm telling you." —George W. Bush, Gulfport, Miss., Sept. 20, 2005

"If it were to rain a lot, there is concern from the Army Corps of Engineers that the levees might break. And so, therefore, we're cautious about encouraging people to return at this moment of history." —George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Sept. 19, 2005

"Listen, I want to thank leaders of the — in the faith — faith-based and community-based community for being here." —George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Sept. 6, 2005

"So please give cash money to organizations that are directly involved in helping save lives — save the life who had been affected by Hurricane Katrina." —George W. Bush, Washington D.C., Sept. 6, 2005

"I can't wait to join you in the joy of welcoming neighbors back into neighborhoods, and small businesses up and running, and cutting those ribbons that somebody is creating new jobs." —George W. Bush, Poplarville, Miss., Sept. 5, 2005

"And Brownie, you're doing a heck of a job." —George W. Bush, to FEMA director Michael Brown Sept. 2, 2005

I can see the programming has been successful, did the food taste funny at all?:lol:

 

[Navy Pride]

*Sigh* So you're not trying to have a cyber affair with me after all? :boohoo: How could you lead me on this way?

Ha ha ha ha, Navy Pride. I am totally kidding. We can pat each other on the back in one thread and tear each other apart in another thread (although I doubt you are capable of tearing me apart the way I could tear you apart ).

Well my parents always told me to hold the the fairer sex on a pedestal and I have always tried to do that and will do it here although sometimes although sometimes it is a little difficult with my friend Kelzie (just kidding :lol ........

Not sure the cyber affair thing would work since my wife of 40 years pretty much monitors my posting to this forum and gets a huge kick out of it........