Iran...

[Duke]

What nations have called for the destruction of their neighbors and are actively seeking nuclear weapons?

Well, I admit, I can't think of anything that fits that criteria. But I can think of one country that's not seeking nuclear weapons, that has nuclear weapons, and has called for the destruction of their neighbors...Israel, anybody? :2razz:


Duke

 

[Adrian]

Well, I admit, I can't think of anything that fits that criteria.

"Iran" was the correct answer.

But I can think of one country that's not seeking nuclear weapons, that has nuclear weapons, and has called for the destruction of their neighbors...Israel, anybody? :2razz:
Duke

When has Israel called for the destruction of its neighbors?

 

[Duke]

When has Israel called for the destruction of its neighbors?

Oh, allow me to correct myself: to my knowledge, Israel's never called for the destruction of their neighbors, instead they've activly tried to destroy them (read: Palestine, Lebanon). :2razz:

I would suggest that you guys are perhaps taking me seriously when I'm not serious, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.


Duke

 

[Adrian]

I would suggest that you guys are perhaps taking me seriously when I'm not serious,

Well, whenever you're ready, let me know when you're serious so I can know to take the time to respond.

 

[Gardener]

Are you asserting that Iran has been "been blathering on about their rationales for [detonating] such weapons"?

Rafsanjani laid it out pretty clearly.

 

[Duke]

Well, whenever you're ready, let me know when you're serious so I can know to take the time to respond.

I'll be sure to keep you posted, Adrian.


Duke

 

[Simon W. Moon]

Rafsanjani laid it out pretty clearly.

So, are you asserting that Iran has been "been blathering on about their rationales for [detonating] such weapons"?

 

[Gardener]

So, are you asserting that Iran has been "been blathering on about their rationales for [detonating] such weapons"?

RAFSANJANI SAYS MUSLIMS SHOULD USE NUCLEAR WEAPON AGAINST ISRAL

 

[EAGLE1]

Not meaning to offend anyone here but actually the US fits the bill of rogue nation quite nicely.

 

[Simon W. Moon]

RAFSANJANI SAYS MUSLIMS SHOULD USE NUCLEAR WEAPON AGAINST ISRAL

Actual quote is somewhat different than what the headline promises

"If a day comes when the world of Islam is duly equipped with the arms Israel has in possession, the strategy of colonialism would face a stalemate because application of an atomic bomb would not leave any thing in Israel but the same thing would just produce damages in the Muslim world", Ayatollah Ali Akbar Hashemi-Rafsanjani told the crowd at the traditional Friday prayers in Tehran.
​

And falls quite far short of "blathering on about their rationales for [detonating] such weapons". Instead he talks about "employing" them as strategic deterrents against "strategy of colonialism."

Which is, of course, different than wishing to detonate them.

Much as I suspected. Carry on.

 

[MSgt]

Not meaning to offend anyone here but actually the US fits the bill of rogue nation quite nicely.

Well, you are welcome to do something about it at any time. We're just across the ocean. You're also welcome to be led by Naziism, Communism, Islamo Fascism, and any other ideology that may be perfect enough for you, since America has failed you miserably.

We should be a rogue nation. Since we and other English speaking countries have led the way for so long and if we fail to lead the way, the screams of the anguished go unanswered, I would say that the problem is the global unification of injustice and apathy.

I've got no problem being a rogue from UN depravity.

 

[Gardener]

Actual quote is somewhat different than what the headline promises

"If a day comes when the world of Islam is duly equipped with the arms Israel has in possession, the strategy of colonialism would face a stalemate because application of an atomic bomb would not leave any thing in Israel but the same thing would just produce damages in the Muslim world", Ayatollah Ali Akbar Hashemi-Rafsanjani told the crowd at the traditional Friday prayers in Tehran.
​

And falls quite far short of "blathering on about their rationales for [detonating] such weapons". Instead he talks about "employing" them as strategic deterrents against "strategy of colonialism."

Which is, of course, different than wishing to detonate them.

Much as I suspected. Carry on.

What utter nonsense. Is it mendacity or naivete' at work here? You obviously missed this one :roll:


"Jews shall expect to be once again scattered and wandering around the globe the day when this appendix is extracted from the region and the Muslim world", Mr. Hashemi-Rafsanjani warned, blaming on the United States and Britain the "creation of the fabricated entity" in the heart of Arab and Muslim world.


I've got some great beachfront property in Florida if you are interested.

 

[EAGLE1]

Well, you are welcome to do something about it at any time. We're just across the ocean. You're also welcome to be led by Naziism, Communism, Islamo Fascism, and any other ideology that may be perfect enough for you, since America has failed you miserably.

We should be a rogue nation. Since we and other English speaking countries have led the way for so long and if we fail to lead the way, the screams of the anguished go unanswered, I would say that the problem is the global unification of injustice and apathy.

I've got no problem being a rogue from UN depravity.

OK you're fine with that then Gunny? Good so am I. We agree. Therefore given that the US and even others such as the UK are 'rogue' nations then surely itd be silly of us to complain about other 'rogue' nations?

Or why dont we all just admit that might is right and we'll bomb who the hell we want and those that dont like it can lump it. Lets have no more complaints like 'he's evil, she's evil. We gotta do something for the good of the world'. Lets just kill however the **** we want, and stop all this moral posturting as the waste of time it is, right?

 

[MSgt]

OK you're fine with that then Gunny? Good so am I. We agree. Therefore given that the US and even others such as the UK are 'rogue' nations then surely itd be silly of us to complain about other 'rogue' nations?

Umm...no. This is real life. We have enemies. Enemies that wpon't and don't hesitate to kill us and therefore we should meet their tenacity with greater tenacity. It has always been the "rogue" nations that have faced off with one another. The difference is that we are stronger, more willfull, and offer something far more humane with victory. All the while, "the pack" sit by and complain wildly about imperfection in our successes, which the pack benefits.

Or why dont we all just admit that might is right and we'll bomb who the hell we want and those that dont like it can lump it.

That's pretty much it. "Might is right" in many situations. Ain't life grand when you belong to the mighty? However, you greatly exaggerate the situation. Number the countries in the world that has been "bombed" versus all the countries that have defied or refrained from democracy.

Lets have no more complaints like 'he's evil, she's evil. We gotta do something for the good of the world'. Lets just kill however the **** we want, and stop all this moral posturting as the waste of time it is, right?

Wrong. Are you trying to state that morallity is black and white? That history's proof that peace and freedom doesn't come without the use of a gun is false? That Naziism, Stalinistic and Mao-istic Communism, and Islamo-fascism is on the same plain as Democracy in terms of morality?

The world is grey and smokey. We should be thankful that English speaking countries try to make it clear.

 

[Simon W. Moon]

What utter nonsense. Is it mendacity or naivete' at work here? You obviously missed this one

I've got some great beachfront property in Florida if you are interested.

Glad you are so enthralled with me. Anything else about me you'd care to add to the debate?

Btw, as a side note, is there anything about the subject of the thread you have to add?

 

[Gardener]

Glad you are so enthralled with me. Anything else about me you'd care to add to the debate?

Btw, as a side note, is there anything about the subject of the thread you have to add?

I'm not the one who is indulging in dishonesty here. You are.

As such, you are the one who is adding nothing -- nothing beyond the denial of a truth you are unwilling to acknowlege, the motivation for which is known only to yourself. I could always speculate on WHY your need to deny runs so strong , but that would be fruitless since I do not know the reasons for your lack of honesty here.

 

[Simon W. Moon]

I'm not the one who is indulging in dishonesty here. You are.

As such, you are the one who is adding nothing -- nothing beyond the denial of a truth you are unwilling to acknowlege, the motivation for which is known only to yourself. I could always speculate on WHY your need to deny runs so strong , but that would be fruitless since I do not know the reasons for your lack of honesty here.

Wow, you have some real issues w/ me. Who mentioned dishonesty?

Please feel free to expound on these issues in a pm to me or another mod or in another thread in the appropriate forum.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Well, I admit, I can't think of anything that fits that criteria. But I can think of one country that's not seeking nuclear weapons, that has nuclear weapons, and has called for the destruction of their neighbors...Israel, anybody? :2razz:


Duke

When did Israel call for the destruction of its neighbors? You aint nothin' but a lier.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Oh, allow me to correct myself: to my knowledge, Israel's never called for the destruction of their neighbors, instead they've activly tried to destroy them (read: Palestine, Lebanon). :2razz:

Umm no they haven't, had they wished to they would have.

 

[EAGLE1]

Umm...no. This is real life. We have enemies. Enemies that wpon't and don't hesitate to kill us and therefore we should meet their tenacity with greater tenacity. It has always been the "rogue" nations that have faced off with one another. The difference is that we are stronger, more willfull, and offer something far more humane with victory. All the while, "the pack" sit by and complain wildly about imperfection in our successes, which the pack benefits.

Yes Gunny exactly, this is real life. No more computer wars, no more fire and forget. Its real and America's been finding out for the last few years, you know death, injury soldiers and innocents alike.
So we're all admitting here that the US is a rogue nation it seems. So why use the term rogue as a justification to invade Iran?
Something more humane with victory? Thats sounds nice..I suppose after Iraq the people of the West should rest assured that the next Coalition of the willing will get it right this time eh?

That's pretty much it. "Might is right" in many situations. Ain't life grand when you belong to the mighty? However, you greatly exaggerate the situation. Number the countries in the world that has been "bombed" versus all the countries that have defied or refrained from democracy.

Your sure right, life is indeed grand when you belong to the mighty. Im sure Hitler, Chairman Mao, Stalin etc etc would agree with you about might equaling right.

Wrong. Are you trying to state that morallity is black and white? That history's proof that peace and freedom doesn't come without the use of a gun is false? That Naziism, Stalinistic and Mao-istic Communism, and Islamo-fascism is on the same plain as Democracy in terms of morality?

The world is grey and smokey. We should be thankful that English speaking countries try to make it clear.

Wow, first might is right, now whats right is all shades of grey? Sure you know what you want to say here?
English speaking countries try to make it clear? Huh? There you again Gunny. Your forcing me to spend time refuting an obvious falsehood, so I'll just assume you meant something different.

 

[EAGLE1]

Umm no they haven't, had they wished to they would have.

Hmm what does building settlements across the West Bank and Gaza amount to then if not to build Israel over Palestine? Not to mention all the other land already in Israel.

 

[MSgt]

So we're all admitting here that the US is a rogue nation it seems. So why use the term rogue as a justification to invade Iran?

I don't know. I don't care about any "rogue" status.

Something more humane with victory? Thats sounds nice..I suppose after Iraq the people of the West should rest assured that the next Coalition of the willing will get it right this time eh?

No idea what this even means.

Your sure right, life is indeed grand when you belong to the mighty. Im sure Hitler, Chairman Mao, Stalin etc etc would agree with you about might equaling right.

Well, according to your current life style out from under Hitler, Chairman Mao, Stalin, etc. you would agree. Get off your sanctimonious perch and stop pretending that you owe your freedom to Gandhi. You owe it to death, destruction, and power. You owe it to might.

Wow, first might is right, now whats right is all shades of grey? Sure you know what you want to say here?

Explain to me how your freedom came without might? Perhaps this rediculous pacifist "hug your enemy to death" works in a dream world, but like I stated..this is real life.

English speaking countries try to make it clear? Huh? There you again Gunny. Your forcing me to spend time refuting an obvious falsehood, so I'll just assume you meant something different.

Why don't you assume some reality. Europe's current round of pacifist dress up was enabled by America's protection during the Cold War. We allowed our European wards to get away with a minimum number of chores. The United States did (and still does) the dirty work, seconded by our direct ancestor, Britian. For almost a century the work of freedom and global security has been handled by the Anglolateral alliance born of a struggle againts the tyranny of continental European philosophies hatched on the Rhine and Danube.

 

[Adrian]

Hmm what does building settlements across the West Bank and Gaza amount to then if not to build Israel over Palestine? Not to mention all the other land already in Israel.

The building of settlements is a contentious issue between Israeli Jews, and has long been recognized as an inflammatory point in Palestinian-Israeli relations. The sad truth is that just as Palestinians are used as pawns by the Arabs, so too are settlers used as bargaining chips by the Israelis: give us what we want, and we'll restrain our settlers.

As for the "all the other land already in Israel" comment, you need to bone up on your Israeli history. Israel first began with Jews legitimately buying up then-worthless land from Arab land holders. The Arabs only became alarmed after the Jews made the land they bought agriculturally arable.

 

[EAGLE1]

I don't know. I don't care about any "rogue" status.

Well you may not but it was posited before you came in that Iran is a 'rogue' nation and Im just clearing up who's rogue around here.

No idea what this even means

No idea eh? Back to grammar school then.

Well, according to your current life style out from under Hitler, Chairman Mao, Stalin, etc. you would agree. Get off your sanctimonious perch and stop pretending that you owe your freedom to Gandhi. You owe it to death, destruction, and power. You owe it to might.

Sure I owe my freedom to might. But Gunny, plenty of other people owe their lack of liberty to might also dont they?! Thank you.

Explain to me how your freedom came without might? Perhaps this rediculous pacifist "hug your enemy to death" works in a dream world, but like I stated..this is real life.

Sorry mate but you said it. Might, like most swords, is double edged and therefore its not necessarily right. Thats what you really mean isnt it?

Why don't you assume some reality. Europe's current round of pacifist dress up was enabled by America's protection during the Cold War. We allowed our European wards to get away with a minimum number of chores. The United States did (and still does) the dirty work, seconded by our direct ancestor, Britian. For almost a century the work of freedom and global security has been handled by the Anglolateral alliance born of a struggle againts the tyranny of continental European philosophies hatched on the Rhine and Danube.
__________________

Would you like me to list the many non english speaking countries that have assisted our various wars, campaigns and foreign policies over the years?

 

[EAGLE1]

The building of settlements is a contentious issue between Israeli Jews, and has long been recognized as an inflammatory point in Palestinian-Israeli relations. The sad truth is that just as Palestinians are used as pawns by the Arabs, so too are settlers used as bargaining chips by the Israelis: give us what we want, and we'll restrain our settlers.

Fair enough. Dont see a problem with that analysis. So Israel is indeed detroying another nation by the building of settlements. Many thanks for your insight.

As for the "all the other land already in Israel" comment, you need to bone up on your Israeli history. Israel first began with Jews legitimately buying up then-worthless land from Arab land holders. The Arabs only became alarmed after the Jews made the land they bought agriculturally arable.

Ok I'll give you that many properties were indeed already bought by Jews. Thats fair. However, many were'nt. Agreed?