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Illegal Immigrates rights?

Urethra Franklin

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DeMaxx said:
. My analogy would be like someone writing a book on how it feels to live through a hurricane when they live in Minnesota and have never been near a hurricane. If you want to know it feels to live through a hurricane ask someone that lives in Florida not Minnesota.

I see so many threads where people just come in to start an argument. If thats someones reason. Then thats not intelligent and i don't welcome it. DeMaxx
That's an extremely poor analogy in my view, as it relates to experience only, and you're essentially saying that the only valid evidence is anecdotal evidence. Do you believe you have to have given birth yourself to be a good obstetrician? To have had cancer yourself to be a good oncology nurse? To be a priest to have an opinion about the church? A Minnesota meteorologist would give me a better understanding of hurricaines than the Florida bank clerk, who may be able to describe his own experience and nothing more: both points of view valid and complementary to each other.
Naughty Nurse raised very valid points which your fellow countryman was unable to address, instead dismissing him as an "English nurse" rather rudely, as if being English meant he had no right to comment (he doesn't have to live in the US to have an opinion on US domestic politics - enough of you United Statesians comment on Europe, often incorrectly, but you're entitled to your view since in Europe we genuinely believe in freedom of speech and don't just pay lip service to it); and I don't get his point about Naughty being a nurse. As a nurse he's an educated, professional person. I've worked in the UK health service - they have a highly educated nursing workforce, usually educated to masters level. Perhaps unlike your intellectually insecure compatriot, Naughty doesn't feel the need to boast about his university attendances in his profile.
 

Stherngntlmn

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Urethra Franklin said:
Naughty Nurse raised very valid points which your fellow countryman was unable to address
his only related comment to anything in this topic was towards the existance of a vaccine... which had absolutely NOTHING to do with the illegal immigration topic at hand.

Urethra Franklin said:
instead dismissing him as an "English nurse" rather rudely, as if being English meant he had no right to comment (he doesn't have to live in the US to have an opinion on US domestic politics - enough of you United Statesians comment on Europe, often incorrectly, but you're entitled to your view since in Europe we genuinely believe in freedom of speech and don't just pay lip service to it); and I don't get his point about Naughty being a nurse. As a nurse he's an educated, professional person. I've worked in the UK health service - they have a highly educated nursing workforce, usually educated to masters level.
I never claimed that he was anything other than supremely educated in medical knowledge... medical knowdledge was not the topic in this thread though... illegal immigration was, and I should not have made it sound like he had no right to comment, I was wrong, and just aggitated at the fact that he pulled detail out of my post to get smug with me about a correction, without actually addressing the point of my post.

Urethra Franklin said:
Perhaps unlike your intellectually insecure compatriot, Naughty doesn't feel the need to boast about his university attendances in his profile.
I'm very proud of my educational experience, and a profile is a place to list important things in your life. My college experience is important to me.
 

Urethra Franklin

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Stherngntlmn said:
I should not have made it sound like he had no right to comment, I was wrong, and just aggitated .

Are we to deduce from that that you'll do the right thing and offer him an apology?


Stherngntlmn said:
I'm very proud of my educational experience, and a profile is a place to list important things in your life. My college experience is important to me.
I detect insecurity.
 

Stherngntlmn

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Urethra Franklin said:
Are we to deduce from that that you'll do the right thing and offer him an aplogy?
That would be between me and him, and no business of yours
Urethra Franklin said:
I detect insecurity.
what you "detect" is of no concern to me
 

Urethra Franklin

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Stherngntlmn said:
That would be between me and him, and no business of yours
If that's the case, you should have carried out your unjustified attack in a PM and not in the open forum.



Stherngntlmn said:
what you "detect" is of no concern to me
Point proven. Case rested.
 

DeMaxx

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Urethra Franklin said:
That's an extremely poor analogy in my view, as it relates to experience only, and you're essentially saying that the only valid evidence is anecdotal evidence. Do you believe you have to have given birth yourself to be a good obstetrician? To have had cancer yourself to be a good oncology nurse? To be a priest to have an opinion about the church? A Minnesota meteorologist would give me a better understanding of hurricaines than the Florida bank clerk, who may be able to describe his own experience and nothing more: both points of view valid and complementary to each other.
Naughty Nurse raised very valid points which your fellow countryman was unable to address, instead dismissing him as an "English nurse" rather rudely, as if being English meant he had no right to comment (he doesn't have to live in the US to have an opinion on US domestic politics - enough of you United Statesians comment on Europe, often incorrectly, but you're entitled to your view since in Europe we genuinely believe in freedom of speech and don't just pay lip service to it); and I don't get his point about Naughty being a nurse. As a nurse he's an educated, professional person. I've worked in the UK health service - they have a highly educated nursing workforce, usually educated to masters level. Perhaps unlike your intellectually insecure compatriot, Naughty doesn't feel the need to boast about his university attendances in his profile.
I have never said a word about Naughty being a nurse nor do I have an opinion on that, or his education. I know alot of very educated people that are very brillant in their field, but don't have enough sense to come in out of the rain.

This is the reason for what I said.


Originally Posted by Naughty Nurse

If your beloved GWB won't make the necessary investment to adequately protect your borders, you will get these problems.

Too much money spent murdering innocent Iraqis?
This statement is A nonfactual statement that is meant to be be argumentative. I could say such as Tony Blair brought on the attacks on London by being in the Iraqi war. That statement would be wrong and it's not backed up with fact. The only purpose for such a statement is to be argumentative, and take a slap at another countries government. To those in London I'm not saying Tony Blair is responsible for the attacks that was an analogy.

I still stick with my analogy, a person can be the greatest obstetrician in the world but if they have never given birth they can truly tell you how it feels to give birth. And a oncology nurse may be a great care giver but will they know the pain of cancer if they have never had it. I had a family member die 3 years ago from brain cancer. I can tell you how it made me feel, I can tell you what I saw, but I can't tell you what they felt. I was with that person every day.

I'm living in an area that the immigration is very high and many of them are illegal. I see jobs being lost. I see whole communities that are now Hispanic communities, where 8 years ago they were a very well mixed communities. I'd say that I have more insight on the problem here in the U.S. than some one that is living over sea's and getting their information from the television.

I do agree that the U.S. needs to do more boarder control. Our problems with illegal immigrates started well before the Iraqi war. To even try to make that leap that the Iraqi war and illegal immigration are connected is argumentative at best.

If I was to go into a UK forum. ( And that would be interesting !) It would not be my place to spout off about the way they are running their government when I don't know what they are going through. I would never make argumentative statements, nor would I make statements without doing some research to see if any statement I made was factual. That is how one makes
intelligent debate. DeMaxx
 

Urethra Franklin

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DeMaxx said:
I have never said a word about Naughty being a nurse nor do I have an opinion on that, or his education.
I was referring to your compatriot, Mr. "I've been to university, big wow"
DeMaxx said:
I could say such as Tony Blair brought on the attacks on London by being in the Iraqi war. That statement would be wrong and it's not backed up with fact. The only purpose for such a statement is to be argumentative, and take a slap at another countries government.
No, you would be expressing your opinion as to why the London attacks happened. A very valid opinion, and probably the correct analysis of why what happened happened.
DeMaxx said:
I still stick with my analogy, a person can be the greatest obstetrician in the world but if they have never given birth they can truly tell you how it feels to give birth. And a oncology nurse may be a great care giver but will they know the pain of cancer if they have never had it. I had a family member die 3 years ago from brain cancer. I can tell you how it made me feel, I can tell you what I saw, but I can't tell you what they felt. I was with that person every day. .
That's undeniable, but would that cancer patient be able to tell you about the pharmacokinetics of their chemotherapy? Probably not. My point is that we don't base opinion purely on experience and anecdotal evidence - other points of view are valid, and often it takes an eye from the outside to be truly objective.

DeMaxx said:
I'm living in an area that the immigration is very high and many of them are illegal. I see jobs being lost. I see whole communities that are now Hispanic communities, where 8 years ago they were a very well mixed communities. I'd say that I have more insight on the problem here in the U.S. than some one that is living over sea's and getting their information from the television..
Please do remind us what happened to the original inhabitants of your fine nation?


DeMaxx said:
If I was to go into a UK forum. ( And that would be interesting !) It would not be my place to spout off about the way they are running their government when I don't know what they are going through. I would never make argumentative statements, nor would I make statements without doing some research to see if any statement I made was factual. That is how one makes
intelligent debate. DeMaxx
You'd have every right to your opinion. You basicaly don't believe in free speech, but as you're a United Statesian, that's not really surprising.
 

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Urethra Franklin said:
If that's the case, you should have carried out your unjustified attack in a PM and not in the open forum.
Gee thats what you did to me. I don't think I said any cross word to you.. or about your statments but you attacked me. The only thing I said that to naughty nurse was his statement was meant to argumentative. and if that was why he was here? I rather he go elsewhere.

I have made my case quite well. To make make make a leap like the Iraqi war to illegal immigration. Enough said. You have not won your argument. You have not made a point. You sound like another that instead of making intelligent debate your just looking for an argument. If thats so please find another thread. Because what does any of this have to do with illegal immgration. Nothing !! I have waisted enough of my time on this silliness. DeMaxx
 

Urethra Franklin

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DeMaxx said:
Gee thats what you did to me. I don't think I said any cross word to you.. or about your statments but you attacked me.

And unlike your compatriot, I'm not claiming it was nobody elses business; I accept that it is seeing as it was done in the open forum.
Do you actually read posts in their entirity and view them in context?


DeMaxx said:
I have waisted enough of my time on this silliness. DeMaxx
Well you've got that bit right.
 

DeMaxx

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Urethra Franklin said:
And unlike your compatriot, I'm not claiming it was nobody elses business; I accept that it is seeing as it was done in the open forum.
Do you actually read posts in their entirity and view them in context?




Well you've got that bit right.
Okay. Now to the subject. Do you have anything that you can say on illegal immigrate rights in the U.S..? Which is the Subject! and yes I do read all the comments in their entirity . DeMaxx
 

Urethra Franklin

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DeMaxx said:
Okay. Now to the subject. Do you have anything that you can say on illegal immigrate rights in the U.S..? Which is the Subject! and yes I do read all the comments in their entirity . DeMaxx
Perhaps you'd first like to answer the question I posed regarding what happened to the original inhabitants of your land, and then try to justify United Statesians getting uptight about Hispanics and others choosing to live there.
 

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What would be the use in making it illegal if you're just going to welcome over the criminals that break that law with open arms... ?

what about undocumented terrorists that might sneak in over the borders... are we supposed to welcome them to?

maybe chinese that sneak in through shipping ports possibly carrying bird flu which could outbreak into widespread plague... we supposed to hug them too?

How about when whole sections of border states start becoming unable to speak english... we just supposed to sitback and enjoy the novelty of the communications barrier in our own country?

How about the how about the documented and undocumented remitances and money that they send to other countries never to be seen in the american economy again... $30,000,000,000+/yr in documented funds alone are sent out of this country... never to be seen by an american business or paycheck again?

Are you really willing to risk your family's and countrymen's health, security, and financial stability just to let a person from a foreign country benefit off of flagrantly violating our laws because they were too impatient to go through legal channels to accomplish their immigration goal?
 

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Urethra Franklin said:
Perhaps you'd first like to answer the question I posed regarding what happened to the original inhabitants of your land, and then try to justify United Statesians getting uptight about Hispanics and others choosing to live there.
They now own multi-billion dollar casinos and operate them without paying taxes.
 

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Stherngntlmn said:
What would be the use in making it illegal if you're just going to welcome over the criminals that break that law with open arms... ?

what about undocumented terrorists that might sneak in over the borders... are we supposed to welcome them to?

maybe chinese that sneak in through shipping ports possibly carrying bird flu which could outbreak into widespread plague... we supposed to hug them too?

How about when whole sections of border states start becoming unable to speak english... we just supposed to sitback and enjoy the novelty of the communications barrier in our own country?

How about the how about the documented and undocumented remitances and money that they send to other countries never to be seen in the american economy again... $30,000,000,000+/yr in documented funds alone are sent out of this country... never to be seen by an american business or paycheck again?

Are you really willing to risk your family's and countrymen's health, security, and financial stability just to let a person from a foreign country benefit off of flagrantly violating our laws because they were too impatient to go through legal channels to accomplish their immigration goal?
I'm glad to see someone here know's what they are talking about.


First of all, this is sickening to me. Let me summarize every liberal argument connected to illegal immigration in our country. They deserve a better life, it is not their fault their country is in poverty [sob] so they deserve to come here and work and maybe if the United States was to help they wouldn't be a third world country [sob].' Oh yeah, it is America's fault that Mexico is in such bad shape, am I right?

They have every opportunity to come here legally, it's just sad how lazy they are that they cannot go through the legal process of becoming a United States citizen. But the test is to hard and it takes to much time [sob].

The argument should be why come here legally?' since it is much easier to jump a fence, take a job away from an American and send the proceeds back to Mexico.

Plus these people don't care to learn our language they believe that we should change our culture to fit theirs. They have no right to be here, it is costing us more to harbor them than they are contributing. Just because you have illegal friends, doesn't justify them being here.
 
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Urethra Franklin said:
Perhaps you'd first like to answer the question I posed regarding what happened to the original inhabitants of your land, and then try to justify United Statesians getting uptight about Hispanics and others choosing to live there.
I will be honest I have intentions to answer any of your post from this point on. To answer you only gives you reason more reason to argue. DeMaxx
 

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galenrox said:
How about this, keep it illegal, so then the only ones who are able to sneak in will be the ones the REALLY want it, but then once they're here, treat them with respect and understand all the good they do for our country!
I personally think we should treat all people with respect. but I also beleive that we have to protect ourselves. That means as a country also. I don't believe that other countries will take care of the U.S. that we have to do it for ourselves. People can come to this country legally for a number of reasons, and I welcome them. But how are we to keep up with who is in our country when there are large number of undocumented aliens I read that there is and estmated 400,000 illegal immigrates here in the state of North Carolina. thats alot of people that we really don't know anything about they could be murderers, have diease, or be very normal everyday people (I'm sure most are).

Not knowing who is in our country is a problem not to mention jobs, and the other things brought up in this thread. Demaxx
 

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galenrox said:
I think the only purpose keeping it illegal serves is making sure only the ones that really want to get in here get in here, and after that, wouldn't it only be logical to legitimize them, and then make them pay taxes? Because as long as they are, legally speaking, completely illegitimate, they only really have to pay taxes when they want to, and realisticly speaking, how many citizens WANT to pay their taxes, let alone people who don't have to, and the government views their presence here as illegitimate.
It would be logical to make Puerto Rico pay taxes, too... but they want all the US has to offer, and don't want to pay for it. Now apply that logic to an illegal immigrant, and you see the problem. People want something for nothing... and a society that allows that, is sure to fall.
 

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Of course Ilegal Immigrants have Rights.They have the Right to go back to wear they came from !!!
We should have the Right to send them there quickly !
I dont care if there are 10 or ten million. Send them back !
 

Urethra Franklin

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Stherngntlmn said:
They now own multi-billion dollar casinos and operate them without paying taxes.

What kind of dumb, retarded nation lets people get away with that?
Oh of course, the US.
 

Stherngntlmn

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Urethra Franklin said:
What kind of dumb, retarded nation lets people get away with that?
Oh of course, the US.
bwahaha someone who likes the EU called us "dumb" and "retarded"... that's hilarious.

This from the people that can't even make a decision on a constitution.
 
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